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Old 11-24-2012, 08:02 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Comparisons to other cars?

I don't really see this mentioned on here much and I don't have any experience with the aftermarket forced induction options but i'm trying to get an idea of the scale of performance to be expected from supercharging my Elise.

I currently have a 2005 Elise that i've owned since 2006 and i'm looking to upgrade it finally. It is used mostly on the street. I've driven and been in Evo X's, E92 M3's, a 2008 Gallardo Superleggera, Jag XKR-S, Cayman S, and a few others. I've also driven an Exige S220.

I'm looking at either the VF supercharger or a BOE Rev300 or Rev400 kit, and am curious what I can look to compare to in terms of performance 0-60, 0-100, 60-100, etc compared to other vehicles. I've heard that an Elise at around 300hp is comparable to a F430, and that one with 400 hp is more comparable to a 458, is this pretty accurate? I'm really looking for a kit that will remain balanced with the capabiities of the chassis and not just burn through tires anytime I go near the throttle while still keep the car feeling new and comparable to some of the newer stuff on the market like 911 Turbos, GT-R's, Gallardo LP560, 458, etc.. I don't really care about performance above 120mph and I know this isn't the car for that sort of thing.
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Old 11-24-2012, 08:57 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Not sure how you searched but this has been mentioned here many many many times:

What to choose supercharger or turbo

Turbo V.S. Supercharger Which one & Why?

Where to purchase a Supercharger or Turbo?

Supercharger vs Turbocharger

Turbo or Supercharger: Which is better for track duty?

Turbocharge or Supercharger?

Does a supercharger give supercar performance ?

Supercharger Information

Vision Function Supercharger Install

Next Generation in Supercharging Means 275whp!
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I've read thread after thread of comparisons between stock NA, VF, BOE kits, FF275, etc comparing Torque, HP, reliability, etc.. but never saw much about what the real world end results are compared to other vehicles in real world use. I realize after 60mph these things hit a brick wall due to the downforce the produce, but I never really hear how all those numbers add up. It's one thing to say "Supercharger X makes X HP/Torque" but another thing to say "My car with X SC kit accelerates similarly to X car up to X mph".

I see a lot of people post "I just installed X supercharger and it's soooo much faster!" but it's hard to put that in perspective compared to other things. Is "soo much faster" equivalent to a Evo? M3? 911? 911 Turbo? Turbo S? I'd be really happy to be performance-wise under 100mph comparable to a 997 911 GT3 or F430, i'm just trying to figure out if 300hp will accomplish that or if I need to look at going higher.
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Old 11-24-2012, 12:53 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I think that is partially due to the fact that most of us don't care how our cars compare in a straight line to other cars. To most of us what matters is mid-range acceleration, I could care less if car X is faster than I am off the line as I never race someone off the line, I only race them on the track (where there are so many factors).

My advice is decide what you feel like is lacking in the car and change that. I mean really, how many 458s do you intend on rolling up next to here in Colorado, there are what, 4? For me I'd put any 458 owner against my car on the track and I'd bet money I'd crush them every time.

What part of CO are you in? Up here FI will definitely make a difference, I've just decided I'll never do mine. I care far more about handling and reliability than I do straight line speed. Have you been out to HPR, PPIR or PMP yet?
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:08 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I live near I25 and Arapahoe Rd. I couldn't care less about quarter mile times or drag racing people at lights either. I drive my car because I enjoy it and it's fun to take out on weekend drives. I've driven lots of other vehicles of various types and was just hoping to put some context into things. I know this car will never be a 458, it's not supposed to be. I haven't been to HPR yet but I intend to finally get my Elise out there next spring. The biggest obstacle is time from working 2 jobs and the cost of tires/brakes. The biggest thing i'm looking to improve is the power on tap when in higher gears and the low end acceleration from a rolling start. For example, I really liked the way the Superleggera accelerated on the freeway from 60mph to 100 without having to downshift and am looking to improve that aspect of my car. These are the sorts of things im curious about since i've never ridden in any of the aftermarket supercharged Lotus'.
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:26 PM   #6 (permalink)
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We should meet up sometime as I'm not that far north of you, I'm at I25 and 104th, or up near Flatiron's Mall. We should get you a ride/drive in Frank Amoroso's Elise, he has the Rev310 kit and it's an absolute monster. From what you describe I'd think you'd want something like that - great mid-range torque. Honestly it would probably feel stronger than a 458 as it's far more visceral. So if you don't care about the actual number/race you're in the right car.

Ping me if you ever want to head out to HPR as I (and Frank) instruct with a number of the clubs and can help steer you in the right direction. Warning - it's more addictive (and expensive) than drugs ;-)
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:55 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Well I live in north Texas where the roads are flat and straight for as far as you can see, so how well it handles is almost useless around here.

My car has as measured so far 260HP at the wheels, which as much as I hate to admit is less then any of those kits your looking at is supposed to deliver.

Here is how my car has faired so far in straight line
60 to 120MPH Accelleration
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:39 PM   #8 (permalink)
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My elise is a about 270rwhp with some weight saving and it's faster than a 2010 Cts-v stock from 50-150 mph like 1-2 cars, about 3 cars faster than a c5 z06 with intake and exhaust 50-150 and lot faster than a 2013 5.0 and 2013 boss 302. Pretty much its a high 11s car.
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Old 11-25-2012, 12:05 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Rev 400

I have the Rev 400 with a bit of a built motor, all done in my garage. As this is my daily driver it has to be reliable daily and when I do autocrosses and track days. The car with this setup is fantastic, tons of torque and heaps of acceleration (12.01qtr mile) not really any downside to it, but I do all the work myself. With this setup and its short inlet tract length it has no lag and just explodes with power in low gears. That said, being mid engined it does not light up the tires if you don't want it to.
Have fun.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:59 AM   #10 (permalink)
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My car: 06 Elise, built engine, turbo-charged (8psi), 300hp, modified suspension, etc

Track driven cars: MC12, Saleen S7 twin turbo, Porsche twin turbo (plus many more), Gallardo, Ferrari 430/360/355/348, BMW's (lots), Radical SR3, EVO

The lotus is the most engaging of the group. Bang for dollar you will not get a better ride. Many of the cars listed above are very fast but lack the driver engagement feel. I dont even want to drive the GTR or LFA. They are extremely fast but essentially computer driven. Take a driver trained in one of these cars and put him in a Lotus and you've got a disaster waiting to happen. When I take the owners of these cars out in the Lotus they are amazed at the direct connection the Lotus gives you. Other cars just don;t seem to compare.
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:06 AM   #11 (permalink)
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You can look few videos on youtube for my car under eliseeuropa for comparaison on straight at the track. My car have around 270 whp based on a Rev300 wioth a close ratio gearbox. In straight, it is faster than most GT3 under 125 mph, but slower than a GT3 2012 RS. Slower than a Corvette at 600 hp. I don't really car about mustang or M3.
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:10 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evansp60 View Post
My car: 06 Elise, built engine, turbo-charged (8psi), 300hp, modified suspension, etc

Track driven cars: MC12, Saleen S7 twin turbo, Porsche twin turbo (plus many more), Gallardo, Ferrari 430/360/355/348, BMW's (lots), Radical SR3, EVO

The lotus is the most engaging of the group. Bang for dollar you will not get a better ride. Many of the cars listed above are very fast but lack the driver engagement feel. I dont even want to drive the GTR or LFA. They are extremely fast but essentially computer driven. Take a driver trained in one of these cars and put him in a Lotus and you've got a disaster waiting to happen. When I take the owners of these cars out in the Lotus they are amazed at the direct connection the Lotus gives you. Other cars just don;t seem to compare.
Totally agree

I went to a recent track event in my 211 with my buddy who had a Scud. Guess who was faster?
We did ride-alongs and when he was passenger in my car his words were: "Insane!!!"
When I was passenger in his car, I felt like I was in a bus
As a track car Lotus is above and beyond most.

I have a 430 Spider and my previous street Elise had the old BWR s/c which only dynoed 223 rwhp (around 260 crank). Dyno #'s would say that my 430 is faster. However, the Elise is/was more fun to drive IMO. The SC adds much more low end torque which made the car "feel" so much faster.


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Old 11-25-2012, 03:00 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Well I live in north Texas where the roads are flat and straight for as far as you can see, so how well it handles is almost useless around here.
Eagles Canyon Raceway

Mapquest says 56 minutes from Fort Worth...
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:49 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I've read thread after thread of comparisons between stock NA, VF, BOE kits, FF275, etc comparing Torque, HP, reliability, etc.. but never saw much about what the real world end results are compared to other vehicles in real world use. I realize after 60mph these things hit a brick wall due to the downforce the produce, but I never really hear how all those numbers add up. It's one thing to say "Supercharger X makes X HP/Torque" but another thing to say "My car with X SC kit accelerates similarly to X car up to X mph".

I see a lot of people post "I just installed X supercharger and it's soooo much faster!" but it's hard to put that in perspective compared to other things. Is "soo much faster" equivalent to a Evo? M3? 911? 911 Turbo? Turbo S? I'd be really happy to be performance-wise under 100mph comparable to a 997 911 GT3 or F430, i'm just trying to figure out if 300hp will accomplish that or if I need to look at going higher.
Frostycomer passed a 700 hp Porsche turbo the other day on the track - he's got a REV 400 running the smaller pulley on a stock motor. Rev 400 cars will be in the mid to hi 3's 0-60. My REv400 is going through the stock cat, and still makes 335hp.Nice street setup. I can pass just about anyone, at anytime with my REV400.
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Old 11-25-2012, 08:34 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Frostycomer passed a 700 hp Porsche turbo the other day on the track - he's got a REV 400 running the smaller pulley on a stock motor. Rev 400 cars will be in the mid to hi 3's 0-60. My REv400 is going through the stock cat, and still makes 335hp.Nice street setup. I can pass just about anyone, at anytime with my REV400.
Do you suppose Frostycomer could post his track footage here?:
Post your track videos here!

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Old 11-25-2012, 09:41 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Eagles Canyon Raceway

Mapquest says 56 minutes from Fort Worth...
Motor Sport Ranch is only about 20 minutes from my house. Race tracks are not indicative of real world enviornment through.
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Old 11-26-2012, 02:18 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Old 11-26-2012, 07:11 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Do you suppose Frostycomer could post his track footage here?:
Post your track videos here! - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community

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pretty sure there was no film, but he talked to the other driver who freely admitted that the Lotus was just plain faster. His car must be faster than $hit. I say that because he is making 50 hp +/- more than me, and my car is pretty quick.
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Last edited by komiko; 11-26-2012 at 07:18 PM.
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Old 11-29-2012, 03:25 PM   #19 (permalink)
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if you're up at high elevations a lot it seems a turbo kit might be better as it'll make the same power regardless of elevation... (at least that's my understanding of turbo systems) where as SC's like a N/A car will suffer at higher elevation. I'm partial to the simplicity, efficiency, and stock look of the rev300 kit, but but if those are not priorities, then a turbo could be really nice at elevation (i rarely see real elevation in my car). Any of the kits you're looking at i think you should strongly consider a fuel and oil starve solution while you're at it because you'll be burning quite a bit more fuel on track (much easier to run low and not realize it) and you going to need sticky tires to keep the rear on the ground unless you want a big wing on the back. (It's the sticky tires and track duty which puts the motor at risk for oil and fuel starve).
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:35 PM   #20 (permalink)
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The way to compare different vehicles is to compare the (weight/hp) number.

the elise would be 1900/190 = 10 pounds per horse power
the carrera gt would be 3000/612 = 4.9 pounds per horse power

so dont race a carrera gt.
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