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JonOrangeElise · 10-13-2003, 10:23 PM

Randy and Matt G,

OK, I've done two car control clinics (with skid pads) and three driving schools (all in my E36 M3, all through the BMW CCA). I fully understand the basic concepts of understeer/oversteer on an intellectual level, and I'd say I've honed my skills enough *not* to panic and do something stupid (a la lifting while going in hot). I am also developing a feel for weight transfer, and loading/unloading different parts of the car.

But I'm certainly not good enough to consistently catch and correct the car once I'm in a 10/10ths oversteer situation (I've only been at 10/10 on the skidpad -- where spinning is part of the learning situation)

So here is my question: My front engine M3 is spec'd for 50/50 weight distribution. It is also said to have neutral handling erring toward understeer at the limit. The Elise, meanwhile, is reported to have a natural propensity for understeer as well (at least recording to the reports I've read/seen). Also, when oversteer does creep in, it is supposed to be markedly controllable (at least according to the Top Gear video).

So: Given that understeer would appear to be dialed in by the Elise's chassis and stock wheel set up, wouldn't this negate the otherwise traditional oversteer concerns associated with mid-engine cars? I concede that *any* car can be made to spin; we can't shut down the laws of physics. But wouldn't the factory-dialed understeer negate the mid-engine oversteer characteristics?

ITo wit: I've driven a Porche 996, and it plowed like crazy -- and this is a *rear* engine car!

So what nuance am I just not getting here? Educate me!

Thanks!

10-13-2003, 10:23 PM	#5 (permalink)
JonOrangeElise Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: San Francisco Posts: 1,887	Randy and Matt G, OK, I've done two car control clinics (with skid pads) and three driving schools (all in my E36 M3, all through the BMW CCA). I fully understand the basic concepts of understeer/oversteer on an intellectual level, and I'd say I've honed my skills enough not to panic and do something stupid (a la lifting while going in hot). I am also developing a feel for weight transfer, and loading/unloading different parts of the car. But I'm certainly not good enough to consistently catch and correct the car once I'm in a 10/10ths oversteer situation (I've only been at 10/10 on the skidpad -- where spinning is part of the learning situation) So here is my question: My front engine M3 is spec'd for 50/50 weight distribution. It is also said to have neutral handling erring toward understeer at the limit. The Elise, meanwhile, is reported to have a natural propensity for understeer as well (at least recording to the reports I've read/seen). Also, when oversteer does creep in, it is supposed to be markedly controllable (at least according to the Top Gear video). So: Given that understeer would appear to be dialed in by the Elise's chassis and stock wheel set up, wouldn't this negate the otherwise traditional oversteer concerns associated with mid-engine cars? I concede that any car can be made to spin; we can't shut down the laws of physics. But wouldn't the factory-dialed understeer negate the mid-engine oversteer characteristics? ITo wit: I've driven a Porche 996, and it plowed like crazy -- and this is a rear engine car! So what nuance am I just not getting here? Educate me! Thanks!