New intercooler alternatives..

[andrewgotanelise]

looks good!

[Chili Red]

Originally Posted by wildwhl

Of course, the 2 pushers are inside the duct work. No pics of the additional inlets yet (in progress - playing with the kids on a sunny day and the 2 wheels that wanted to play in the dirt took precedence today).

Spal Fans - 5.2". PWM controller stashed under the intercooler brackets. Someone will ask - my guess is <5 lbs.

When you turn on the fans can you feel any air being pulled through the scoop when the car is sitting still?

Looks like 2 fans flow about 600CFM not sure how much adding push fans in front of the intercooler add.

[wildwhl]

Yes, Chili. Actually, it will suck some smaller items into the scoop. A piece of paper (my mail the other day) is easily held standing up against the intake scoop.

The idea of pushers/pullers together is simply to increase potential flow. The fans are small, and once the static pressure(?) is increased their efficiency drops considerably.

Initial tests were done without intake plumbing, using a heat gun, a shop vac (to increase velocity through the intercooler as the heat gun wasn't enough) and monitoring the IAT sensor via OBDII. Intake side of intercooler becomes too hot to touch. Outlet side had considerable drops (mildly warm to the touch). Actual data to follow over the next few weeks.

Also have a switch to disable the entire system if desired.

WW

[youngkang]

Sorry for going OT but, I can't help but notice a toilet in the background. That is absolutely a brilliant idea!

[wildwhl]

Yes, the toilet and sink truly make life, well, easy in the *garage*.

WW

[TTZ-SR20]

Nice job and great idea!

[TRD_Sports_M]

Originally Posted by wildwhl

Yes, the toilet and sink truly make life, well, easy in the *garage*.

WW

i did the same mods as yours ... just a different fan used. I am in the process of taking some measurements.

[charliex]

Are you having the fans controlled by a temperature sensor, if so it might be worthwhile trying them with and without,as its possible the heat builds up so quickly the fans can't catch up.

[wildwhl]

Charlie -

I'm using the IAT sensor. The input is variable (can be set to any point for the high and low setting). Basically, the fans run full time at low setting (50%) from the time the car turns on and I have the high point set for when IAT sees 110 degrees (about). I'll play with the set points and see what happens.

So far, I've not built up any heatsoak beyond mid 80 degree outlet temps, even with extended aggressive driving in my neighborhood.

WW

[charliex]

Log it with a thermocouple if you've got one, then adjust the ranges and overlay them. It'll be interesting to see the results.

[wildwhl]

Originally Posted by charliex

Log it with a thermocouple if you've got one, then adjust the ranges and overlay them. It'll be interesting to see the results.

You're funny...if I have time...you're not married are you

I have one, and will eventually. BTW - what I do have is IAT data reference points from my last play day at the track (called a track tour, but about 1 hour of solid driving).

WW

[charliex]

I'm, married to my work, Ok then i guess i'll do it, i was waiting for qball to do his too, I've got some nice new thermocouple hardware/software to mess around with anyway.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by wildwhl

Of course, the 2 pushers are inside the duct work. No pics of the additional inlets yet (in progress - playing with the kids on a sunny day and the 2 wheels that wanted to play in the dirt took precedence today).

Spal Fans - 5.2". PWM controller stashed under the intercooler brackets. Someone will ask - my guess is <5 lbs.

Looking good -- great job!

[wildwhl]

Originally Posted by charliex

I'm, married to my work, Ok then i guess i'll do it, i was waiting for qball to do his too, I've got some nice new thermocouple hardware/software to mess around with anyway.

If only I had some software!!! HINT!!!

Just jerkin' yer chain there CX.

WW

[Ol'Racer]

Way to go! You can get a bit more effect from the fans if you shroud. However, it may not be necessary. I wouldn't be surprised that you may not even have to use the high speed fan once you're moving.

I've had many intercoolers on my turbo car over the years: front mount, stock mount, etc. And you may already know this, but the Bar & Plate intercooler has at least 30% greater heat sink capability when compared to the Tube & Fin type of the same size.

Don't know which one the S has.

[LBC111]

Originally Posted by Dragon

This + a 8" fan to help with keeping the intercooler from heatsoaking when sitting.

Never been a fan of this piece because it is not sectional, like the roof. Once installed, you cannot easily remove the hardtop.

[Doghouse]

Originally Posted by qball

There you go... that's the size of duct Lotus should have installed!

Just looked at the web site and I guess the price of the part is 71,400 Yen which equals about $700 USD.

Of course there is the issue of ordering, shipping, etc....

It also would require a body modification....but would keep the stock intercooler.

Maybe.....

[Doghouse]

Keep those ideas posting.

The more alterantives the better. And for those of you who are holding out...

[Thomasio]

(This is copied from another thread, from a couple of days ago): Exige S Intercooler Upgrade (Cup - like)

Okay, dangit... the cat is mostly out of the bag. I don't have time to detail this right now, I'll follow up later, but here you go:

The under $2,000 system that has been the subject of the tease:

1) an upgraded, higher capacity intercooler. ("but why doesn't it have a bung for the Bosch sensor, Thomasio?)

2) lightweight CNC mandrel bent aluminum intercooler tubes... make up for the added weight of the higher capacity intercooler. ("but why is there a bung at the end of the output-side tube?"

... Thomasio: "the higher capacity intercooler has a bung for the 3rd component... and the intercooler tube has a bung for the Bosch sensor..."

3) an Aquamist water (or water/meth, more on that later) injection system. ("but Thomasio, what's the big deal about that?") P.S. no need for meth unless you also want to overboost w/ smaller pulley...

... Thomasio: "It's all about the temperature of the air reaching your cylinders."

4) (this is optional, and not included in the under $2k price): High flow roof, in either glass or carbon fiber. Pricing to follow.

---

How the stock Exige S system fails:

A) not enough airflow to the stock intercooler, too much pressure drop across the intercooler
B) intercooler gets too hot, can't cool the air: intake charge is less dense
C) the IAT sensor detects the super hot air
D) and/or the ECU picks up detonation
E) ECU pulls back the timing
F) engine has less dense intake charge and timing is pulled back
G) less power
H) if you have performance upgrades (think Gotham), situation is compounded
H) repeat

How the Really Light Stuff(TM) intercooler *system* works:

A) *option*: improved air ducting, whether from your Cup roof, from a S111 cup-like roof, or one of our roofs (or super-secret-yet-to-be-announced-solutions)
B) improved capacity intercooler: One, lower pressure loss = more effective boost pressure. Two, higher thermal capacitance absorbs transient temperature spikes before they cause any harm. Three, larger volume improves heat transfer from compressed air to the intercooler. Three, larger cross-sectional area and larger volume increase the heat transfer from the intercooler to the ambient air.
C) the intercooler takes its turn pulling heat out of the compressed air, but the air reaches the output tank of the intercooler where it:
D) encounters a bung w/ a water jet nozzle
E) the ultra-fine water (distillled) mist changes state from a liquid to a vapor.. water has a super high latent heat of vaporization: the heat from the compressed air is absorbed by the process of the liquid droplets changing to a vapor
F) compressed air temperature drops significantly
G) cooler compressed air travels through output-side intercooler tube...
H) to the very end, where a very familiar Bosch IAT sensor has been relocated so that it...
I) reports the lower IATs to the ECU so that...
J) the ECU advances the timing, creating the maximum possible power for this given...
K) cooler, denser, higher pressure compressed air... and feeds it into the cylinder...
L) where it is burned... and that extra moisture? Resists detonation... and... slows the rate of burn of the flame front, which...
M) pushes maximul cylinder pressures back a little bit, resulting in marginally higher torque at the crank.

Option: if you want to overboost, add the smaller compressor pulley and use a meth/water mix. (edit in progress)

Now, I have not given out all of the details of the system for a number of reasons... (uh oh, not another list!) i) tweaking is happening at this very time, ii) there are some proprietary methods to maximize the benefits of the system, and iii) conducting hot weather testing to maximize the benefits.

Data will follow: I don't expect anyone to purchase the system before you have seen the results.

Pricing: this will be under $2,000... we are working to take cost out wherever possible without sacrificing quality or performance.

Weight: uses the stock wiper fluid reservoir, and additional weight of intercooler is more than offset by weight of the intercooler tubes, therefore the only weight increase is due primarily to the weight of the Aquamist pump.

Availability: accepting orders 2 weeks from today. If you are ultra-handy, you can order components without instructions almost immediately... for those who are less handy, you will need to wait for the finalized kit and instructions.

And P.S. - there are people who haven't had luck with Aquamist, this is primarily for one or many of these reasons: 1) Wrong injection point: let the intercooler have its turn pulling heat out of the compressed air first, the Aquamist nozzle works better downstream of the intercooler (end tank is perfect location). 2) Wrong IAT sensor point: if the IAT sensor is upstream of the water injection, you are indeed cooling the compressed air, but your ECU will never know it... and thus will pull timing. 3) Incorrect water volume: too little water, and you aren't getting the optimal cooling of the compressed air... too much water, and you are decreasing the fuel density of the air/fuel mixture and/or you are slowing the flamefront too much. 4) IAT isn't downstream far enough to allow the water mist to do its thing, therefore the IAT sensor is reporting a higher temperature than the temperature of the air entering the cylinder.

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: better intercooler, removes more heat... water injection, picks up where the intercooler left off, removing even more heat (for example, a "heat soaked" intercooler won't pull enough heat out of the compressed air, so the water injection assists)... intercooler has integral water injection nozzle mounting location... intercooler-outlet tube has integral IAT sensor mounting location, optimally placed... IATs are greatly reduced... ECU is happy... engine makes power... driver smiles...

Okay, gotta go now... I hope that this satisfies your thirst for knowledge for a bit...

[9and3]

Originally Posted by Thomasio

...resulting in marginally higher torque at the crank.

I'm ignorant of the functional specifics within the Lotus ECU so please take this as a teach-me-question and not a challenge.

I thought I've read that the Elise/Exige ECU will limit the power output artificially if any modifications are made. For example, when a freer flowing intake, header, or exhaust are installed, there will be measurable power gains at first but after a couple hundred miles, the ECU adjusts and backs out the timing and/or fuel so the net gain becomes zero. Wouldn't cooling the intake air (without a software update/upgrade) also have no long-lasting benefits?

Or perhaps my basis is just an internet rumor?