Buying a pick up truck

[NMRJock]

Originally Posted by wantanelise

Fuel is part of it but it's mainly because diesels have double the torque at half the RPM's. Makes towing heavy much easier. Buying a diesel come's down to the weight that your towing and the frequency at which your towing it. New gasser's make 300+ torque, new diesels make 600+.

If you tow 4000 pounds of snowmobiles on the weekend a diesel is a waste of money.

Note-They are both rated for the same towing capacity.

This is where I'd disagree. The diesel fuel economy and longevity are worth the extra dough (to me). Even if I'm just towing 4000#, if I'm doing it every weekend I'm going to enjoy some extra torque going up the hills. A diesel doesn't cost that much more than the equivalent gasser and you get most of/all of that difference back in the resale anyway.

But that's why they make both kinds. You can get whichever is a better value for you.

[Green Ghost]

Its not the motor that’s rated for towing it’s the chasse that’s rated. The Diesel will just do the job easier, as apposed to the small gas motors that will need to work a lot more (struggle) on the heave loads. The day of the big block are gone, but that Ford v10 is nice.

As said above, just towing a few snowmobiles around any motor is good. The horse trailer and towing up and expressly down hills a more (real) heavy duty truck will be desired. You want to be in control of the load, not it pushing you in a way you will notice. The F250 class of truck will (should) have the good brakes and if a diesel motor (down shift a diesel motor and it will control your down hill speed way better then any small* gas motor) you can control your load nicer/safer. You do not ride your brakes going down hill!!! I don’t know how many times I’ve seen smoke coming from the front of some dumbfu@# in a RV or truck with a heavy load driving down a hill trying to ride their brakes the whole way. Down shift and/or use a turnout to let your brakes cool if down shifting isn’t working on it’s own.

*small gas motor>>>>when talking trucks and towing/hauling, 6 liters and down is a small gas motor. You need around 7 liters or more for a real truck.

[fishguy]

Originally Posted by NMRJock

This is where I'd disagree. The diesel fuel economy and longevity are worth the extra dough (to me). Even if I'm just towing 4000#, if I'm doing it every weekend I'm going to enjoy some extra torque going up the hills. A diesel doesn't cost that much more than the equivalent gasser and you get most of/all of that difference back in the resale anyway.

But that's why they make both kinds. You can get whichever is a better value for you.

diesel motors also last a really long time since they run such low rpms.

if i had to purchase another truck no way would i buy a gasser for towing.
diesel has so much torque.
resale on the diesel is also higher as stated above.
one thing i would also recommend is the "Lariat(ford), or LT(chevy) interior.
my 3/4 ton is a LT version, and it is one of the most comfortable seats i have ever sat in. my dually is the LS version(standard), and it sucks in comparison.
the rpice on a used one with the good interior isnt much more(if any), and is well worth seaching for.

[Bane]

+1 on the diesel. Stump pulling torque + bulletproof engines + better fuel economy make it a no brainer in my opinion. We towed my friend's Porsche out to the track with his Chevy gasser and it was terrible... it kept downshifting and nearly redlining itself trying to get up the hill. I couldn't imagine what that would have been like with a heavier load.

Also... I've seen several F250 Powerstrokes for under $10k recently.

[m_beale1]

I had a 2004 Toyota Tacoma for a couple of years. It was a 3.4L V-6, 4WD, with a 5-speed manual. On several occasions I towed my friends ski boat (which was between 4000 and 5000 lbs on the trailer), and several other loads of similar weight. I had to climb the mountains between San Diego and the Colorado river so I got up over 5000 ft. On level ground the truck was pretty happy at 70mph as long as there was not a big headwind. On hills it would slow down, but generally I could do about 50 or 55. So I don't see why you would need all that big a truck for you purposes.

That being said if I were to buy a truck again and expected to be towing regularly, I would want something bigger than the tacoma. If your pulling a small boat, just a couple of snowmobiles, or just one horse, I wouuld imagine that your only talking about pulling between 3000 and 5000 lbs. Any of the 1/2 ton V8 trucks (F150, Chevy 1500, Nissan Titan, old style Toyota Tundr, etc) should be fine for you. The area you're moving to is fairly flat isn't it?

[Green Ghost]

Swede ..where are you? We have questions for you.

Such as…
Do you live in a hilly aria?
How big a boat?
How big a horse trailer?

One more thing to think about is many horse trailers are a 5th wheel set up. This is probably way more then you will need, but throwing this out there just so you know.

[wantanelise]

Originally Posted by NMRJock

This is where I'd disagree. The diesel fuel economy and longevity are worth the extra dough (to me). Even if I'm just towing 4000#, if I'm doing it every weekend I'm going to enjoy some extra torque going up the hills. A diesel doesn't cost that much more than the equivalent gasser and you get most of/all of that difference back in the resale anyway.

But that's why they make both kinds. You can get whichever is a better value for you.

diesel is an $8,000 option... that's alot to most people.

for longevity, both gas motors and diesel motors outlast the rest of the truck, so untill you get into larger truck's (not pickups) that have longer lasting chassis the fact that the diesel will go half a million miles doesn't make a difference.

[wantanelise]

Originally Posted by Green Ghost

Its not the motor that’s rated for towing it’s the chasse that’s rated. The Diesel will just do the job easier, as apposed to the small gas motors that will need to work a lot more (struggle) on the heave loads. The day of the big block are gone, but that Ford v10 is nice.

As said above, just towing a few snowmobiles around any motor is good. The horse trailer and towing up and expressly down hills a more (real) heavy duty truck will be desired. You want to be in control of the load, not it pushing you in a way you will notice. The F250 class of truck will (should) have the good brakes and if a diesel motor (down shift a diesel motor and it will control your down hill speed way better then any small* gas motor) you can control your load nicer/safer. You do not ride your brakes going down hill!!! I don’t know how many times I’ve seen smoke coming from the front of some dumbfu@# in a RV or truck with a heavy load driving down a hill trying to ride their brakes the whole way. Down shift and/or use a turnout to let your brakes cool if down shifting isn’t working on it’s own.

*small gas motor>>>>when talking trucks and towing/hauling, 6 liters and down is a small gas motor. You need around 7 liters or more for a real truck.

Not since the 70's. Those days are long gone. Smaller motors can make more power now. A 6 liter is a big motor, the V8 ford has been a 5.4 for years and people love em and they last forever.

OP, if you go with a diesel, the Ford ones have been BIG trouble since 04 to current. 03 and older were the 7 liter, they were awesome. Other than that cummins, duramax, both great choices.

[NMRJock]

Originally Posted by wantanelise

diesel is an $8,000 option... that's alot to most people.

for longevity, both gas motors and diesel motors outlast the rest of the truck, so untill you get into larger truck's (not pickups) that have longer lasting chassis the fact that the diesel will go half a million miles doesn't make a difference.

He's looking at spending ~$10k. Diesel is not going to be an $8k option on a $10k used truck.

[Green Ghost]

The motor in my 550 was no problem. All the other Ford diesel motors friend’s have/had, have been no problem. Stay on the maintenance schedule and it should be good for a long time. Diesels go through fuel filters like oil filters, so be sure to keep up on those. Treat it like you treat the Lotus (except for the washing/cleaning part) and it should run nice for a long time.

The Ford 5.4 is a great small motor, but it is small. Vary good for most, but if you are doing heavy stuff and or doing heavy stuff in a hilly/mountain area it’s not up for the task. If I where to get an Excursion I would not want that motor in it even for just driving around. There’s a reason it’s a base motor, it’s a good starting point that does a good job. A heavy load on a down hill and that motor will not keep it going slow without needing the brakes to help. If you are only towing a river/jet boat or some snowmobiles you will be more then fine with the 5.4 gas V8 (or whoever’s base/small V8).


As for the bodies not lasting long you must have a Chevy. Most Ford and Dodge trucks I know of (any size motor) have been good for more then one motor and way over 350,000 miles when sold off running good. In many a case lots of scratches and some small dents but what do you expect from work trucks. There are quite a few Chevy trucks I know of that have less then 70,000 miles, are babied and not used for the serious work (dress up trucks), and are falling apart at the seams inside and out. I won’t even get in to how the GM service and support is, outside saying it sucks big time. If I was buying it, new or used, I wouldn’t touch a GM truck.

[mrcarcrazy]

Originally Posted by Green Ghost

T

There are quite a few Chevy trucks I know of that have less then 70,000 miles, are babied and not used for the serious work (dress up trucks), and are falling apart at the seams inside and out. I won’t even get in to how the GM service and support is, outside saying it sucks big time. If I was buying it, new or used, I wouldn’t touch a GM truck.

And here I am....saying that Dodge's have a tendency to fall apart. I can honestly say that Every person I've known who owned a late model Dodge truck had issues with it falling apart.

and

When I was still wrenching at a suspension shop I did all the work for the local Dodge house for 4 months after it got bought out by Lithia...until they got a new suspension guy. Anywho, I replaced 2-3 ball joints a week on Dodge trucks - all under warranty, and most with less than 10k on the clock.

I wouldn't trust a dodge truck.

I've worked on many fords/chevy's. but the vast majority of them had 60-200k on the odo. I personally prefer ford. but I'd avoid a late model ford diesel.

My "POS" as I've named it is my 1995 ford Ranger. it has 140k on the clock. runs great ,no real issues other than some syncro wear on 2nd gear. and the AC works WAY better than my Lotus'

[Bane]

My personal favorites are the 99-03 Ford Powerstrokes or the same generation Dodge Cummins trucks. The 12V Cummins with the huge turbo is an awesome engine...

I own a business that used to do SVO/WVO conversions on diesel vehicles and the Cummins/Powerstroke (7.3) is a far superior design compared to the GM "equivalent" in my opinion.

[wantanelise]

Originally Posted by Green Ghost

The motor in my 550 was no problem. All the other Ford diesel motors friend’s have/had, have been no problem. Stay on the maintenance schedule and it should be good for a long time. Diesels go through fuel filters like oil filters, so be sure to keep up on those. Treat it like you treat the Lotus (except for the washing/cleaning part) and it should run nice for a long time.

The Ford 5.4 is a great small motor, but it is small. Vary good for most, but if you are doing heavy stuff and or doing heavy stuff in a hilly/mountain area it’s not up for the task. If I where to get an Excursion I would not want that motor in it even for just driving around. There’s a reason it’s a base motor, it’s a good starting point that does a good job. A heavy load on a down hill and that motor will not keep it going slow without needing the brakes to help. If you are only towing a river/jet boat or some snowmobiles you will be more then fine with the 5.4 gas V8 (or whoever’s base/small V8).


As for the bodies not lasting long you must have a Chevy. Most Ford and Dodge trucks I know of (any size motor) have been good for more then one motor and way over 350,000 miles when sold off running good. In many a case lots of scratches and some small dents but what do you expect from work trucks. There are quite a few Chevy trucks I know of that have less then 70,000 miles, are babied and not used for the serious work (dress up trucks), and are falling apart at the seams inside and out. I won’t even get in to how the GM service and support is, outside saying it sucks big time. If I was buying it, new or used, I wouldn’t touch a GM truck.

LOL, it's true. I can dent my truck if I look at it too hard. But it's not GM's, it's new vehicles. The emmissions crap and MPG standards are causing it because the car companies are trying to cut weight... not to mention cost. GM, Ford, Toyota, push on the sheet metal and they all push in very easily.

As for the 6.0 power stroke, some turn out fine but search 6.0 powerstroke on line and check it out. I like ford's, I woulda' bought one if the Chevy wasn't so much more powerful. I'm just saying the 6.0 is problem's. International build's it for Ford and Ford has a lawsuit against international over that motor. The contract runs out soon and then Ford go elsewhere. Hopefully they do better nxt time around.