Redline during break-in - LotusTalk

redbat · 09-22-2009, 02:02 AM

Hi all,

A great forum for sure and have already spent a many hours reading through many of the posts.

I picked up my s240 a week ago...and can't wipe the silly smile off my face. I owned a 97 993 porsche targa a number of years ago....and no comparison. The Exige rocks.

I was speaking to another owner who was very knowledgeable about all things Lotus and during our discussions he mentioned that it really wouldn't hurt to redline the car a few times during the initial break in period -the Toyota engines are pretty bullet proof. The caveat however being:
1) rolling start
2) completely warm engine
3) not too many times.
4) only in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear (too much load for too long a period in higher gears).

I appreciate that there could be warranty issues....but it's a separate issue.

The above advice combined with some other material I read (basically break it in like you want to drive it) + my overwhelming desire to open it up meant....confession time....I did indeed take it to 8K probably 6 times through third gear (all on a slightly downhill area and abiding by all the caveats listed above) with maybe 250 miles on the odometer.

However after reading these forums for a few hours it seems it probably wasn't advisable in most peoples opinions. Frankly I regret it.

So my questions are:

1. Do you really think that I might have done any long term damage to the engines performance?

2. If it did adversely affect the car...what would have happened? Simply less horsepower? The car still seems fine and nothing noticeable has happened.

3. Should I change the oil and filter early (as in tomorrow). Would that help at all just in case any little metal bits were in the oil? (probably the question that best shows my lack of knowledge)

My hunch is just don't do it any more and it should be fine....but just was hoping to get some reassurance from others that in my haste and excitement I haven't done any long term damage.

Thanks in advance....

kestrel74 · 09-22-2009, 04:24 AM

Ehhhhhhhhhh..... maybe OCCASIONAL bouts to 6000 or so, but I wouldn't.

...m... · 09-22-2009, 05:21 AM

...your car's probably fine, but i wouldn't do it anymore until you've completed the break-in period...

fpitas · 09-22-2009, 05:24 AM

The filter should catch any metal pieces in the oil. If you're worried, it couldn't hurt to change it, although it's probably unnecessary.

shay2nak · 09-22-2009, 09:29 AM

well they say to mix up your driving. Different RPMs in different gears and different speeds. It's ok to take it up a few times.

Monsi · 09-22-2009, 10:19 AM

there is supposed to be metal in your oil because the rings are cutting into the cylinder walls to create a good seal. just wait till 1000 then change it

MpBrady7 · 09-22-2009, 11:21 AM

I don't think it will do anything crazy, but I was told stay off 2nd cam until the 1000 mile service. Trust me you'd be surprised how much fun you can still have in a 240 on the 1st cam.

charliex · 09-22-2009, 11:41 AM

Drive it over the range, just don't stay in high rpm/load ( >4500RPM ) for long periods during break in.

If you drive it like an old lady the piston rings won't bed in.

"Spirited but gentle".

redbat · 09-23-2009, 08:10 AM

Thanks to all for the replies. Seems the consensus is that there should be no damage done.

fpitas · 09-23-2009, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monsi

there is supposed to be metal in your oil because the rings are cutting into the cylinder walls to create a good seal. just wait till 1000 then change it

After a few passes through the filter, everything over about 15 microns will be filtered out.

Chris Mackey · 09-23-2009, 08:38 AM

The owner's manual has the details.

Viggen · 09-23-2009, 10:16 AM

I just wouldn't give it 100% throttle when you are revving up there to the redline.

I was told by a engine builder to break the engine in like how you will drive it (non lotus engine). IF you take it to redline after breakin it should be done before breaking so everything is seated properly.

Vishus_1 · 09-23-2009, 11:18 AM

My understanding is one of the best things you can do early on is let the car engine break from 55 to 30 or a stop a few times.

I don't know how accurate that is but I have done it to all my cars and I certainly don't think it hurts. I would certainly minimize revving it to the max and focus on variation - driving at 55-70 on the highway and in town randomly. There will be plenty of time after break in to drive it harder if you want.

texige · 09-23-2009, 11:57 AM

We are a picky bunch. Considering most of these engines reside in Celicas that are primarily bought by owners in their 20s that dry rev the motors to 4,000 on a cold morning, change the oil every 30,000 miles and still get 150,000 miles from them, you should be fine.

rsch · 09-26-2009, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by texige

We are a picky bunch. Considering most of these engines reside in Celicas that are primarily bought by owners in their 20s that dry rev the motors to 4,000 on a cold morning, change the oil every 30,000 miles and still get 150,000 miles from them, you should be fine.

Indeed ! because our goal is to maximamise performance of or pride and joy

Hence a religious breaking in routine, then replace the oil with one of the best
synthetic that money can buy, I go with Motul 300 v double ester for the
record.

ads_green · 09-26-2009, 05:46 AM

With the toyota engine you need to take it up over the 6200 cam change point otherwise the 2nd cam will not get won in ata all before you start booting it after the 1000 mile service.

This is stated in the owners manual.

General break in rules:
1) make sure the oil is 100% up to temp - it can take ten minutes after the water is up to temp.
2) Don't over tax the engine with too much trottle in too higher a gear.
3) Try to keep under 1/2 throttle for the first few hundred miles and then under 3/4 'till the first service.
4) revs are good - after a few hundred miles start increasing the rpm. However do not engage the limiter as this is added stress the engine doesn'tneed.
5) vary speed and gears and try not to stay at the same engine speed for too long if possible.

pwn · 09-26-2009, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by texige

We are a picky bunch. Considering most of these engines reside in Celicas that are primarily bought by owners in their 20s that dry rev the motors to 4,000 on a cold morning, change the oil every 30,000 miles and still get 150,000 miles from them, you should be fine.

Right...and some how we can't figure out how to go 30,000 miles without our cam lobes wearing!

pwn · 09-26-2009, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vishus_1

My understanding is one of the best things you can do early on is let the car engine break from 55 to 30 or a stop a few times.

This draws oil up the cylinder walls

Seb · 09-26-2009, 11:27 AM

You need to load the rings in order to break in the motor.

Here is a pretty good write up: Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power

You did NOTHING wrong, and your engine will thank you in the long run. You'll have strong compression numbers for the life of it.

09-22-2009, 02:02 AM	#1 (permalink)
redbat Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 2	Redline during break-in Hi all, A great forum for sure and have already spent a many hours reading through many of the posts. I picked up my s240 a week ago...and can't wipe the silly smile off my face. I owned a 97 993 porsche targa a number of years ago....and no comparison. The Exige rocks. I was speaking to another owner who was very knowledgeable about all things Lotus and during our discussions he mentioned that it really wouldn't hurt to redline the car a few times during the initial break in period -the Toyota engines are pretty bullet proof. The caveat however being: 1) rolling start 2) completely warm engine 3) not too many times. 4) only in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear (too much load for too long a period in higher gears). I appreciate that there could be warranty issues....but it's a separate issue. The above advice combined with some other material I read (basically break it in like you want to drive it) + my overwhelming desire to open it up meant....confession time....I did indeed take it to 8K probably 6 times through third gear (all on a slightly downhill area and abiding by all the caveats listed above) with maybe 250 miles on the odometer. However after reading these forums for a few hours it seems it probably wasn't advisable in most peoples opinions. Frankly I regret it. So my questions are: 1. Do you really think that I might have done any long term damage to the engines performance? 2. If it did adversely affect the car...what would have happened? Simply less horsepower? The car still seems fine and nothing noticeable has happened. 3. Should I change the oil and filter early (as in tomorrow). Would that help at all just in case any little metal bits were in the oil? (probably the question that best shows my lack of knowledge) My hunch is just don't do it any more and it should be fine....but just was hoping to get some reassurance from others that in my haste and excitement I haven't done any long term damage. Thanks in advance....

09-22-2009, 04:24 AM	#2 (permalink)
kestrel74 G-200 Driver Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: North of Detroit; Watkins Glen, NY Posts: 9,308	Ehhhhhhhhhh..... maybe OCCASIONAL bouts to 6000 or so, but I wouldn't. __________________ 74 Europa Zetec TC Special 3614R Elise #2292 / Chrome Orange !! / Starshield / Nitron Sport SA / RTDbrace / Uprights machined / Down Low rails / ChaseCam / V1 / SS lines w/ R4-S "My daily driver does .85 Mach" " I started flying when Sex was safe and Hang Gliding was dangerous " BUY My Europa ! http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f94/...pa-sale-43829/

09-22-2009, 05:21 AM	#3 (permalink)
...m... Denuo Volatilis Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 2,715	...your car's probably fine, but i wouldn't do it anymore until you've completed the break-in period... __________________ 2005 Federal Elise \| Touring \| Storm Titanium ...73,000 miles and aging beautifully... 2000 New Beetle \| Turbo \| Reflex Silver ...107,000 miles of steadfast service...

09-22-2009, 05:24 AM	#4 (permalink)
fpitas User, Registered Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Leesburg, VA Posts: 1,827	The filter should catch any metal pieces in the oil. If you're worried, it couldn't hurt to change it, although it's probably unnecessary. __________________ Francis 2006 Chrome Orange Elise: LSD/TC, Nitron SAs with 425/650 springs, BWR 7/8" Front Bar, Eliseparts bumpsteer kit, VF Stage 2, 2bular Header + Sport Cat + 8x24 GT3 Muffler, ECU Tune by Jermaine, Smaay's fuel rail, ACT XT clutch, Saikou Michi dual catch can, Moroso pan, Manly's mount inserts & FF Engine Damper 2000 Black Integra Type R: - 213,000 miles...running again!

09-22-2009, 09:29 AM	#5 (permalink)
shay2nak I <3 chicken, I <3 liver Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Land of da 1000 Oaks, CA Posts: 15,053	well they say to mix up your driving. Different RPMs in different gears and different speeds. It's ok to take it up a few times. __________________ save ~10 lbs gain 1 hp EQ: Y=(190X) / (1984-X) where Y is (HP) and X is (lbs) '07 EXIGE S * MY CAR ** VIDEOS! '08 ACURA TSX 6-speed http://www.makeNYNYagain.com

09-22-2009, 10:19 AM	#6 (permalink)
Monsi Statistical Anomaly Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Kauai Posts: 2,291 Images: 21	there is supposed to be metal in your oil because the rings are cutting into the cylinder walls to create a good seal. just wait till 1000 then change it __________________ Dude, there's my car!

09-22-2009, 11:21 AM	#7 (permalink)
MpBrady7 IDK Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Evansville, IN Posts: 138	I don't think it will do anything crazy, but I was told stay off 2nd cam until the 1000 mile service. Trust me you'd be surprised how much fun you can still have in a 240 on the 1st cam. __________________ Proudly Engineering for TOYOTA 2008 Persian Blue Exige S240 2005 Suzuka Blue Honda S2000 - Sold

09-22-2009, 11:41 AM	#8 (permalink)
charliex OSX Black hat Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Las Vegas , NV Posts: 9,935	Drive it over the range, just don't stay in high rpm/load ( >4500RPM ) for long periods during break in. If you drive it like an old lady the piston rings won't bed in. "Spirited but gentle". __________________ Black Exige S - http://goth.am 265 Mule / Elan M100.ECU Tuning, http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39660 West Coast Lotus Meet - Las Vegas - November 6-9 2009 http://www.westcoastlotus.com/

09-23-2009, 08:10 AM	#9 (permalink)
redbat Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 2	Thanks to all for the replies. Seems the consensus is that there should be no damage done.

09-23-2009, 08:38 AM	#11 (permalink)
Chris Mackey Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 2,587	The owner's manual has the details. __________________ 2006 Elise, Ardent Red, Black Pack, LSS wheels, shocks and springs. ChuforiaGraffix.com SDD Lives On! SweetDaddyDelicious(at)hotmail(dot)com

09-23-2009, 10:16 AM	#12 (permalink)
Viggen Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 344	I just wouldn't give it 100% throttle when you are revving up there to the redline. I was told by a engine builder to break the engine in like how you will drive it (non lotus engine). IF you take it to redline after breakin it should be done before breaking so everything is seated properly. __________________ Exige S summer 2010.... hopefully

09-23-2009, 11:18 AM	#13 (permalink)
Vishus_1 Super charged! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,038 Images: 62	My understanding is one of the best things you can do early on is let the car engine break from 55 to 30 or a stop a few times. I don't know how accurate that is but I have done it to all my cars and I certainly don't think it hurts. I would certainly minimize revving it to the max and focus on variation - driving at 55-70 on the highway and in town randomly. There will be plenty of time after break in to drive it harder if you want. __________________ 2009 Exige 260 SPORT - Chrome Orange / Carbon Fiber / Black with the mustache Purchased through St Louis Motorsports

09-23-2009, 11:57 AM	#14 (permalink)
texige Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: austin texas Posts: 839	We are a picky bunch. Considering most of these engines reside in Celicas that are primarily bought by owners in their 20s that dry rev the motors to 4,000 on a cold morning, change the oil every 30,000 miles and still get 150,000 miles from them, you should be fine.

09-26-2009, 05:46 AM	#16 (permalink)
ads_green Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 348	With the toyota engine you need to take it up over the 6200 cam change point otherwise the 2nd cam will not get won in ata all before you start booting it after the 1000 mile service. This is stated in the owners manual. General break in rules: 1) make sure the oil is 100% up to temp - it can take ten minutes after the water is up to temp. 2) Don't over tax the engine with too much trottle in too higher a gear. 3) Try to keep under 1/2 throttle for the first few hundred miles and then under 3/4 'till the first service. 4) revs are good - after a few hundred miles start increasing the rpm. However do not engage the limiter as this is added stress the engine doesn'tneed. 5) vary speed and gears and try not to stay at the same engine speed for too long if possible.

09-26-2009, 11:27 AM	#19 (permalink)
Seb <3 QR25DE Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 752	You need to load the rings in order to break in the motor. Here is a pretty good write up: Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power You did NOTHING wrong, and your engine will thank you in the long run. You'll have strong compression numbers for the life of it. Last edited by Seb : 09-26-2009 at 11:48 AM.

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