How to FIGHT a Traffic Ticket in California

[shay2nak]

It's a lot easier to fight a 22350 than a 22349. That's the absolute speed limit. I'd try to argue with a 22350.

[maagjr]

Well let me give you my feed back.
The trail by written declaration didn't go so well as I got a letter letting me know that I was found guilty for CVC 22349, I requested a trail de novo from with the form included in the letter.
I went to court to ask for traffic school since it is my 1st ticket ever.
The cop didn't showed up and the judge dismissed my case and I will get a full refund

[CALtd]

Which court?

[saintli1]

Speeding on a freeway with a 65MPH or 70MPH posted speed limit...

Please tell me how I can get the arguments against California 22349(a) VC. You say that I should PM you. I don't know what PM is here nor do I know how to contact the author of this section. Thanks... saintli1 (at) bigfoot.com

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/imag...lies/sheep.gif

[SHay]

Ccan you help me. I recieved a ticket last sunday driving down the 10 freeway going to the Malibu. I moved into the passing lane (inner left ) so to pass the traffice in the middle lane. By the time i reached the Lincoln Blvd sign here comes a Cop car. with his lights on. At first I was unsure what was going on because he stayed behind the Van that was on my right hand side. All i could think about was getting out of his way. Then the van merged off the exit and then I moved over to the right. The cop car stayed behind me and began yelling over hs speake but by the time I turned my radio off he had stoped speaking over the loud speaker. So we went into the santa monica over pass and then on to PCH he continued to drive behind me with his lights blaring. There was no shoulder to pull off on so I kept driving until I got to the first light I could make a safe turn onto a street. When we stoped he asked me why did I waite so long to pull over. I told him I didnt see a way for me to safly pull over. then he ask for my ID and went back to his car and begain to fill out a ticket. When he returned with the ticket he asked if he needed to explain anything thing I said no then he asked me to sign the ticket, but when i got the tablet in my hand I signed UCC 1-207 and Printed my name. he asked why I did that and i staid that he could look it up. Now looking at the ticket you see that he put down that i was going 82mph. I was shocked becaause I have never gotten a ticket before, i have a clean record,and now the BIG hEAD wants to mess it up. Oh yeah I also had three other people in the car with me who knew how fast i was going. and it was 5:30pm on a Sunday. and we all know that going to the beach on a sunday from the 10 to the PCH traffice is so bad that you can t even going the regular spead of 65 miles per hour. NOw i have a ticket that says i have to apear april 21, 2008 but I will not be in town. What can I do??

Originally Posted by cpforyou

A lot of us like to drive our Lotus to far away locations. Examples including someone in Orange County going to Willow Springs, Buttonwillow, Laguna Seca, etc. Are you driving a few counties away to get to a Lotus meet?

I've decided to share some information on fighting your traffic ticket. You should know this even before you go out and drive next time. The following information will help you greatly if there is a lot of things question, or if you were (or weren't) speeding excessively. Obviously if you're racing over 100 MPH+ on the freeway, don't expect this to help much.

HIGHLIGHT: Never admit guilt. Always be polite. Always try to get as much information as you can.

1. GETTING PULLED OVER
I recommended that you never admit guilt. By admitting guilt, you put your case into the hands of the cop who pulled you over. If you get a nice cop, he might let you off. If you don’t get a nice cop, and he gives you a ticket, you have just incriminated yourself.

Cop: Do you know why I pulled you over?

WRONG ANSWER: Yes. I was doing 80mph.
WHY: This self-incriminates you.

WRONG ANSWER: No. I don’t. What speed was I going?
WHY: This makes you seem like you don’t pay attention to your driving.

RIGHT ANSWER: Would you mind telling me why you pulled me over?
WHY: You’re not admitting guilt. You are not answering his question, but appear to do so by responding back with a question yourself.

Cop: Yes, you were doing 85 MPH in a 65 Zone.

WRONG ANSWER: No I wasn’t.
WHY: Arguing or disagreeing with a cop will not help you.

RIGHT ANSWER: Oh I see. Would you mind telling me how you were able to get that speed?
WHY: You acknowledge his statement and at the same time, getting information on how exactly he determined your speed. Not all cops will state how he determined your speed on your ticket. You need this information to fight your ticket.

Cop: Do you know how fast you were going?

WRONG ANSWER: Yes. I was doing 80 MPH.
WHY: This self-incriminates you.

RIGHT ANSWER: Yes. I believe I was going at a safe and reasonable speed as per CVC 22350. (MEMORIZE THIS ONE!)
WHY: If you’re doing 80 MPH on the freeway, he will write you up for CVC 22349 or CVC 22356. CVC 22350 basically states, “No person shall drive a vehicle upon a highway at a speed greater than is reasonable or prudent having due regard for weather, visibility, the traffic on, and the surface and width of, the highway, and in no event at a speed which endangers the safety of persons or property.” If everyone else is driving the same speed, sometimes driving 65MPH actually endangers the safety of persons or property if everyone is tailgating you, high-beaming you, etc.

This answer will trigger different responses from different cops. Some cops might think you’re a smart-@$$s. Some cops might think that you know what you’re talking about and continue to ask you more questions. If you get a cop that decides to throw a bunch of questions at you, make sure you slow him down. Think carefully about each question he asks you, always be polite, don't incriminate yourself, and if you can, answer a question back with a question to get information from him.

2. GETTING A TICKET
So the cop has decided to give you a ticket. As he is writing it...

Ask him nicely, "Can you give me a warning?"

It doesn't hurt to ask. If he denies it, tell him, “Excuse me officer. I would like request my right to appear county seat.” Do this only if you get a ticket in another county other than the one where you work or live. When he grants your request, he should ask you which court. If you get a ticket in San Diego, but live in LA, you could say Santa Monica for example. If you get a ticket in California near the border of Nevada, but live in Orange County, you would say Santa Ana. Obviously, if you're getting a ticket a few blocks away from your home, you can't do this.

If he denies your request, tell him, “According to CVC 40502(b), upon demand, I can request my court appearance closest to my residence or my principal place of employment. Can I request my right to appear county seat?”

If he still denies it, when you sign your ticket, make sure you face it away from the cop. Write in the signature box, “Request County Seat.” and then sign it. This is your proof that you requested it. If a cop denies you two times, and you write this in, you will have a STRONG CASE. The cop has denied your right to appear county seat, so now you have to write it in the signature box. You can use this as a basis to fight your case. PM me if this happens to you.

If you live in Orange County, and you get a ticket in LA, do it anyways. At the very least, you make him drive one hour or so to fight you in court.

OTHER NOTES:
SPEED TRAP: If it appears to be a speed trap, when the cop is writing you the ticket, ask him playfully any the following (depending on your situation).

"You know what officer, that was a good hiding spot. How many people did you get today from that spot?"

"You must be getting a lot of people from that spot today. Did you meet your quota yet?"

"You know, I see you a lot on Main St. Are you getting more people on this street?" If he answers yes, ask him "Wow. How many did you get today?"

WHY: You are building up evidence against a speed trap case. If it appears he has pulled over numerous people at that spot, you can request to see his log for the day.

MULTIPLE CARS: If a cop pulls over you and a few other cars at the same time, try to get their license plates.

WHY: If you are able to locate the cars later, everyone can fight the case together.


3. TRIAL BY DECLARATION
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d17/vc40902.htm

I recommend that everyone declares a Trial by Declaration, which basically means that you can fight it by mail. By fighting your traffic ticket by mail, you basically send your side of the story, and the cop sends his. The judge reviews both sides, and then makes a decision. The good thing about this is that you’re forcing a cop to gather his evidence and write a statement about your ticket. Some cops don’t like to do this, and will just let it go and would rather just go out and give another ticket. The cop has a certain amount of days to submit his statement. If he does not, you win. If he does, and the judge declares in your favor, you win. If the judge declares in the cops favor, you have another chance to fight it! You have multiple chances of winning, therefore Trial by Declaration is the best route to take.

I have samples of arguments you can use to submit to the judge. Please PM me. I have them for the following types of tickets:
Speeding on a freeway with a 65MPH or 70MPH posted speed limit.
Exceeding a speed greater than reasonable for the conditions present.
Failure to do a complete stop.
Red light camera ticket.


4. SO YOU LOST TRIAL BY DECLARATION?
If you lost Trial by Declaration on a ticket where you drove 5 - 10 MPH, then I'm very surprised. If you did, say 90 MPH in a 65 Zone, then I'm not surprised you lost. I suggest you get a laywer. Otherwise, keep going.

Hopefully, you got your ticket far from your location of residence. The latest statistic I have from a couple years ago say that a traffic ticket case in court is in the defendant’s case approximately 12% of the time. A majority of them are due to the cop not showing up. By having your court case outside of the cop’s favorite court, he is even more likely not to show up.

If you’re ticket is close to your location of residence, please PM me for more advice, or hire a lawyer.

OTHER THINGS YOU CAN DO

1. Do you have parents who live far away that you frequently visit? If so, let me know, and I'll share with you something you can do, so that if you ever get a ticket, you have higher chances of winning.

2. If you're ticket is for CVC22350, try to go online RIGHT AWAY and print out a few weather reports from a few websites.

3. If you're ticket is for speeding on the freeway, go online to SigAlert and print out what the current flow of traffic is. If you are far from home, call someone and have them do it RIGHT AWAY. Also, if it was for a Monday 11AM for example, go to SigAlert every Monday at 11AM and print out a speed report.

FOR THE RECORD:
I'm not a wreckless driver. I generally drive in a safe and reasonable manner. It all started, when I got a 45MPH in a 35MPH Zone many years ago, which no posted speed-limit. I did research, and I won! Since then, I fight every ticket I get, even if I can take traffic school. If I am eligible for traffic school, I usually fight by mail first. If I don't win, I ask to appear in court, in which I ask for traffic school.

As such, I have a good driving record, and a good driver's discount.

[JSteffen]

WOW......YOU GUYS IN California, have a lot of time on your hands.

[uclacyc]

Originally Posted by JSteffen

WOW......YOU GUYS IN California, have a lot of time on your hands.

We just like our money a little more than other states.

[shay2nak]

Originally Posted by uclacyc

We just like our money a little more than other states.

yeah, because everything is more expensive here in CA.

[Stevenson]

Hey!!

Here are several Steps to fight a traffic ticket.....


1. Be polite and cooperative when you get pulled over. Being belligerent or indignant may make you feel better but it might cost you more. By being polite and cooperative, the officer may just write your ticket for a less costly offense instead of what was actually committed and with luck, you might just get a warning! On the other hand, if you are nasty or curt, the officer may note this and the prosecutors will be less likely to cut you a deal if this went to court.

2. Avoid admissions of guilt and never make excuses or create outlandish stories. When you are asked if you know why you were pulled over, just respond with a simple and polite, "No officer, I do not,". Keep in mind that honesty is the best policy especially when you prefer to get off with merely a warning. On the otherhand, if you do get you the ticket, and decide to contest it, remember that any admissions you make now, can be used against you later. Note that the US Bill of Rights, as well as the Canadian Charter of Freedom and Rights, contain amendments that can protect you against self incrimination; read them and make full use of such constitutional rights.

3. Follow one of the two theories regarding how you question the officer.

• Adopt the 'low-profile' technique. Ask the officer if you can handle the ticket by mail. The officer will immediately see you as a low probability to go to court and may take fewer notes. When you do challenge the ticket, the officer's sparse notes will make him want to skip the hearing. Even if he does come to the hearing, his sparse notes and memory will help the judge decide in your favor. Questioning the officer on the other hand will cause him to write voluminous notes on the traffic stop.
• Alternatively, question the officer more directly, as you are handed the ticket, about how the offense was detected and verified. In the case of a speeding ticket, find out where they were positioned when they clocked you and what type of speed measurement device, was used and if it was radar, laser or Accutrac. Gather as many specifics as possible, including the serial number of the device. If, however the officer estimated your speed by following you, then find out what the location was when he began to follow you. Make sure you write down the patrol car's license plate number and his badge number. If you were cited for an offense other than speeding, make sure you understand exactly why you were pulled over, especially if you were cited for something that could not have been easily seen. Do note that the officer does not have to actually give this information releated to the device used at the time of stop. You can request this information by filing a motion of Discovery, and then you will get that information.

4. Check your ticket for accuracy by reviewing it immediately upon receipt. There are two considerations here:

• If there are inaccuracies that may hurt your case (i.e. if the officer notes on the ticket that you crossed two lanes of traffic when you only crossed one, or if he says traffic was heavy when in fact it was light), ask him immediately to correct them. Be very polite when requesting changes to your ticket. However if you find that the officer is not accommodating, do not argue but record the actual circumstances in your mind, and after he leaves, jot it down.
• On the other hand,if there are inaccuracies that may help your case or get the ticket dismissed, such as the wrong license plate number, the wrong street, etc., you do not want to call attention to them.

5. Begin preparing your defense immediately, once the police officer has given you your ticket and left the scene. Record relevant details, such as traffic and road conditions, weather, time of day, and any extenuating circumstances. If you have a camera or cell phone camera take pictures - especially if your defense depends on something like an obscured speed limit sign or a huge pothole that you had to swerve to miss. Go to the officer’s original position and check for any obstructions that might have caused them to have a poor view of the alleged offense or that might have caused the radar to malfunction. Make a diagram of the road showing where the officer was positioned, which direction you were traveling, where you eventually stopped, and other important details.

6. Read the fine print on the ticket after you get home, as there is useful information on there that might help you. Make sure you understand all of it, as it will give you instructions on how to proceed to the next step.

7. Decide whether to fight the ticket by the circumstances involved, and the information on the ticket. Weigh the costs and benefits of contesting the citation.

• Find out exactly what offense you are charged with by looking at the code number on the ticket.
• Find out what the cost of conviction will be, including the fine, jail or community service, mandatory diversion programs, and increased insurance rates.

8. Calculate the cost of fighting the ticket and weigh it against the chances
of getting it dismissed or reduced to a lower charge.

9. Decide whether you will need a lawyer. Find out whether or not the
jurisdiction where you received the ticket or were involved in an accident will allow you to have a lawyer for a hearing on a traffic ticket that cannot lead to a criminal conviction for either driver (criminal convictions are for DUI, felony hit and run, etc.) This information will be on the ticket. If you plan a civil suit against the other driver in an accident, your attorney can come to court to observe the hearing on the ticket, but may not be involved in the hearing.

10. For most minor traffic violations, it might not be cost effective to retain an attorney. Some exceptions include a ticket you received while far from home—an attorney can handle your case without you having to travel to court—or a ticket issued by photo enforcement (in many jurisdictions, if you’re not in the court room, there is no way to prove that you were the driver, and the case will be dismissed). You should, however, hire an attorney for more serious infractions, such as DUIs.

11. Request a trial. Your ticket may include a court date, or you may need to request a trial. For most minor violations, your ticket will also give you the option to pay the fine. In almost all jurisdictions, paying the fine is an admission of guilt, so do not remit payment. Instead, follow the required steps to get your day in court.

12. Get as much information as you can. Well before your court date, send a written request for discovery—discovery is the legal notion that you are entitled to see all the evidence against you and other relevant information that the prosecutor may have that can help or hurt your case—to the prosecutor’s office (in some jurisdictions, you may need to file a motion for discovery for the judge to consider). In addition, you may be able to file a public records request for relevant information. Some things you’ll want to specifically request (and you generally must make specific requests) include the officer’s copy of the ticket, maintenance and calibration records for any speed monitoring or breathalyzer device that was used by the officer to charge you, and the officer’s training records and certifications. The exact nature of your case and your plan of defense will dictate the exact information you need to get.

13. Try to cut a deal. In many places, you can request a pretrial conference with the prosecutor. This is an opportunity to plead to a lower charge or get a reduction in points or fines before you go to court. Sometimes you can make an appointment for sometime before the court date, while sometimes you can only meet with the prosecutor right before your hearing. Always consider any deal thoroughly, and make sure you understand the implications on both your driving history and your insurance costs.

14. Consider traffic school. Many jurisdictions offer an option to attend traffic school. In return, your charges will be dismissed or reduced. Explore this option by researching the law in your state. If you find that traffic school is a good option, request it from the prosecutor or judge.

15. Request a continuation of your hearing. In most jurisdictions, the police officer who gave you the ticket must show up for the court hearing. If he or she fails to show, your case will be dismissed. Many times officers will schedule many court hearings on a certain day so that they can appear for all of them at once. If you request a continuation (a change of date) you increase the odds that the officer won’t show up. You usually need to do this in writing, and typically you will need to make your request several days in advance of the scheduled hearing. You might see about choosing a court date that is closer to the holidays - this might increase the odds of your officer being out on vacation.

16. Plan your defense. Once you’ve decided to go to court, make sure you know how you will argue your case. If there is a particularly egregious error on your ticket, you may be able to rest your defense on that, but minor discrepancies (such as the color of your car) won’t help you out. If your defense is based upon extenuating circumstances, make sure they are sufficient to warrant a dismissal. The judge will not be particularly impressed by “I was running late to work,” for example. Make an outline of your points, and make sure your evidence is well-organized.

17. Go to court and plead not guilty. Show up to your hearing looking clean and professional. If you have not yet had the opportunity to speak to the prosecutor, now is a good time to do so. Unless you are offered a satisfactory deal, plead “not guilty.” A plea of “no contest” or “guilty with explanation” will do you no good. Remember, just showing up to court may result in a dismissal if the police officer doesn’t also show up.
In Broward County, Florida, and perhaps in other places, if the officer does show up, change your plea to “no contest”; in most cases you will only pay court costs, with no points on your license and no traffic school necessary. There are many law firms in the area that will handle this for you for a reasonable fee, saving you the time and lost wages of going to court.

18. Use facts to present your case to the judge without admitting guilt. "I was only doing 57 in a 55" is an admission of guilt. "I was traveling at a safe speed for the conditions" does not admit guilt. Politely and clearly explain your defense, entering evidence as necessary. In some cases (for example, a malfunctioning stoplight or an obscured speed limit sign) you may be able to admit guilt without harming your case. Many conservative municipalities, however, maintain a master copy of all traffic laws, speed limits, and zone descriptions in a set of books at a courthouse or town hall. Sometimes these municipalities will not take your (legitimate) ignorance of the law as an excuse.

19. Make mental or handwritten notes of the decisions of the judge. Many courtrooms do not record conversations for traffic proceedings where criminal penalties are not reasonable. There can be ambiguity in how the judge declares your guilt or innocence and any penalties you might face. Make sure the Clerk or Collections department has information that matched what the judge decided.

------Steve

[Brennon]

ticketassassin.com

I live by it. Win every time.

[plastique999]

Originally Posted by Brennon

ticketassassin.com

I live by it. Win every time.

+1
Just used them and won through Trial by Declaration..
definitely worth it!

[Wasabi]

Yup, love trial by declaration... got me out of my last ticket, the police officer never responded so easy win. Then again that ticket was complete bull, the two before it weren't so I wonder if I had challenged those... sigh, either way definantly doing this from now on

[FunElan]

I heard somewhere that a radar detection is interfered with while the cop car is moving. So if he says I caught you on my radar, but he was moving, can't you fight that?

[gameson]

Wasabi, how do you know that the police officer didn't respond?

[lc_09]

This is my vote for the best thread ever on any car forum.

The advice here has helped me get out of two speeding tickets, and also helped me get away with a warning on two other occasions. (all while driving my Elise)

This jpg is my most recent case dismissed notification.

[Brennon]

Originally Posted by FunElan

I heard somewhere that a radar detection is interfered with while the cop car is moving. So if he says I caught you on my radar, but he was moving, can't you fight that?

From what I understand, the radar units can adjust for the speed of the cop's vehicle.

[Wasabi]

I don't have the copy anymore because it was a while ago, but several weeks after I had mailed in my written declaration, whatever it was the court mailed back to me said there was no responce from the officer so the case was dropped, I wasn't found guilty or not guilty... another two weeks and I had a check for my money back

No complaints from me about it... lol, plus the case was rediculous I don't think the officer could have thought of a responce to my declaration anyway... the charge was playing loud amplified music, but I don't have and have never had an amplifier in the car, the officer even looked in my trunk while I was getting my papers for him and saw it was empty... poopie elise speakers are hard to argue for thumping music from a block away, not to mention I was conversing with a passenger when we were pulled over.... loud music, how?

Just stupid Napa cops

[cpforyou]

NOTE: It seems like this link shows up under Google's Search Engine, and I have a lot of people who sign up for LotusTalk just to PM me. I will only help you if you are a LotusTalk member in good standing, or a Honda-Tech member in good standing. If you just signed up for this forum just to talk to me (and many have), then I will not help you. If you are neither, and still want help, I will charge a $10 fee.

[avantephoto]

I used ticketassassin once before,... paid, asked them for help, gave them my situation,... their answer?

"You drove a Lotus Elise. What did you expect? Take the traffic school."

I even have the original email archived.

I'm sorry but I can't recommend them. I'm with the OP though. Good advice.

[TimMullen]

Originally Posted by FunElan

I heard somewhere that a radar detection is interfered with while the cop car is moving. So if he says I caught you on my radar, but he was moving, can't you fight that?

Maybe on the very first radars used for speed measurement, but not correct for at least the last 30 years.

The radar sends out it's signal, and "watches" for two return signals. One return signal is from the ground, and is used to determine the speed of the police car. The second radar signal is returned from the cars in traffic, and is used to determine the closing speed of the car that is approaching the police car. Some simple math with the two speeds and the display shows the speed of the approaching car on the road. Most of the radars (again at least for the last 30 years) can work with the cop car moving or stationary, with the cop car going it the same direction or opposite direction of the car they are targeting.

In short, the police radar will measure your speed coming or going, moving or not. The only thing it can't do is measure your speed if you are traveling at a right angle to it (and note this doesn't meant that they are parked on the side of the road as they can still turn the radar and point it at you).