A/C Again!!!!!! - LotusTalk

S2Lola · 08-02-2007, 12:35 PM

Folks,

Have read w great interest most of the site discussion re the A/C on our cars. Had to laugh about it all too, until last nite when my A/C stopped working

My question is simple enough:
- Am I correct in saying that the problem with probe location was fixed beginning in the 2006 model year? If so, this would point to a mechnical failure in my 06

- Also, in my car's case, it is as if the A/C (which has always worked well, up until 8000km) works well for the first 5 minutes, then it blows hot air for 15-ish minutes, then cool for a couple of minutes, then hot (blah blah blah). I would have thought this is classic 'icing" of the condensor - Am I wrong?

It's f'in hot and humid in Toronto right now - commuting is getting tough!!

Thoughts appreciated - going into the dealer shortly.

Cheers,
Bill

Icedog_16 · 08-02-2007, 12:40 PM

I believe that the probe location was fixed mid-2005.

I usually get about 15-20 mins on the way to work in the morning. I've had the dealer look it over and they supposedly can't re-create the problem although I experience it everyday. I wonder if it has something to do with road speed as in the other thread because that is usually the point in my commute where traffic opens up. Although, then one would think that it would go back to cold once I slow down again. I'll have to get a temperature probe and check that out.

badhorse · 08-02-2007, 12:52 PM

If I run the fan on high my a/c cuts out after a while to, but if I turn the fan down one level it works for hours. My service mgr advise me that this setting provides the coolest air. I have found this to be true.

Chris Mackey · 08-02-2007, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S2Lola

It's f'in hot and humid in Toronto right now - commuting is getting tough!!

Let me tell you, the sympathy from Texas is swelling for you!

I find I get 1 hour from the A/C.

banzai · 08-02-2007, 02:27 PM

I just took my '05 in to the dealer to make sure I got my last kick at the warranty cat before my 3 years were up. Catching up on "campaigns" from Lotus, the service manager mentioned a factory AC fix that involves drilling 2 extra drain holes. Something about the moisture building up and freezing, which upsets the system.

It's +90 in Atlanta, and it seems to work better now, and it was free.

texige · 08-02-2007, 03:04 PM

I am also in Texas and find that if I don't get greedy and set the temperature at 10:00 on the highway instead of full cold, mine doesn't freeze up and works well enough.

JLSELISE · 08-02-2007, 03:06 PM

Don't know for sure, but this could be a duty cycle issue.
With high humidity on hot days if the A/C does not cycle on and off there is a chance it will just freeze up and stop working as some of you have experienced. A potential fix for this problem is to dial back the temp-control knob a bit from full cold to some mixed temp so that the system will cycle and "clear" itself on a regular basis. A lower fan speed may help, too. A duty cycle of 1-2 minutes for the compressor "on" vs "off" may be required for the system to run w/o freezing up. The air coming out of the vents may not be as cold as you would like, but it should at least stay below ambient, and the system will be less likely to fail.

TimMullen · 08-02-2007, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by banzai

I just took my '05 in to the dealer to make sure I got my last kick at the warranty cat before my 3 years were up. Catching up on "campaigns" from Lotus, the service manager mentioned a factory AC fix that involves drilling 2 extra drain holes. Something about the moisture building up and freezing, which upsets the system.

There seems to be some confusion with your dealer.

The Service Bulletin was to drill drain a hole (it might be two) in the bottom of the front of the car. Located down at the bottom of the front area underneath everything is the resistor pack for the AC/heater fans. It's in an area that collects water and corrodes the resister pack (killing the fans). The drain hole is to let the water out of this area, and has nothing to do with freezing or the AC (other than the fans). I just had the same procedure done to my car (it's out of it's warranty in about a week).

The only Service Bulletin about the freezing was the original move the probe bulletin for early '05 cars. This was done to my car very early on, and took care of most of the freezing up problem. Took care of it in that I originally froze up, and now it doesn't completely freeze - it justs gets a lower air flow and I lower the fan speed.

Quote:

It's +90 in Atlanta, and it seems to work better now, and it was free.

Time will tell. I could just have been that it was a hot day, but not as humid as normal...

salcosta · 08-02-2007, 04:40 PM

Take it to the dealer and let them fix it. I know your troubles...my A/C completely stopped working. The dealership had the car for 2 full weeks! And I'm an hour and a half away from the closest Lotus shop. Good thing I was on business travel in DC for those two weeks. Haven't had a problem with it since the fix.

Sal

OverRevLimiter · 08-02-2007, 06:05 PM

Considering the effort to take the front apart to get to the thermistat, it would be nice to know what the real fix is to this problem. I moved the probe and it had no effect on my A/C which at this point doesn't cool and it is hard to believe that it is frozen up since it doesn't even cool for one minute. If you feel the dealer did a fix on something, how about asking them what they did and see if you can post their recommendations. Thanks.

Dave · 08-02-2007, 06:26 PM

FYI, here is the a/c probe service bulletin. It lists the applicable serial numbers.

TheViper · 08-02-2007, 07:13 PM

My observations of evaportaor coil freezing leads me to believe it happens with a combination of these conclusions:
1) High humidity
2) Higher road speed
As a note the probe (thermistor) is in contact (I had to reposition it) with the evaportaor coil fins as Lotus service bulletin. In this position the thermostat should cycle the compressor before it freezes under any of the above conditions. Therefore the thermostat does not work and is the cause of this problem. It is basic, if the thermostat is set to cycle the compressor at for example 35', there will be no freezing, but there is.

ZTEC · 08-02-2007, 07:30 PM

Today was the first time I played around with the temp control knob on the highway - 6-7 clicks from full and I could tell it was cycling and never froze - I hope this along with Tony's by-pass mod will be the end of my frozen core issues!

usofrob · 08-02-2007, 08:09 PM

Does anyone have a copy of the service bulletin for the drain hole fix? I believe my fan resistor pack has failed me because of this problem, and I want to make sure my dealer believes me when I saw there is a service bulletin on it.

TheViper · 08-03-2007, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usofrob

Does anyone have a copy of the service bulletin for the drain hole fix? I believe my fan resistor pack has failed me because of this problem, and I want to make sure my dealer believes me when I saw there is a service bulletin on it.

My dealer told me it only applied up to certain VIN number, sorry I don't have that info. My 2005 did not come up on their computer as needing it.

banzai · 08-03-2007, 01:57 PM

I'm sure you are right. I was trying to paraphrase what the tech said and probably bungled it badly. All I know is after a couple of days now it works much better than it did before, so I'm happy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimMullen

There seems to be some confusion with your dealer.

The Service Bulletin was to drill drain a hole (it might be two) in the bottom of the front of the car. Located down at the bottom of the front area underneath everything is the resistor pack for the AC/heater fans. It's in an area that collects water and corrodes the resister pack (killing the fans). The drain hole is to let the water out of this area, and has nothing to do with freezing or the AC (other than the fans). I just had the same procedure done to my car (it's out of it's warranty in about a week).

The only Service Bulletin about the freezing was the original move the probe bulletin for early '05 cars. This was done to my car very early on, and took care of most of the freezing up problem. Took care of it in that I originally froze up, and now it doesn't completely freeze - it justs gets a lower air flow and I lower the fan speed.

Time will tell. I could just have been that it was a hot day, but not as humid as normal...

LotusLust · 08-05-2007, 11:43 PM

LoA said they did mine but there was NO change. of course they also fed me a line of crap when i asked for the headlight alignment. they did not align the headlights, telling me they did not have the "special tool". i think i was speaking with the special tool.

things seemed to improve with later visits though

08-02-2007, 12:35 PM	#1 (permalink)
S2Lola Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 31	A/C Again!!!!!! Folks, Have read w great interest most of the site discussion re the A/C on our cars. Had to laugh about it all too, until last nite when my A/C stopped working My question is simple enough: - Am I correct in saying that the problem with probe location was fixed beginning in the 2006 model year? If so, this would point to a mechnical failure in my 06 - Also, in my car's case, it is as if the A/C (which has always worked well, up until 8000km) works well for the first 5 minutes, then it blows hot air for 15-ish minutes, then cool for a couple of minutes, then hot (blah blah blah). I would have thought this is classic 'icing" of the condensor - Am I wrong? It's f'in hot and humid in Toronto right now - commuting is getting tough!! Thoughts appreciated - going into the dealer shortly. Cheers, Bill

08-02-2007, 03:06 PM	#7 (permalink)
JLSELISE Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Livermore, CA Posts: 489	Don't know for sure, but this could be a duty cycle issue. With high humidity on hot days if the A/C does not cycle on and off there is a chance it will just freeze up and stop working as some of you have experienced. A potential fix for this problem is to dial back the temp-control knob a bit from full cold to some mixed temp so that the system will cycle and "clear" itself on a regular basis. A lower fan speed may help, too. A duty cycle of 1-2 minutes for the compressor "on" vs "off" may be required for the system to run w/o freezing up. The air coming out of the vents may not be as cold as you would like, but it should at least stay below ambient, and the system will be less likely to fail. __________________ Joel '67 S3 Elan dhc (owned since 1970) '06 Audi A3 3.2 '04 Noble M12 (380 rwhp)

08-02-2007, 07:13 PM	#12 (permalink)
TheViper Alarmed & Dangerous Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boca Raton FL Posts: 3,205	My observations of evaportaor coil freezing leads me to believe it happens with a combination of these conclusions: 1) High humidity 2) Higher road speed As a note the probe (thermistor) is in contact (I had to reposition it) with the evaportaor coil fins as Lotus service bulletin. In this position the thermostat should cycle the compressor before it freezes under any of the above conditions. Therefore the thermostat does not work and is the cause of this problem. It is basic, if the thermostat is set to cycle the compressor at for example 35', there will be no freezing, but there is. __________________ Cobra OEM - Alarm, Immobilizer, CDL Emergency Override with warranty Additional Emergency Touch Keys - see link above Brand New Cobra Alarm Remote with warranty Cobra Remote Key Fob Strap Cobra Window Closing Module - Add to your existing Cobra alarm 3 Piece Front Clam Protection Kit with Center Bumper Undertray Removal Tool INFORMATION Improved AC & Heating System Battery Choices & Information Remote Key Fob, Alarm & Immobilizer Programming Light Bulb Conversions 2005

08-02-2007, 07:30 PM	#13 (permalink)
ZTEC Third Eye Open Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 1,737 Images: 3	Today was the first time I played around with the temp control knob on the highway - 6-7 clicks from full and I could tell it was cycling and never froze - I hope this along with Tony's by-pass mod will be the end of my frozen core issues! __________________ GO: Vision Function Stage II Intercooled Bliss with Charlie's ECU magic and Ronin's Tenacity! STOP: DBA 4000's, Porterfield R4! TURN: Nitron S/A's Toyo RA1's 225/245 on Rota's!

08-05-2007, 11:43 PM	#17 (permalink)
LotusLust Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: da woods of tn Posts: 3,662	LoA said they did mine but there was NO change. of course they also fed me a line of crap when i asked for the headlight alignment. they did not align the headlights, telling me they did not have the "special tool". i think i was speaking with the special tool. things seemed to improve with later visits though __________________ Storm Titanium, LSS, touring, hard top. my other car is a ...oh yeah i remember the other car...a spyder club111 member. i tried to buy a lower spot and become member #13 but was spurned! "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" -benjamin franklin

08-02-2007, 12:40 PM	#2 (permalink)
Icedog_16 I drank what?!? Join Date: May 2005 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 4,214	I believe that the probe location was fixed mid-2005. I usually get about 15-20 mins on the way to work in the morning. I've had the dealer look it over and they supposedly can't re-create the problem although I experience it everyday. I wonder if it has something to do with road speed as in the other thread because that is usually the point in my commute where traffic opens up. Although, then one would think that it would go back to cold once I slow down again. I'll have to get a temperature probe and check that out.

08-02-2007, 12:52 PM	#3 (permalink)
badhorse SRRT/PHOENIX Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: las vegas nv Posts: 453	If I run the fan on high my a/c cuts out after a while to, but if I turn the fan down one level it works for hours. My service mgr advise me that this setting provides the coolest air. I have found this to be true.

08-02-2007, 02:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
banzai Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 306	I just took my '05 in to the dealer to make sure I got my last kick at the warranty cat before my 3 years were up. Catching up on "campaigns" from Lotus, the service manager mentioned a factory AC fix that involves drilling 2 extra drain holes. Something about the moisture building up and freezing, which upsets the system. It's +90 in Atlanta, and it seems to work better now, and it was free.

08-02-2007, 03:04 PM	#6 (permalink)
texige Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: austin texas Posts: 839	I am also in Texas and find that if I don't get greedy and set the temperature at 10:00 on the highway instead of full cold, mine doesn't freeze up and works well enough.

08-02-2007, 04:40 PM	#9 (permalink)
salcosta MBExigeS Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Beaumont, TX Posts: 40	Take it to the dealer and let them fix it. I know your troubles...my A/C completely stopped working. The dealership had the car for 2 full weeks! And I'm an hour and a half away from the closest Lotus shop. Good thing I was on business travel in DC for those two weeks. Haven't had a problem with it since the fix. Sal

08-02-2007, 06:05 PM	#10 (permalink)
OverRevLimiter Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Winter Haven Posts: 63	Considering the effort to take the front apart to get to the thermistat, it would be nice to know what the real fix is to this problem. I moved the probe and it had no effect on my A/C which at this point doesn't cool and it is hard to believe that it is frozen up since it doesn't even cool for one minute. If you feel the dealer did a fix on something, how about asking them what they did and see if you can post their recommendations. Thanks.

08-02-2007, 08:09 PM	#14 (permalink)
usofrob Almost out of warranty :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Melbourne, FL Posts: 687	Does anyone have a copy of the service bulletin for the drain hole fix? I believe my fan resistor pack has failed me because of this problem, and I want to make sure my dealer believes me when I saw there is a service bulletin on it.

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