Nonrefundable deposit to order?

[Andy (Port., OR)]

One of the dealers I'm negotiating with wants a $3,000 nonrefundable deposit to order an '06 Elise.

I've special ordered Audis and Porsches before and the deposit ($1,000) has always been fully refundable, at buyer's complete discretion.

Have others run into demands for nonrefundable deposits by Lotus dealers and, if you've objected, what has been the response to your objections?

Thanks, Andy

[Irishfan04]

Run, I'd say.
I recall there being some discussion awhile back about how this isn't even legal?

[codymac]

Originally Posted by Andy (Port., OR)

Have others run into demands for nonrefundable deposits by Lotus dealers and, if you've objected, what has been the response to your objections?

Thanks, Andy

Don't walk... run away!

That's what that I did when asked for a non-refundable $5k. When the slimeball called to followup I informed him that my order, and deposit, had already been placed with another dealer.

Shame, really. I'd have bought two cars from him, had he played his cards right.

[EburgE]

My original deposit in 2004 was $1000 and I got it back with no questions asked. (Subsequently bought one off the lot.)

Things should be better for you in 2006.

[Allan Gibbs]

Most dealers have refundable deposits.

[Callabrator]

Overseas Motors quoted me a $5000 deposit to get on the waiting list for an Exige. That deposit is fully refundable up until the point that they place the order for it through Lotus (3ish months before delivery) at which point it is non-refundable. Is this standard proceedure?

[codymac]

Originally Posted by Callabrator

Overseas Motors quoted me a $5000 deposit to get on the waiting list for an Exige. That deposit is fully refundable up until the point that they place the order for it through Lotus (3ish months before delivery) at which point it is non-refundable. Is this standard proceedure?

No - and specifically, I'm speaking about Overseas above.
They told me $5k, non-refundable, and that was before Lotus announced the Exige was coming to the US.

[Callabrator]

Originally Posted by codymac

No - and specifically, I'm speaking about Overseas above.
They told me $5k, non-refundable, and that was before Lotus announced the Exige was coming to the US.

Well now that's a downer seeing as though Overseas is so conveniently located. When I'm ready to plunk down my deposit in the next couple of weeks I'll specifically bring up the fact that other dealers are willing to make the deposits fully refundable for the life of the deposit and if Overseas isn't willing to match that offer, I'll look elsewhere. Great info, thanks!

[Graydon]

Any dealer (Lotus or other) that wants a non-refundable deposit is trying to f*ck you... take your business elsewhere. Period.

Oh yeah, and make sure to let them know that you will report their ridiculous tactics on the internet and their sales will suffer.

[FlyLo]

My deposit was $500, refundable. If I had gotten the LSD, he would have added $1300 pseudo-refundable. In the event no one else wanted that option, I'd have to eat the cost. I didn't like that, because it didn't really give him any incentive to get my money back from the actual buyer.

[babak]

My deposit was refundable as well. In the old days the dealers that had non refundable deposits turned out (for the most part) be the ones that lost customers to other dealers. But all in all, many of them were very cool about the deposit.
I'm puzzled as to why even a deposit when ther eare Elises sitting on the lot?

[Stan]

Some dealers (and Lotus) might like to see more deposits being NONrefundable. That's the main reason there are so many left over 2005 cars...so many folks had multiple 100% refundable deposits at different dealers that it made it hard to know what's up. One guy I spoke to had 9 separate deposits at different places, 1-2-3 per dealer. A local dealer has 19 or 20 Elises in stock sitting outdoors. For a long time. And some more 2005s sitting in port, not accepted. That's not so good for the brand or resale, etc.

[codymac]

Originally Posted by Stan

Some dealers (and Lotus) might like to see more deposits being refundable. That's the main reason there are so many left over 2005 cars...so many folks had multiple 100% refundable deposits at different dealers that it made it hard to know what's up. One guy I spoke to had 9 separate deposits at different places, 1-2-3 per dealer. A local dealer has 19 or 20 Elises in stock sitting outdoors. For a long time. And some more 2005s sitting in port, not accepted. That's not so good for the brand or resale, etc.

Did you mean they'd like to see more non-refundable?

Honestly, I'd have been OK with non-refundable if:
- Lotus offered better communication about allocations and delivery dates
- my salesman wasn't such a sleaze
- they'd announced the car was coming here

Of course, Lotus could also put a halt to the multiple deposit thing if they tracked everything better. While it's disappointing and it does hurt the value, the brand, etc., Lotus simply filled dealer orders - something they've done for years, regardless of the dealer's ability to move the cars (there's still some new Esprits in showrooms).

You have to admit, a non-refundable deposit on a car that hasn't been officially announced is completely absurd.

[Stan]

Originally Posted by codymac

Did you mean they'd like to see more non-refundable?

Honestly, I'd have been OK with non-refundable if:
- Lotus offered better communication about allocations and delivery dates
- my salesman wasn't such a sleaze
- they'd announced the car was coming here

Of course, Lotus could also put a halt to the multiple deposit thing if they tracked everything better. While it's disappointing and it does hurt the value, the brand, etc., Lotus simply filled dealer orders - something they've done for years, regardless of the dealer's ability to move the cars (there's still some new Esprits in showrooms).

You have to admit, a non-refundable deposit on a car that hasn't been officially announced is completely absurd.

Yes you are right, I'll edit my mistake. NONrefundable! How was Lotus supposed to track things better? They were a restart of a company, have fewer (and new) staff than your local dealer, the dealers took the orders not Lotus, dealer laws in the US give car companies little control over what the dealer does, etc, etc.

[Shiftlock]

If you plan on buying the car, why do you care if the deposit is refundable or not? If you're not sure you want the car, wait until you are. I think it would be a bit wrong to put a deposit down on a car, then cancel your order and take your deposit back after it's on the way. It leaves the dealership with a car they may not want.

[raggedy1]

Originally Posted by Shiftlock

If you plan on buying the car, why do you care if the deposit is refundable or not? If you're not sure you want the car, wait until you are.

situations can change within a few months. job. health. nothing in life is guaranteed but the dealer wants to be guaranteed this guy's deposit!

considering the lack of interest in the Elise maybe the dealer is afraid of getting stuck with the car if the buyer walks away after the car is built and shipped.

[nas213]

My $5,000 deposit for the Exige was refundable up to the order date. After the order, the deposit was refunable only when a buyer was found for the car.

[codymac]

Originally Posted by Stan

Yes you are right, I'll edit my mistake. NONrefundable! How was Lotus supposed to track things better? They were a restart of a company, have fewer (and new) staff than your local dealer, the dealers took the orders not Lotus, dealer laws in the US give car companies little control over what the dealer so, etc, etc.

True. BMW does a helluva job tracking things though, including coordinating customers with production slots - my basis for comparison.

[Stan]

Originally Posted by raggedy1

situations can change within a few months. job. health. nothing in life is guaranteed but the dealer wants to be guaranteed this guy's deposit!

Sure, stuff happens. But in the overall picture it harms a startup like Lotus Cars USA when things like this happen.

considering the lack of interest in the Elise maybe the dealer is afraid of getting stuck with the car if the buyer walks away after the car is built and shipped.

I think that supply and demand need to be better matched up. An Elise is an extra or discretionary car for many, hence in most parts of the world a large percentage are made to order for a customer. Outside the US car dealers are more tightly controlled by the manufacturer. Not here, they are all independent businesses. Yet things they can do can affect Lotus. For example I am waiting now about three months on a warranty issue with a local dealer. Parts are at Lotus. Dealer needs to order part from Lotus. Not Lotus's fault. Lotus is just not a priority at some of the dealers. I'm sure that Lotus wishes that they had some more control over some of these sorts of things. Some car dealers sell more of one model of car that Lotus sells in a year in the US.

Over time, Lotus can get the car more well known which can lead to more sales. It's still pretty unknown. It does not have a clear image such as Porsche or Ferrari enjoy. Things like that take at least 5-10 years to develop. It would help to have more driving events and more venues for the car to be driven in it's element so people can see and experience what it can do.

[GabbaGabbaHey]

Originally Posted by Stan

Sure, stuff happens. But in the overall picture it harms a startup like Lotus Cars USA when things like this happen....

Or Lotus could raise the sticker on you 3K after you put in your order months earlier ....