GT-R is more GT than R

[turbophil]

It was over 100F ambient today and we had a track day... I ended up instructing the whole time and never got a chance to drive the Liz

The good news is that I had a lot of seat time with my two students and thir cars...

I instructed Gt-R in intermediate and a 997 911TT in novice. That 911 had a few mods done to it and was making 550whp according to the owner. Good god, it was fast in straight line. Made the GT-R look slow...

The GT-R driver just wasn't picking up the lines I was trying to get him to do, so I took the wheel for a session. It was sorta fun to drive...sorta... After about two laps, I got the hang of it and was letting her hang out as much as the traction control would let me in "race" mode. It understeers, the brakes are mushy, and the stock tires pretty fair... Despite all that, I ran the snot out of the car until the tranny stopped responding to the input from the flappy paddles. I would try to down shift and the indicator just blinked and then UP shifted The student flipped the play station like screen over to the gauges that showed the tranny and engine oil temps and they were both pegged in the hotter than hell section. As it turns out, the computer forced the tranny into high gear to keep the revs down until the fluids cooled off... I think I made 6-7 laps or so before I cooked her. Those GT-Rs are OK, but I think I'll stick with smaller and light. In comparison, I thought the much lighter and smaller 911TT seemed like a much more proper track car--- realizing that TTs are far cry from GT3s

So ya, the GT-R seems like it's more GT than R--- in stock form anyway. I wonder what aftermarket bits and pieces are available for it to help with the heat. I would imagine that many advanced drivers have had to battle heat with the car once they start pushing it

Just thought I would share...

Another case of Lotus Rules!

TP

[apk919]

Nice Phil... you're just too much driver for the Nissan to handle!

[turbophil]

Originally Posted by apk919

Nice Phil... you're just too much driver for the Nissan to handle!

Ha, thanks

And that may be, but my question is what do the REALLY good drivers do? Drive 4 or 5 laps hard and then coast for a lap? How did they make it around the Ring at those "record times"? Must have been a cool day

[apk919]

Originally Posted by turbophil

Ha, thanks

And that may be, but my question is what do the REALLY good drivers do? Drive 4 or 5 laps hard and then coast for a lap? How did they make it around the Ring at those "record times"? Must have been a cool day

Two words: "Factory Mode"

[Cardinal]

Ha, tphil bent the GT-R over the proverbial barrel. "Zed's dead, baby. Zed's dead."

[mopho]

Originally Posted by apk919

Two words: "Factory Mode"

How tight was the track you were on?

The Ring is a pretty fast track, I imagine the car is getting better airflow for cooling there

Was the owner disappointed?

[Spudboy]

Does the location awareness wizardry know about US race tracks, or only those in Japan?

[turbophil]

Originally Posted by mopho

How tight was the track you were on?

The Ring is a pretty fast track, I imagine the car is getting better airflow for cooling there

Was the owner disappointed?

Good question. I'd say heartland (HPT) is intermediate. It doesn't have huge wide open sections like Road America, but it's not all tight and bunched up like Hallet. HPT has 3 sections to break 110 or so (may be 130 in the GTR in 1 of those 3) and the rest are esses.

Hard to tell how the owner felt. I didn't really dwell on it. We pitted and I turned the conversation away from "man I just cooked the sh*t out of your car" to "let's discuss how my lines differed from yours"... He did indicate that next time I drive his car like that, I have to keep it 3 laps or less. I replied that "I'll just drive right seat from now on, as I now know what I need to know about how the car handles so that I can give you better advice"...

With all the hype, I was really expecting something closer to my car.... which is totally unreasonable, and I realize that... I've never been a huge 911TT fan, but after today, the germans would get my deflating dollar over Nissan without question.... for a family truck of a car

TP

[mopho]

Originally Posted by turbophil

We pitted and I turned the conversation away from "man I just cooked the sh*t out of your car" to "let's discuss how my lines differed from yours"...

There goes his warranty

[apk919]

Originally Posted by turbophil

With all the hype, I was really expecting something closer to my car.... which is totally unreasonable, and I realize that... I've never been a huge 911TT fan, but after today, the germans would get my deflating dollar over Nissan without question.... for a family truck of a car

TP

Well, you have to respect what Nissan has done with the GT-R, but it really seems like it's being pushed to its reliability limits to achieve the published performance. On the other hand, the 911 Turbo (in most of its iterations) seems to be understressed... and very durable.

[robains]

Well did the GT-R fuel starve?
Did the GT-R motor pop?
Did it have any oiling issues?

If none of the above, I'd consider the GT-R a success

Toss some coin at it (chip reflash) and some better tires and maybe some tranny oil coolers and the you might have 2nd thoughts about the GT-R. But it is heavy, even the spec-V is 3700 lbs so it'll never feel as precise as the Lotus.

Now a Porsche GT3 is a good target to shoot at.

Any chance you bumped into a 625 HP Z series Vette? I'd be interested in it's track worthiness -- heard rumors it tends to have multiple overheating issues on hot days.

Glad you had some fun.

Don't suppose you have any video?

Rob

[PhlypSide]

It's got back seats and no man pedal, was it ever a question?

Thanks Phil

[MickOpalak]

I got a ride in a GT-R about a week ago and yes, it's definitely a fast GT and not a traditional sports car. Huge trunk, big back seat, lots of room, comfort and practicality. But also 3800 lbs and an automatic transmission.

[xtn]

Found a used Audi RS4 (B7) at a Nissan dealership. Salesman said a guy traded it in on a GT-R. Who woulda thunk it?

[slaughtr]

Phil, one thing...90+% of the GTRs that made it to the states are the "Premium" model, with Bridgestone tires that notoriously understeer. I had a chance to drive the "Base" model at Spring Mountain. I can't speak top the heat issues, but I can tell you the handling ones disappear with the Dunlops.

[tcnohead]

Originally Posted by slaughtr

Phil, one thing...90+% of the GTRs that made it to the states are the "Premium" model, with Bridgestone tires that notoriously understeer. I had a chance to drive the "Base" model at Spring Mountain. I can't speak top the heat issues, but I can tell you the handling ones disappear with the Dunlops.

I had always understood that AWD cars understeer regardless of what kind of tires they have. Is this not the case with this car?

[25psi_Elise_Killer]

Evo X MR with the dual clutch tranny also has overheating issues. I wonder if its a problem with any cars equipped with dual clutch trannies?

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by tcnohead

I had always understood that AWD cars understeer regardless of what kind of tires they have. Is this not the case with this car?

The Dunlops are by far the prefered tire for track use because of the difference in handling. That's why Nissan does all their timed testing on them. My laps at Spring Mountain were essentially understeer free. In fact, I could wag it's tail at will with the throttle.

[apk919]

Originally Posted by tcnohead

I had always understood that AWD cars understeer regardless of what kind of tires they have. Is this not the case with this car?

I'd guess that depends on how sophisticated the torque-splitting is... for example, let's say that on acceleration in a straight line, the system senses rear wheel spin... it would make sense to transfer more torque to the front wheels. But if you were exiting a corner, and it sensed rear wheel spin, it can't transfer as much to the front wheels without causing them to lose grip (since they're probably near their grip limit due to lateral Gs), and hence cause understeer. A system that doesn't take cornering loads into consideration when splitting torque will likely cause understeer.

[jesterbot]

Originally Posted by turbophil

After about two laps, I got the hang of it and was letting her hang out as much as the traction control would let me in "race" mode...

Originally Posted by mopho

There goes his warranty

Actually, he voided the warranty before he even cooked the oil They should have a warning label and plexiglass shield over that "race mode" button. Thank you Nissan!