Brakes Squealing. How Safe? - LotusTalk

Daedelous · 08-10-2007, 03:11 PM

About 30% of the time my front brakes (maybe just the front right one) are squealing. Sometimes when I have the brake depressed, sometimes when I don't. If it's the former, letting off the brake stops the sound. If it's the latter, depressing the brake stops the sound. I don't know anything about brakes, but my front ones look like the pads are about 1/16" of an inch thicker than what I'm assuming is the rotor.

I've already ordered new pads, but there is a once-in-a-lifetime cruise opportunity lasting maybe over an hour this weekend, and I'd like to go. I haven't experienced any noticeable loss in braking power and my wheels haven't been squealing like this for more than a couple hours (though it used to happen maybe once every 10 drives).

How safe is it for me (and my rotors) to take it for this one final spin before the pads arrive?

LARRY · 08-10-2007, 03:12 PM

How many miles on your pads?

I underestimated my pads and just missed. Pads hit rotors, rotors need to be replaced.

Can't tell by your description of the sound....

Mine sounded like a bad grinding sound.....not a squeal.

I would get them checked-------NOW.

Randy Chase · 08-10-2007, 03:16 PM

I don't think the squealing is that related to pads being worn (as it is on cars with squealing indicators). The important thing is that you should know how much brake pads you have left and periodically check them.

Once you learn how, it is easy. And that is the thing to do. If you have enough pad, no worries. If not, then that is bad.

LARRY · 08-10-2007, 03:16 PM

What he said. Yeah!

ace10 · 08-10-2007, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daedelous

About 30% of the time my front brakes (maybe just the front right one) are squealing. Sometimes when I have the brake depressed, sometimes when I don't. If it's the former, letting off the brake stops the sound. If it's the latter, depressing the brake stops the sound. I don't know anything about brakes, but my front ones look like the pads are about 1/16" of an inch thicker than what I'm assuming is the rotor.

I've already ordered new pads, but there is a once-in-a-lifetime cruise opportunity lasting maybe over an hour this weekend, and I'd like to go. I haven't experienced any noticeable loss in braking power and my wheels haven't been squealing like this for more than a couple hours (though it used to happen maybe once every 10 drives).

How safe is it for me (and my rotors) to take it for this one final spin before the pads arrive?

you REALLY need to do a good visual inspection. leading and trailing edges, inside pad and outside pad, both sides. an estimated 1/16th of an inch is NOTHING. personally, there's no way i'd take the chance with negligible pad material.

LARRY · 08-10-2007, 03:19 PM

What he said, too...

LARRY · 08-10-2007, 03:23 PM

Get them looked at right away. Save your rotors.

Or, ignore them and spend ALOT more money.

TimMullen · 08-10-2007, 04:47 PM

Squealing is not a bad thing - just annoying.

Grinding brakes indicate that the pads have worn out and are destroying the rotors.

Which sound do you have?

Grinding is a low "growling" sound - metal scraping against metal. It often happens all the time, and gets worse when you push on the brake pedal.

Squealing is a high pitched sound - kind of a "screaming". Sometimes you get a bit of squealing as you drive without applying the brakes. Sometimes you get the squeal when you lightly apply the brakes. And sometimes (usually) when you push the brakes very hard, the squealing goes away.

Squealing is nothing to worry about.

It happens because of the way that the surface of the pad has "glazed". One way to get rid of the squeal is to do several stops from fairly high speed while stopping hard. This will "bed in" the brake pads by heating them to a higher temperature and often gets rid of the squealing. This is why the sounds goes away when you apply the brakes hard, you are getting them hot.

The other cause of the squeal can be the pads "fluttering" (vibrating) in the brake calipers. The cure for this is to remove the pads, and apply brake grease to the parts of the pads where the metal of the pad contacts the calipers (don't get any grease on the surface of the pads!). You also apply the brake grease to the back of the pads where the pad contacts the piston or outside of the caliper in the case of the rear calipers. The grease lubricates the pads and dampens the fluttering.

Auto manufacturers spend a lot of money attempting to minimize (or eliminate) the squealing sounds. Unfortunately, the cure is usually to make pads that don't last as long, and don't work as well. Performance pads (as used on the Elise) tend to skip the "quietness" capability in trade for the performance capability.

Figure out if you have the "squealing" or the "grinding". If it squealing, try to re-bed the brakes. If it's grinding, it's already too late, and you need new pads and rotors.

Another

Chris Mackey · 08-10-2007, 04:49 PM

Do you have the touring brakes? They don't squeal

TimMullen · 08-10-2007, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Mackey

Do you have the touring brakes? They don't squeal

There always has to be one...

Ian · 08-10-2007, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randy Chase

Once you learn how, it is easy. And that is the thing to do. If you have enough pad, no worries. If not, then that is bad.

Has anyone (or can someone) post a pictorial how to for brake pad inspection. I look at mine everytime I change my wheels (before every event) but I must admit, I don't know for sure what I'm looking at/for.

choi0706 · 08-10-2007, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

Has anyone (or can someone) post a pictorial how to for brake pad inspection. I look at mine everytime I change my wheels (before every event) but I must admit, I don't know for sure what I'm looking at/for.

thickness of pad material.. eyeball it..

xtn · 08-10-2007, 09:19 PM

If somebody could post up a picture from the service manual please... Section JJ, Page 6. For some reason my scanner is screwed up.

Oh wait a second. Here just look at this PDF page. It's got a picture.

The rotor is the big circular thing with some rows of holes drilled through it.

The caliper is the thing with LOTUS writen on it and a rubber brake hydrolic hose connected to it.

The pads are fit into place between the caliper pistons and the rotor surface. They have some friction material, and a metal backing plate. You want to check the thickness of the friction material. Is it at least as thick as the backing plate? Then you're good to drive another week before you CHECK AGAIN.

Well, when they're brand new you don't need to check every week of course. But if they get that low you should have your new set on it's way to you.

Daedelous · 08-10-2007, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimMullen

Squealing is not a bad thing - just annoying.

Grinding brakes indicate that the pads have worn out and are destroying the rotors.

Which sound do you have?

Squealing. So I guess I'm probably OK for at least this one drive.

xtn · 08-11-2007, 08:45 AM

Friggin CHECK them.

You should KNOW you're okay for at least this one drive. Why would people just drive around willy nilly "guessing" at their braking capability?

ace10 · 08-11-2007, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xtn

Friggin CHECK them.

You should KNOW you're okay for at least this one drive. Why would people just drive around willy nilly "guessing" at their braking capability?

+1

exarkun1178 · 08-11-2007, 07:29 PM

hi.

so last week my right front was squeeking a lot! so because i did not want messed up rotors, i went out and got pads the next dat and changed them that afternoon(really easy) anyway, here i am a week later and the front right istarted squeeking again.

the old pads did have plenty of matirial on them after taking a look and comparing them to the new ones.

the engine light is on again anyway, so ive got to take it in. i hope hrm knows whats wrong with it.

maybe you have the same problem?! ill let you know how it turns out later in the week.

08-10-2007, 03:11 PM	#1 (permalink)
Daedelous Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Augusta, GA Posts: 377	Brakes Squealing. How Safe? About 30% of the time my front brakes (maybe just the front right one) are squealing. Sometimes when I have the brake depressed, sometimes when I don't. If it's the former, letting off the brake stops the sound. If it's the latter, depressing the brake stops the sound. I don't know anything about brakes, but my front ones look like the pads are about 1/16" of an inch thicker than what I'm assuming is the rotor. I've already ordered new pads, but there is a once-in-a-lifetime cruise opportunity lasting maybe over an hour this weekend, and I'd like to go. I haven't experienced any noticeable loss in braking power and my wheels haven't been squealing like this for more than a couple hours (though it used to happen maybe once every 10 drives). How safe is it for me (and my rotors) to take it for this one final spin before the pads arrive? __________________ Adam 2006 Lotus Elise - Chrome Orange Touring Pack Track Pack Limited Slip/Traction Control Hardtop Stage 2 Exhaust

08-10-2007, 03:12 PM	#2 (permalink)
LARRY It's a Lotus Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Beverly Hills, Ca. Posts: 17,150	How many miles on your pads? I underestimated my pads and just missed. Pads hit rotors, rotors need to be replaced. Can't tell by your description of the sound.... Mine sounded like a bad grinding sound.....not a squeal. I would get them checked-------NOW. __________________ 2005 Saffron Yellow Elise. Stage II Exhaust. 2007 ProBax seats. "We know they're magical and worth every minute we spend on them. The whole Lotus owners' world is like a secret handshake among people who understand that." (R&T)

08-10-2007, 03:16 PM	#3 (permalink)
Randy Chase Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego and where ever the roads lead Posts: 28,174 Images: 761	I don't think the squealing is that related to pads being worn (as it is on cars with squealing indicators). The important thing is that you should know how much brake pads you have left and periodically check them. Once you learn how, it is easy. And that is the thing to do. If you have enough pad, no worries. If not, then that is bad. __________________ * V E R I T A S * A E Q U I T A S * No Longer the ADMIN here, please do not PM me asking for help. Thanks! 2006 Noble M400. Getrag tranny, Quaiffe LSD, Hinged clams. Duratec dual turbo V6. Hoosier 315-18 tires. 2350 pounds. Over 500hp. Track weapon. 2009 Rossion Q1. Monaco Orange. Wing. Black leather/Alcantara with orange stitching. The street car. In build: 2009 Toniq R (300whp? 1100 pounds?). Chrome Orange. Lexus GX-470 tow vehicle.

08-10-2007, 03:16 PM	#4 (permalink)
LARRY It's a Lotus Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Beverly Hills, Ca. Posts: 17,150	What he said. Yeah! __________________ 2005 Saffron Yellow Elise. Stage II Exhaust. 2007 ProBax seats. "We know they're magical and worth every minute we spend on them. The whole Lotus owners' world is like a secret handshake among people who understand that." (R&T)

08-10-2007, 03:19 PM	#6 (permalink)
LARRY It's a Lotus Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Beverly Hills, Ca. Posts: 17,150	What he said, too... __________________ 2005 Saffron Yellow Elise. Stage II Exhaust. 2007 ProBax seats. "We know they're magical and worth every minute we spend on them. The whole Lotus owners' world is like a secret handshake among people who understand that." (R&T)

08-10-2007, 03:23 PM	#7 (permalink)
LARRY It's a Lotus Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Beverly Hills, Ca. Posts: 17,150	Get them looked at right away. Save your rotors. Or, ignore them and spend ALOT more money. __________________ 2005 Saffron Yellow Elise. Stage II Exhaust. 2007 ProBax seats. "We know they're magical and worth every minute we spend on them. The whole Lotus owners' world is like a secret handshake among people who understand that." (R&T)

08-10-2007, 04:47 PM	#8 (permalink)
TimMullen Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Chantilly, VA Posts: 11,382 Images: 19	Squealing is not a bad thing - just annoying. Grinding brakes indicate that the pads have worn out and are destroying the rotors. Which sound do you have? Grinding is a low "growling" sound - metal scraping against metal. It often happens all the time, and gets worse when you push on the brake pedal. Squealing is a high pitched sound - kind of a "screaming". Sometimes you get a bit of squealing as you drive without applying the brakes. Sometimes you get the squeal when you lightly apply the brakes. And sometimes (usually) when you push the brakes very hard, the squealing goes away. Squealing is nothing to worry about. It happens because of the way that the surface of the pad has "glazed". One way to get rid of the squeal is to do several stops from fairly high speed while stopping hard. This will "bed in" the brake pads by heating them to a higher temperature and often gets rid of the squealing. This is why the sounds goes away when you apply the brakes hard, you are getting them hot. The other cause of the squeal can be the pads "fluttering" (vibrating) in the brake calipers. The cure for this is to remove the pads, and apply brake grease to the parts of the pads where the metal of the pad contacts the calipers (don't get any grease on the surface of the pads!). You also apply the brake grease to the back of the pads where the pad contacts the piston or outside of the caliper in the case of the rear calipers. The grease lubricates the pads and dampens the fluttering. Auto manufacturers spend a lot of money attempting to minimize (or eliminate) the squealing sounds. Unfortunately, the cure is usually to make pads that don't last as long, and don't work as well. Performance pads (as used on the Elise) tend to skip the "quietness" capability in trade for the performance capability. Figure out if you have the "squealing" or the "grinding". If it squealing, try to re-bed the brakes. If it's grinding, it's already too late, and you need new pads and rotors. Another __________________ Tim Mullen --- There is no such thing as Touring suspension or Touring wheels. I love being married. It's so great to find that one person that you want to annoy for the rest of your life. - Rita Rudner Chantilly, VA http://members.cox.net/elans4/ 05 Lotus Elise - Chrome Orange - No Touring - No LSS - No Hardtop - Lotus Driving Lights - Lotus "Chin Guards" - plain and simple. 94 Miata R Package - Black 72 Lotus Elan Sprint - Colorado Orange/Cirrus White

08-10-2007, 04:49 PM	#9 (permalink)
Chris Mackey Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 2,587	Do you have the touring brakes? They don't squeal __________________ 2006 Elise, Ardent Red, Black Pack, LSS wheels, shocks and springs. ChuforiaGraffix.com SDD Lives On! SweetDaddyDelicious(at)hotmail(dot)com

08-11-2007, 08:45 AM	#15 (permalink)
xtn McLareghini Bugatterrari Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 6,845	Friggin CHECK them. You should KNOW you're okay for at least this one drive. Why would people just drive around willy nilly "guessing" at their braking capability? __________________ 2006 McLareghini Bugatterrari, Storm Titanium... <mods> installed: air horn, Scroth 4-point ASM harnesses, Sector111 halon extinguisher and mounting bracket, Von Hep exhaust and rear panel delete, Pagid brake pads, red Volks CE28n wheels, Toyo RA-1 tires, Nitron SA coilovers, Sector111 (WorksBell) quick-disconnect steering wheel kit. awaiting installation: Scroth "pull-up" lap belts, Sector111 RTD Brace, Tony's heater bypass mod, and dropped steering rack mounting plates. </mods>

08-11-2007, 07:29 PM	#17 (permalink)
exarkun1178 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Point Pleasant Beach, NJ Posts: 4,286	hi. so last week my right front was squeeking a lot! so because i did not want messed up rotors, i went out and got pads the next dat and changed them that afternoon(really easy) anyway, here i am a week later and the front right istarted squeeking again. the old pads did have plenty of matirial on them after taking a look and comparing them to the new ones. the engine light is on again anyway, so ive got to take it in. i hope hrm knows whats wrong with it. maybe you have the same problem?! ill let you know how it turns out later in the week. __________________ [Ovarian Odorist] 11:12 pm: why did you ever get into your business rob...you have such great potential in the adult porn industry..

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