My Ultimate V1 install - LotusTalk

scottyb · 02-19-2005, 11:13 PM

Well I have finalized my V1 install. The main unit is completely hidden inside a plastic box that looks like an interior brake light. It has an unobscured view infront and behind for the best protection. I have my concealed display installed in the stock rear view mirror. Also I have the audiocontrol and a second concealed display in the driver's side cubby hole.

robi · 02-20-2005, 01:31 AM

But does you fake light light when you hit the brake...JK best "stealth install I've yet seen!

kudos

scottyb · 02-20-2005, 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robi

But does you fake light light when you hit the brake...JK best "stealth install I've yet seen!

kudos

I'm actually waiting for an LED light that will fit in the box. So the answer is eventually.

Randy Chase · 02-20-2005, 10:35 AM

Scotty, I was out test fitting in my car and it seems that putting the bottom of the V1 box on the small ledge at the bottom of the window, might be too low. It seems like the lin of sight behind the V1 is interrupted by the raised section of the rear engine cover. Do you think this is not a problem?

I am also thinking of creating a simple mod to the V1 box to incorporate LED based backlighting on a pcb mounted surface mount array that can sit behind a red lens.

Vantage · 02-20-2005, 12:35 PM

http://www.valentine1.com/laserhowto/

Does the fiberglass obstruct radar that much? I've always mounted as high as possible.

scottyb · 02-20-2005, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randy Chase

Scotty, I was out test fitting in my car and it seems that putting the bottom of the V1 box on the small ledge at the bottom of the window, might be too low. It seems like the lin of sight behind the V1 is interrupted by the raised section of the rear engine cover. Do you think this is not a problem?

I am also thinking of creating a simple mod to the V1 box to incorporate LED based backlighting on a pcb mounted surface mount array that can sit behind a red lens.

If the v1 sits directly on top pf the shelf, the rear lip does block it. I have my V1 mounted to the top of the box which is about 2.5 inches above the shelf. I checked the position with a laser level and found that it has an unobstructed view both in the back and in the front under the rear view mirror.

scottyb · 02-20-2005, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vantage

http://www.valentine1.com/laserhowto/

Does the fiberglass obstruct radar that much? I've always mounted as high as possible.

Any material that the radar needs to penetrate efects it. However, radar penetrates fiberglass extreamly well. When a radar gun is shot at the elise from the front, the radar doesn't see th fiberglass. It actually sees the front firewall/ crash structure behind the front clam.

As for the hight. I originally had it mounted to the roll bar next to the drivers seat. I found that it obstructed my view with respect to the rear view mirror. My new position is much better for me. I don't think it makes that much difference in the Elise since we are so low down to the ground anyway. I think the absolute best placement for maximum detection would be about 1 to 2 feeet above the roof of the car. Maybe someone will fabricate some crazy wing, periscope, or antena for that.

nak · 02-22-2005, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyb

Any material that the radar needs to penetrate efects it. However, radar penetrates fiberglass extreamly well. When a radar gun is shot at the elise from the front, the radar doesn't see th fiberglass. It actually sees the front firewall/ crash structure behind the front clam. [snip]

The fiberglass is reasonably transparent. What about your paint? I don't have a clue as to what is in the paints on the various colored Elise, so it may not matter. But once upon a time, the kind of paint made a huge difference in radar transparency. It's been a while, but I think that metal flake paints were the culprit - the metalic content reflected radar.

We have any other EE's on the list who have done RCS studies on car paints?

scottyb · 02-22-2005, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nak

The fiberglass is reasonably transparent. What about your paint? I don't have a clue as to what is in the paints on the various colored Elise, so it may not matter. But once upon a time, the kind of paint made a huge difference in radar transparency. It's been a while, but I think that metal flake paints were the culprit - the metalic content reflected radar.

We have any other EE's on the list who have done RCS studies on car paints?

If there is metal on the paint it will reflect the radar. If your question is if the Elise is the size of the Elise's image on radar, it is probably as big as a Jeep Wrangler. The Elise has a much bigger reflective image than most metal skinned cars. This is because of the size and the shape of the metal crash structure in the front of the car. However, we seem to have a very small laser image.

Stan · 02-22-2005, 06:44 AM

>>>This is because of the size and the shape of the metal crash structure in the front of the car.<<<

Actually the front crash structure is composite. But the alloy frame and higher frame elements are likely pretty noticeable to radar.

scottyb · 02-22-2005, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stan

>>>This is because of the size and the shape of the metal crash structure in the front of the car.<<<

Actually the front crash structure is composite. But the alloy frame and higher frame elements are likely pretty noticeable to radar.

I ment the aluminum wall that would be the firewall in a front engine car. I'm not really sure what to call it.

A good question would be does the composite crumple/crash zone absorb any radar? That would be cool indeed.

jdl8r · 02-22-2005, 07:12 AM

where can I get one of those Mirrors?

scottyb · 02-22-2005, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdl8r

where can I get one of those Mirrors?

The're actually quite easy to make, but if you want to get one there are 2 sources I have found.

http://www.apexcone.com/prod_invisimirror.html

They use bmw & boxter mirrors wich are smaller than the stock Elise (GM) mirror. About $300

Or you can go to:

Steve Courtney
Impact Product Development Inc.
impactpd@telusplanet.net

He will install it in a stock mirror for you for about $450.

jdl8r · 02-22-2005, 07:53 AM

how the hell does someone make one of those mirrors?!

scottyb · 02-22-2005, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdl8r

how the hell does someone make one of those mirrors?!

Take the cealed display apart. Then take the mirror apart. You can scratch the silver lining off the back of the mirror where the display is going to be. Secure the concealed display card with glue or acrylic. I wish I took pictures of my mirror when it was apart. If you can soilder then you shouldn't have a problem with the mirror. If you screw it up, just buy another GM mirror $40.

jdl8r · 02-22-2005, 08:05 AM

Thanks scottyb, I'll have a nice little arts and crafts project to do after I drive my car from the eastcoast...

Stan · 02-22-2005, 08:10 AM

FWIW some of the old Corvettes were pretty good radarwise. The C3 (late 60s to early 80s) had an angled radiator (tilted rearward viewed from the open hood) that reflected the signal to the sky. So the distance at which the radar gun could get a lock was cut way, way down - giving the driver plenty of time to react to the warning emanating from the radar detector. Our radiator is horizontal and the front frame elements are pretty much vertical. I wouldn't be surprised if the Elise's radar stealth factor could be improved with some tweaking.

cixelsyd · 02-22-2005, 08:14 AM

When looking into radar detectors and laser blockers, I learned quite a bunch from some websites. Radar is not affected by the paint color (unless the metallic content is high) but laser is. Therefore, a black vehicle will have a smaller laser return.

Laser is highly focused, and cops are taught to aim at your front license plate (most are now made with special coatings/materials that reflect laser even better than a normal metal plate would!) and if that is not available, your front headlamps.

Our cars are good against laser primarily becase most of us dont use a front plate and the cops have to work hard to paint the front headlamps with the beam.

That is ALSO why the all-in-one detectors like V1 and Bel RX65 score lower onlaser detection than the more expensive "component" detectors/blockers. The laser detector is usually mounted high up, for better radar detecting, but then doesnt get hit by the laser beam - unless the cop paints someone else and you detect the scatter. Its not that big a deal though, cause most times you dont have enough warning time with laser to slow down ... the detector simply lets you know your about to get a ticket!

That is why component units like the "Blinder M-20 X-treme Laser Jammer" (for a low low price of $284 ... best price ive seen yet place their detection/jamming units in the front grill of cars/trucks, close to both the headlamps and the license plate.

Check this out for more info... http://www.speedzones.com/ they LOVED the Blinder... said it jammer laser each time, every time, all the time. I am going to pick one up as soon as I get some spare cash!

cixelsyd · 02-22-2005, 08:17 AM

Scotty:

Awsome job on the install!! Looks totally professional, I love it! Kudos!

-=cixel

bellotech · 02-22-2005, 09:05 AM

Scotty,

The install looks great! I would love to do something similar to my elise.

After all the work you did, why didnt you use a smaller rear view mirror? I think the stock one is too big for the car.

02-19-2005, 11:13 PM	#1 (permalink)
scottyb Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,713	My Ultimate V1 install Well I have finalized my V1 install. The main unit is completely hidden inside a plastic box that looks like an interior brake light. It has an unobscured view infront and behind for the best protection. I have my concealed display installed in the stock rear view mirror. Also I have the audiocontrol and a second concealed display in the driver's side cubby hole. Attached Images

02-20-2005, 01:31 AM	#2 (permalink)
robi Trackday junkie Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Socal Posts: 52 Images: 3	But does you fake light light when you hit the brake...JK best "stealth install I've yet seen! kudos __________________ Driving an EVO but hope to get an Elise fast enough to entertain me! Exige T-2 test car....got to teach the turbo boys some respect

02-20-2005, 10:35 AM	#4 (permalink)
Randy Chase Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego Posts: 28,282 Images: 761	Scotty, I was out test fitting in my car and it seems that putting the bottom of the V1 box on the small ledge at the bottom of the window, might be too low. It seems like the lin of sight behind the V1 is interrupted by the raised section of the rear engine cover. Do you think this is not a problem? I am also thinking of creating a simple mod to the V1 box to incorporate LED based backlighting on a pcb mounted surface mount array that can sit behind a red lens. __________________ Please do not PM me. My box is full. Thanks.

02-22-2005, 08:14 AM	#18 (permalink)
cixelsyd COM Court Jester Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: upstate NY Posts: 268	laser/radar When looking into radar detectors and laser blockers, I learned quite a bunch from some websites. Radar is not affected by the paint color (unless the metallic content is high) but laser is. Therefore, a black vehicle will have a smaller laser return. Laser is highly focused, and cops are taught to aim at your front license plate (most are now made with special coatings/materials that reflect laser even better than a normal metal plate would!) and if that is not available, your front headlamps. Our cars are good against laser primarily becase most of us dont use a front plate and the cops have to work hard to paint the front headlamps with the beam. That is ALSO why the all-in-one detectors like V1 and Bel RX65 score lower onlaser detection than the more expensive "component" detectors/blockers. The laser detector is usually mounted high up, for better radar detecting, but then doesnt get hit by the laser beam - unless the cop paints someone else and you detect the scatter. Its not that big a deal though, cause most times you dont have enough warning time with laser to slow down ... the detector simply lets you know your about to get a ticket! That is why component units like the "Blinder M-20 X-treme Laser Jammer" (for a low low price of $284 ... best price ive seen yet place their detection/jamming units in the front grill of cars/trucks, close to both the headlamps and the license plate. Check this out for more info... http://www.speedzones.com/ they LOVED the Blinder... said it jammer laser each time, every time, all the time. I am going to pick one up as soon as I get some spare cash! __________________ Night life guide and other things to do in New York City! Limited Slip Mafia member since Dec 2005; COM member since Oct 20th, 2004. 2005 Southern New York SCCA SS Championship: second place. "The passenger seat is smaller than the driver's seat, and it is bolted in place. It is there where you tell someone, 'There is your spot; keep your elbows out of the way and hold on.'" ---Lotus Cars USA spokesman Colin Price

02-22-2005, 08:17 AM	#19 (permalink)
cixelsyd COM Court Jester Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: upstate NY Posts: 268	oh ! and! Scotty: Awsome job on the install!! Looks totally professional, I love it! Kudos! -=cixel __________________ Night life guide and other things to do in New York City! Limited Slip Mafia member since Dec 2005; COM member since Oct 20th, 2004. 2005 Southern New York SCCA SS Championship: second place. "The passenger seat is smaller than the driver's seat, and it is bolted in place. It is there where you tell someone, 'There is your spot; keep your elbows out of the way and hold on.'" ---Lotus Cars USA spokesman Colin Price

02-20-2005, 12:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
Vantage please don't hit my car Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 4,054	http://www.valentine1.com/laserhowto/ Does the fiberglass obstruct radar that much? I've always mounted as high as possible.

02-22-2005, 06:44 AM	#10 (permalink)
Stan - Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 6,947	>>>This is because of the size and the shape of the metal crash structure in the front of the car.<<< Actually the front crash structure is composite. But the alloy frame and higher frame elements are likely pretty noticeable to radar.

02-22-2005, 07:12 AM	#12 (permalink)
jdl8r Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 357	where can I get one of those Mirrors?

02-22-2005, 07:53 AM	#14 (permalink)
jdl8r Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 357	how the hell does someone make one of those mirrors?!

02-22-2005, 08:05 AM	#16 (permalink)
jdl8r Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 357	Thanks scottyb, I'll have a nice little arts and crafts project to do after I drive my car from the eastcoast...

02-22-2005, 08:10 AM	#17 (permalink)
Stan - Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 6,947	FWIW some of the old Corvettes were pretty good radarwise. The C3 (late 60s to early 80s) had an angled radiator (tilted rearward viewed from the open hood) that reflected the signal to the sky. So the distance at which the radar gun could get a lock was cut way, way down - giving the driver plenty of time to react to the warning emanating from the radar detector. Our radiator is horizontal and the front frame elements are pretty much vertical. I wouldn't be surprised if the Elise's radar stealth factor could be improved with some tweaking.

02-22-2005, 09:05 AM	#20 (permalink)
bellotech Registered User Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 141	Scotty, The install looks great! I would love to do something similar to my elise. After all the work you did, why didnt you use a smaller rear view mirror? I think the stock one is too big for the car. __________________ Carlos 05 Elise CO, touring 02 Audi Allroad

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