Really Light Stuff Intercooler

[andrewgotanelise]

thomasaio whats with that last dynos torque scale?

[qball]

Originally Posted by keepitreal

Was totally prepared to let this go but I guess I have as bad a case of last-word-itis as you do.
You are correct, the (negative) comments about the RLS Intercooler on the other site were attributed to you, not posted by you. That is an important point. However, the spirit of a forum, philosophically, is to share information with your fellow enthusiasts/ members. No, you are not compelled to, but that's sort of the concept here. And when you stand on the principle "I'm not consumer reports for Lotus" at the same time that you're trying to unload said intercooler...I don't know, seems a little disingenous. But, your right, none the less.
Your RAC wheel analogy is not a good one imho. RAC Monolight wheels are a known, proven, widely used product from a major wheel manufacturer for which there is no lack of practical user knowledge. The RLS Intercooler is a new product being marketed by an individual and you are one of the first (if not the only) people to test it out. And, you are a respected racer, tech, and run a shop that sells products for our cars. It's only natural that those who are thinking about buying this product would be interested in your experiences.
You have chosen not to share those experiences. Period. End of discussion...I hope.

Waaah! My pussy hurts.

however, the spirit of a forum, philosophically, is to share information with your fellow enthusiasts/ members.

Says who? Oh, right... you said it, so it must be true.

So what exactly have you contributed to this forum, Mr.-I-only-have-9-posts?

Hmmm... I smell someone with 2nd login to protect their real identity...

[Randy Chase]

Originally Posted by qball

Hmmm... I smell someone with 2nd login to protect their real identity...

I don't know, seems a little disingenous.

yep.

[Thomasio]

Scale on the dyno is how it auto-scales, I could play with it but I'm out developing stuff.

And to the person w/ the "racer" friend: my "racer" could kick your "racer's" butt.

Nothing says credibility like hearsay and hidden identities. If anyone would like to challenge the validity of my dyno plots, I'm happy to bring the car to a neutral test location and you can pay to try to prove me wrong.

[charliex]

I'll take you up on the challenge, i should be out that way soon.

[Thomasio]

Originally Posted by charliex

I'll take you up on the challenge, i should be out that way soon.

I look forward to it.

[charliex]

me too, any chance you'd post the dyno run files from the dynapack if you have it (not the image file), i'd like to punch them into my little performance database calculator thingy, i can read it off the sheet, but its easier to pull them out of the dyno run, i'll be happy to share the results.

They'd be in the "Vehicle Folders" then the name the dyno shop set for your runs, if they're using a stock setup, .ABF files.

[smashfactory]

Originally Posted by Randy Chase

yep.

Reveal the troll!

[ace996]

I've no dog in this race but the I/C doesn't appear to be the issue...the issue appears to be that there isn't enough airflow to the I/C for any Air/Air I/C to be overly effective. I guess that's why some choose to mount the air/water intercoolers, and even Jacuzzis, to keep their intake temps lower...even though it is a less-desirable solution for those who roadcourse - not many race teams opt for A/W intercoolers but rely on the simpler and lighter air/air units.
Seems the real solution would be to get more air to the air/air intercooler...or other means...which leads me to:
Thomasio - what's the results with the W/I? With the smaller pulley, and the "leaning" that everyone is so paranoid about, you could probably use the progressive controller to dial-in the water/methanol enough to make a real difference. What's up?
Be good,
TomK

[keepitreal]

Originally Posted by qball

Waaah! My pussy hurts.



Says who? Oh, right... you said it, so it must be true.

So what exactly have you contributed to this forum, Mr.-I-only-have-9-posts?

Hmmm... I smell someone with 2nd login to protect their real identity...

Here's what I've contributed:

DMH purchased an RLS Intercooler. Tested it, under track conditions, and (according to Frank) communicated to Frank that A) there were no differance in charge temps from stock and B) that in fact, DMH (Don) was 1 1/2 seconds, on average slower with the RLS unit. Then, Don puts the RLS up for sale on this site.
I, then, asked Don, for all our edification, to confirm, deny, or shed light on Frank's claims. He refused.
I commend Tomasaio's efforts and contributions. I couldn't do what he's done. But if there is some other emperical data other than the data he has shown us as to the efficacy of this product, we (I) have the right to seek it out. To ask for it, when there is evidence that it exists. I hope the damn thing works! I'd like to solve this (heat soak) problem! Just give us all the info that's out there.
Who the f**k cares who I am, or how many posts I've made? Attack my logic. Many here have asked for stock vs RLS charge temps. Pretty straight forward and resonable request when the whole point of this investment is to reduce or eliminate heat soak and thereby reduce charge temps. I haven't seen that data yet.
qball, if the philosophy and spirit of a forum like this is not to share helpful information and insights with fellow enthusiasts, what do you think the point of all this is? Jeez...is this really the Emperor's new clothing?

[Smoky]

Jeez... what a bunch of women you all are. Drama, drama, drama.

Fact: Thomas has put a great deal of effort, cost, and energy into bringing new products to the Lotus market.

Fact: Thomas is testing and delivering data at the best rate he can. THIS IS NOT HIS ONLY JOB PEOPLE!!!

He doesn't wake up in the morning and walk out to the dyno in his garage, coffee-in-hand, ready to work another hard day gathering free data for all of you. He has a real job! Something I think some of you need to look into.

Have any of you guys ever been to a dyno? Or to a track? Or performed ANY kind of data logging at all? It takes TIME. MONEY. And then more TIME.

Consider this...This is not Thomas' primary focus but since April he has delivered:
-the product
-the service (the ability to buy the product and provide support as needed)
-test results (dyno and road testing).

Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

Many of you would wait for 5 years for someone like ForceFed to come out with their new headers without giving them even half the flak you've thrown at Thomas.



Opinion: You all love drama too much and need to take it to the hair salon so you can gossip it up with the other old biddies. Or join a reality TV show. Either way why not just let the guy develop and test. Let's offer open and welcoming arms to a potential vendor or parts supplier, rather than being suspicious and judgemental...

Man what I crowd... I would hate to introduce new parts to this audience (on this or any other Lotus forum, it seems). You are all so ready to hate on something new. No telling what you've missed out on by now.

[Bgwilly31]

Originally Posted by Smoky

Jeez... what a bunch of women you all are. Drama, drama, drama.

Fact: Thomas has put a great deal of effort, cost, and energy into bringing new products to the Lotus market.

Fact: Thomas is testing and delivering data at the best rate he can. THIS IS NOT HIS ONLY JOB PEOPLE!!!

He doesn't wake up in the morning and walk out to the dyno in his garage, coffee-in-hand, ready to work another hard day gathering free data for all of you. He has a real job! Something I think some of you need to look into.

Have any of you guys ever been to a dyno? Or to a track? Or performed ANY kind of data logging at all? It takes TIME. MONEY. And then more TIME.

Consider this...This is not Thomas' primary focus but since April he has delivered:
-the product
-the service (the ability to buy the product and provide support as needed)
-test results (dyno and road testing).

Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

Many of you would wait for 5 years for someone like ForceFed to come out with their new headers without giving them even half the flak you've thrown at Thomas.



Opinion: You all love drama too much and need to take it to the hair salon so you can gossip it up with the other old biddies. Or join a reality TV show. Either way why not just let the guy develop and test. Let's offer open and welcoming arms to a potential vendor or parts supplier, rather than being suspicious and judgemental...

Man what I crowd... I would hate to introduce new parts to this audience (on this or any other Lotus forum, it seems). You are all so ready to hate on something new. No telling what you've missed out on by now.

If i was making a new product i would do all the proper testing and have results before i put the product on the market.

And what he did isnt all that hard.

I dont picture myself having too much trouble coming up with a custom kit for myself if i wanted this intercooler.

Steps
1.) Find a buddy that owns a shop that can fab up custom intercoolers.
2.) Choose your core
3.) Buy your core.
4.) take back to buddy for fabbing and custom fitting.
5.) go to dyno and praise results.
6.) offer to lotus community at inflated price to make up for so much R&D.

[charliex]

>Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

not stuck at all, i can find plenty of places that have built intercoolers in less time than that, i had my custom ic built, tested and bought in 3 days.

[Smoky]

Originally Posted by charliex

>Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

not stuck at all, i can find plenty of places that have built intercoolers in less time than that, i had my custom ic built, tested and bought in 3 days.

Perhaps it was a slight over generalization to make a point, but I'm not sure that is a direct comparison either. That was a job completed for one person, done by people who do nothing but the type of work you asked them to do.

I agree that it would be nice to have more data from Thomas in the short amount of time since he introduced the kit. It would also be nice if I were a billionaire surrounded by bikini-clad women ready to handle my every whim... But the reality is that some things take time.

Some folks will be willing to wait, some folks won't. And some folks will test for themselves and decide whether or not to divulge the info. But as far as the rls gear is concerned the data has been coming through. And that's a great start. Certainly better than "here's a product" and no real motivation do any testing at all until the customers field test it themselves like many vendors in the automotive aftermarket (not just Lotus...but every car).

[fzust]

Originally Posted by charliex

>Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

not stuck at all, i can find plenty of places that have built intercoolers in less time than that, i had my custom ic built, tested and bought in 3 days.

Cool! Please post the data, dyno plots, and let me know where I can buy one. Is it on your website? Will it fit perfectly with my existing setup? Does it incorporate the water/meth injection? What variety of finishes is it available in? Thanks!

[fzust]

Originally Posted by Smoky

Jeez... what a bunch of women you all are. Drama, drama, drama.

Fact: Thomas has put a great deal of effort, cost, and energy into bringing new products to the Lotus market.

Fact: Thomas is testing and delivering data at the best rate he can. THIS IS NOT HIS ONLY JOB PEOPLE!!!

He doesn't wake up in the morning and walk out to the dyno in his garage, coffee-in-hand, ready to work another hard day gathering free data for all of you. He has a real job! Something I think some of you need to look into.

Have any of you guys ever been to a dyno? Or to a track? Or performed ANY kind of data logging at all? It takes TIME. MONEY. And then more TIME.

Consider this...This is not Thomas' primary focus but since April he has delivered:
-the product
-the service (the ability to buy the product and provide support as needed)
-test results (dyno and road testing).

Name one other vendor who has performed so well in such a short time in terms of bringing new products to the Lotus table.... that's right...keep thinking...stuck yet?

Many of you would wait for 5 years for someone like ForceFed to come out with their new headers without giving them even half the flak you've thrown at Thomas.



Opinion: You all love drama too much and need to take it to the hair salon so you can gossip it up with the other old biddies. Or join a reality TV show. Either way why not just let the guy develop and test. Let's offer open and welcoming arms to a potential vendor or parts supplier, rather than being suspicious and judgemental...

Man what I crowd... I would hate to introduce new parts to this audience (on this or any other Lotus forum, it seems). You are all so ready to hate on something new. No telling what you've missed out on by now.

+1,000,000,000

[charliex]

Originally Posted by fzust

Cool! Please post the data, dyno plots, and let me know where I can buy one. Is it on your website? Will it fit perfectly with my existing setup? Does it incorporate the water/meth injection? What variety of finishes is it available in? Thanks!

Well since you asked!

Its a spearco core specially modded for my M100, running at 18PSI of boost, had it maybe 5 years now, got to around 230 RWHP.

you can buy one here , or have your own made here, talk to turbo bob, he'll build you a custom ic no problem, and for a decent price.

Turbo Performance - For All Your Turbo Related Needs

or you can see one of the other ones made for my car here,. as well as some install pictures of some of the other stuff i had developed for it here

Lotus Elan Turbo,Lotus,Elan,Turbo,Strut Tower brace,Superchips, Chip,Fuel Pressure Regulator,Inlet pipe,Bypass valve.

lotuselancentral.com has lots of write ups and so on, seamus car was also featured in sports compact car where they did a very nice review on it, i'll see if i can find a copy and post it up !

this ones mine.

[keepitreal]

For the record...I'm not hating on, bashing, or even criticizing Thomas at all, other than with respect to the fact that AJ and others have asked for before and after temps and to date we have not seen them. Smoky, remember this post of yours?

"Would also like IAT temps before/after.

And would also like to see before/after dynos both comparing a just-warmed motor (ie. running cool) vs. a motor that has been running a bit (heat soaked) to see if the % temp increase across running time is impacted by the new intercooler. This data would not only help demonstrate the efficiency of the intercooler, it will help to weigh out the performance-per-dollar value of this mod vs something like going to a water cooled solution (which is much more expensive, but thermodynamically simpler and potentially more effective)."

I had my check book open and my pen poised to order this product when i read on the other site about Don's experience. ALL THIS "DRAMA" has been about trying to find out what our fellow LT forum member's experience was. Period. He doesn't want to tell us, fine.

My concern is that per the good work (and open sharing of information by
APK 919:

2007 Exige S Intercooler Air Flow Study

...the real problem may not be the intercooler but the lack of sufficient airflow to it. Therefore, it doesn't matter how big/ efficient the intercooler is, if it's not getting enough airflow, it's not going to solve the problem. A bigger IC may get better dyno readings for a slightly longer period of time before heat soak kicks in but i don't think we're looking for 5 more minutes of peak performance here.

Again, everything everyone has said about Thomas' efforts is true. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't seek out all the data we can before making a purchase of this magnitude.

[fzust]

I thought you meant for the Exige. Nevermind. What does the M100 weigh?

[charliex]

About 2400lbs, i think last dyno i was around 230HP but the torque steer gets bad so i held off.