[Icedog_16]

Originally Posted by IamBatman

Electro Automotive: FAQ on Electric Car Efficiency & Pollution
also in the GridWorks link you posted, the 33% efficiency refers to large plants. later on in the next paragraph it mentions distributed energy facilities having the efficiency of 65-90% (as of 2001). you are also assuming all of the power generated by power plants use fossil fuels, there was a chart posted earlier that shows a large percentage of CA electricity is generated with renewable resources.

It would be nice if they showed where they got their figures as they don't jive with what I've seen and Aedo confirmed as much. According to this, Physics In an Automotive Engine, average efficiency is 21% and the most efficient engines are 25% (again, echoing what Aedo said). Looks like a case of twisting the facts to make a more palatable case for the EV.

With respect to the GridWorks link, you fail to mention that the 5600 distributed energy sites accounted for a mere 6% of US power generation, which is negligible. And I didn't assume the power plants used solely fossil fuels (it wasn't even my stat; it was the DoE's). They state:

Originally Posted by US DoE

An electric utility power station uses either a turbine, engine, water wheel, or other similar machine to drive an electric generator or a device that converts mechanical or chemical energy to generate electricity. Steam turbines, internal-combustion engines, gas combustion turbines, water turbines, and wind turbines are the most common methods to generate electricity. Most power plants are about 35 percent efficient. That means that for every 100 units of energy that go into a plant, only 35 units are converted to usable electrical energy.

What is Electricity?

Now what I would assume that they would have taken the various methods of generating power when coming up with that figure. BTW, nice crib from the ElectroAuto.com website. BTW, BTW, the majority of CA's electricity doesn't come from renewable energy even according to them.

Originally Posted by IamBatman

old school wind turbines make a lot of noise, and is actually dangerous in the colder areas because they throw ice as they spin. Then new generation of helical windmills don't have the noise issue, it maxes out at a moderate RPM, doesn't care which direction the wind blows, and looks pretty cool.
Helix Wind

Did you read the spec sheet on that turbine? I almost fell out of my chair when I did. Here it is: http://www.helixwind.com/download/fa...faqs041009.pdf It produces less than 1000 kWh/year with an average wind speed of 11 mph! Oh, and the kicker, it can be ALL YOURS for $11659+ depending on the height of the tower you need (HiWindPower Product 1).

Hint: It will take at least 100 years to break even on that unless you live in a hurricane. And you won't be charging your Tesla with that bad-boy, either.

Originally Posted by IamBatman

as far as efficiency, both solar and wind power is ready now. As I mentioned earlier, if a guy in foggy SF can make his old panel work, then it should work in a majority of the places. All it takes is to get the cost down and incentive for adoption.

Based on your turbine illustration, I beg to differ. I apparently missed your soggy SF solar anecdote somewhere; but, I'm sure there's more to the story (ie, cost, amount of electricity actually produced and realized, area of solar panels, etc.). These are simply not ready for prime-time - that's the realist in me talking again.