Thirteen Dollar Intake... - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community

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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 12:27 PM Thread Starter
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Thirteen Dollar Intake...

Fo jollies I messed around with my Elise a bit today. I put a radiussed intake onto the stock airbox to see what happened. A roughly 6-7 inch diameter device which smoothly flares down to a 3 inches exit which is then attached to the 2 7/8 inch inlet of the stock air filter box. I set it up so that it drinks air a few inches above the side air intakes in an attempt to cut unnecessary amounts of dirt and grit from loading up the air filter. It sounds super mean on the big cam. Very noticeable, pretty loud. There is much less of a difference on the normal cam, hardly noticeable. I did a couple of 5-60 MPH tests and obtained a 5.47 second run. That's my best yet. The car was doing consistent 5.6es with a dirty K&N or a brand new paper filter, the existing plugs and the stock snorkel. The flare costs next to nothing and it was very easy and uncomplicated to install.

As noted I also changed out my spark plugs which renders the deal unscientific and more anecdotal. But the car is certainly a hair peppier per the logger. The plugs were not worn out and seemed to be in good shape.

Note that the stock air box has another air intake on the bottom which gets turned on by the ECU. This is that those little hoses and that little gizmo you can see on the airbox are handling. That remains in use, nochanges. I suspect that a higher air intake like this would tend to allow the air filter to stay cleaner over time.

Examining the stock snorkel that normally goes onto the air box inlet, I note that it is "fur" lined. One could spray it with K&N air filter oil. This would help the fur to catch more of the grit that would otherwise load up the air filter prematurely.
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Last edited by Stan; 03-18-2006 at 12:59 PM.
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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 01:17 PM
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Stan I'll be installing the TurboXS CAI shortly and will knock off a couple 5-60s before and after.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan
Fo jollies I messed around with my Elise a bit today. I put a radiussed intake onto the stock airbox to see what happened. A roughly 6-7 inch diameter device which smoothly flares down to a 3 inches exit which is then attached to the 2 7/8 inch inlet of the stock air filter box. I set it up so that it drinks air a few inches above the side air intakes in an attempt to cut unnecessary amounts of dirt and grit from loading up the air filter. It sounds super mean on the big cam. Very noticeable, pretty loud. There is much less of a difference on the normal cam, hardly noticeable. I did a couple of 5-60 MPH tests and obtained a 5.47 second run. That's my best yet. The car was doing consistent 5.6es with a dirty K&N or a brand new paper filter, the existing plugs and the stock snorkel. The flare costs next to nothing and it was very easy and uncomplicated to install.

As noted I also changed out my spark plugs which renders the deal unscientific and more anecdotal. But the car is certainly a hair peppier per the logger. The plugs were not worn out and seemed to be in good shape.

Note that the stock air box has another air intake on the bottom which gets turned on by the ECU. This is that those little hoses and that little gizmo you can see on the airbox are handling. That remains in use, nochanges. I suspect that a higher air intake like this would tend to allow the air filter to stay cleaner over time.

Examining the stock snorkel that normally goes onto the air box inlet, I note that it is "fur" lined. One could spray it with K&N air filter oil. This would help the fur to catch more of the grit that would otherwise load up the air filter prematurely.
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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 02:42 PM
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Stan,

You should have run some times with just the snorkel removed.
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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 02:49 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by scottyb
Stan, You should have run some times with just the snorkel removed.
Yeah...easy to do next time. I was not trying to do a full comparo, just see if things worked or not on a whim. Looks like it's worth some more effort... I can see on the g-force torque curves that some good occured. I think the car would like an intake specifially tuned to "Death Valley" which is the 4000-6000 range on an NA Elise. This is where the torque curve (directly related to the thrust you feel) tapers off on the small cam before jumping back up again on the big cam.

The stock snorkel is easy to remove. It has a pop in fastener attaching it's bracket to the top of the airbox. You can pop that out with a screwdriver from the top of the engine compartment. Then the thingey slips off the airbox entry. BTW on the two cars I have looked over at the airbox, both had a crummy fit where the snorkel attaches to the airbox. A gap and/or stuff sticking out into the air.

Oh...BTW note that intakes *like* to have a radiussed entry. A straight tube has more restriction than the same size tube with a nice flared/radiussed entry point. Same idea why ported subwoofers want flared ports - turbulence is cut and the port can flow more air before it becomes restrictive. A straight tube's turbulence makes such a tube act like it's smaller than it really is.

Last edited by Stan; 03-18-2006 at 05:00 PM.
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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 03:22 PM
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where can one buy this from?

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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 04:05 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Grip Factory
where can one buy this from?
It's from http://www.spectreperformance.com I bought it in a local store off the rack. They also make DIY plastic intakes that are universal. You buy pieces of tubing and fittings and lay out what you need. They make a tube segment that will fit a Toyota MAF sensor...so you could cobble up different layouts for an Elise or other car. Cheap. The tubing is plastic with a "chrome" coating over it. You'd have to come up with your own screens and/or reduce the cross-sectional area near the MAF to tune the deal and keep CELs at bay. Or you might luckout.
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 05:31 PM
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I'm using a Spectre air filter. Airflow is excellent... better than anything else I've tried, but I've not tried an Apex'i power intake. I plan to do that soon. I saw that tube with MAF mount (part number 8705) earlier, but isn't it just cheap plastic and have no vanes/fins? The problem with cheap plastic is it gets chewed up from removing and replacing MAF. MAF should be cleaned fairly often or performance will degrade.

It is all about "Other".
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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Beanie
I'm using a Spectre air filter. Airflow is excellent... better than anything else I've tried, but I've not tried an Apex'i power intake. I plan to do that soon. I saw that tube with MAF mount (part number 8705) earlier, but isn't it just cheap plastic and have no vanes/fins? The problem with cheap plastic is it gets chewed up from removing and replacing MAF. MAF should be cleaned fairly often or performance will degrade.
It seemed to have metal inserts. No vanes / fins, they would need to be added, most likely. Some Elise intakes seem to skip them.
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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 06:40 PM
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Stan why can't you simply take out the stock filter, remove the snorkel and replace it with an elbow tube with a K&N filter on the end of it?

This would alleviate any issues with a CEL since you still have the stock set up. Also the restriction of the stock filter would be gone. Could this be an alternative for those guys looking into other intakes?
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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 06:42 PM
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I checked some other parts that might work with a Toyota MAF hole pattern, for example Lexus GS430, and it was the same part number, which I found odd. Why would a much bigger engine use the same diameter intake?

I'm designing a new intake for my car which will use a 3" O.D. aluminum tube with aluminum MAF mount welded in, two thin vanes, a large fiberglass air box custom made (by me) to ensure hot air cannot enter from the engine bay, an Apexi Power intake, and a 3" I.D. tube drawing air from outside the engine bay. (Again, this is not for an Elise, but I have thought of designing one for the Elise... since you folks may soon have an ECU that could be tuned for a larger diameter intake.) The air box will have as much volume as possible so there is a ready supply of air... for improved throttle response. I'm doing this because I believe it will have improved airflow over the stock diameter intake I'm using now. I can tune the Power FC for it (auto tune, actually).

Someone on Spyderchat mentioned buying a 3" polished aluminum velocity stack to be used in his custom 2ZZ intake. I don't know what he has in mind, exactly, but I could see buying a plastic part for the inlet as you did. The price is right! Thanks for the link.

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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 06:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyb
Stan why can't you simply take out the stock filter, remove the snorkel and replace it with an elbow tube with a K&N filter on the end of it? This would alleviate any issues with a CEL since you still have the stock set up. Also the restriction of the stock filter would be gone. Could this be an alternative for those guys looking into other intakes?
There are many possible layouts. For the approach you noted you'd need to take the middle out of an air filter. Since the perimeter gasket seals the box halves. I suspect that a tube style intake would prove better since there can be fewer twists and turns.

Last edited by Stan; 03-19-2006 at 03:46 AM.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-18-2006, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan
There are many possible layouts. For the approach you noted you'd need to take the middle out of an air filter. Since the perimeter gasket seals the box halves.
Just out of curiosity stan..
Did you buy the intake parts at a chain store or a specialty place..

And..
Since their website is 90% unhelpful, what is the correct adaptor to purchase to fit our MAF?

Also, remember the dia of the stock intake tubing? Esp on the engine side..?

Cheers
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:19 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PsychoRallye
Just out of curiosity stan..
Did you buy the intake parts at a chain store or a specialty place..And..
Since their website is 90% unhelpful, what is the correct adaptor to purchase to fit our MAF? Also, remember the dia of the stock intake tubing? Esp on the engine side..? Cheers
* Autozone chain store

* #8705 Sensor Adaptor. It comes with black plastic adapter plates for different cars, you just use the Toyota piece in our case

* I used #8788 and #8771-6 for this experiment


Last edited by Stan; 03-19-2006 at 03:21 AM.
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:47 AM
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Nice, inexpensive mod Stan. Just curious if you gave any consideration to simply deleting that bulky airbox and just running a straight 3" with cone filter? MAF?
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:57 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dave
Nice, inexpensive mod Stan. Just curious if you gave any consideration to simply deleting that bulky airbox and just running a straight 3" with cone filter? MAF?
Thanks. I run in stock class autocross, so the snorkel will return. I think the "best" intake for the elise would be longish, the minimal diameter that won't restrict, and with the air filter not right behind the side grill to cut unnecessary dirt load-up. Tuned for "death valley". And with the extreme low end or better of the stock two stage (flap that opens & closes under the stock air box) intake. The stock rig might like a non-ribbed tube leading to the throttle body.

Last edited by Stan; 03-19-2006 at 04:01 AM.
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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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Some more sound comments.

* Startup idling. You can hear the thing sipping the air just sitting there. Even if you stand by the driver's side of the car. Not that loud.

* Low cam. Sounds a little deeper. You can hear that it's a little louder after all, now that I have more time in the car.

* Big cam. I cannot imagine anyone wanting it to be louder. I wonder if it's mostly an in-car thing or if it does the same on drive-bys. I'd be surprised if the various tube intakes out there are louder, but who knows. If you want loud and mean, this options certainly delivers and sounds exotic. Barely noticeable on cruise. You could line the body cavity in which it lives with sound absorbent foam and this would quiet things down a bunch without adding restriction or encouraging side effects or rust.

* The intake sucks air from just under the horizontal part of the rear clam behind the door handles. Near the shoulder belt mount in the interior. It's a few inches above the side intake grill.

* Slight gains in torque across the board, no losses anywhere. No CELs but it's only been two days. I will leave it in for awhile to see if the ECU learns any new tricks, so that any results have stabilized.

Last edited by Stan; 03-19-2006 at 02:56 PM.
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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 09:09 PM
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So you have to pull the wheel and fender liner to get the snorkel off? The airbox outlet is a 2.75 inch od and the throttle body od is about 3 inches. I put a smooth silicon hose on but do not know if it made a difference.
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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-21-2006, 06:46 AM
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i dont know stan.....
the competitors cai is designed by some guy who designs stuff for f-1 cars. who are u?
and how much weight are u saving? the competitor's cai is a whole ounce lighter than yours....
but not bad for a shadetree mechanic!

nice job stan!

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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-21-2006, 07:06 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Buz
So you have to pull the wheel and fender liner to get the snorkel off? The airbox outlet is a 2.75 inch od and the throttle body od is about 3 inches. I put a smooth silicon hose on but do not know if it made a difference.
The inlet to the airbox is about 2 7/8 inches OD. Just under 3 inches.
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 03-21-2006, 07:09 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evomind
i dont know stan.....the competitors cai is designed by some guy who designs stuff for f-1 cars. who are u? and how much weight are u saving? the competitor's cai is a whole ounce lighter than yours....
but not bad for a shadetree mechanic! nice job stan!
Thanks, this is just goofing around though. I'd come up with a multiple tuning point setup were I designing an intake for this car. And I'd want to help out "death valley", the soft area in the torque curve between 4000-6000 Rs.
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