Eyelise's TVS install

[Dragon]

Originally Posted by turbophil

Hey Jeff,

I've installed a couple of them and they pressed on using the mounting bolts and torqing in a star pattern. Just little by little as to maintain squareness on the crank. A little grease on the surfaces would help too...

If it just won't budge, throw the fidanza in the oven at 200* for 30 minutes minutes. Then it would probably just slide right on.... It would be best not remove much material unless on a lathe to ensure that there's no chance you don't loose the hub-centric quality of the part...

Chat later,

Phil

You sure you wouldn't want to put the fly wheel in the freezer (so it will shrink...) Heating it up will cause it to expand and fit even tighther...

[turbophil]

Originally Posted by Dragon

You sure you wouldn't want to put the fly wheel in the freezer (so it will shrink...) Heating it up will cause it to expand and fit even tighther...

Pretty sure... I believe in this case the hole would expand "out word", as the whole part would grow... Freeze the crank and heat the flywheel.... kinda hard to freeze the crank though

The webbing on the flywheel is big enough that it might expand inward, but it wouldn't in a traditional sense of press fitting something on... Would think it would be just like pressing a bearing into an engine case, i.e. heat the case and freeze the bearing...In any event, I always use the bolts to suck 'em on to the crank

Later buddy,

Phil

[Dragon]

Originally Posted by turbophil

Pretty sure... I believe in this case the hole would expand "out word", as the whole part would grow... Freeze the crank and heat the flywheel.... kinda hard to freeze the crank though

The webbing on the flywheel is big enough that it might expand inward, but it wouldn't in a traditional sense of press fitting something on... Would think it would be just like pressing a bearing into an engine case, i.e. heat the case and freeze the bearing...In any event, I always use the bolts to suck 'em on to the crank

Later buddy,

Phil

I would think it would expand in as well as out... I would think the best bet would be to freeze both (if possible) so they both shrink..

[turbophil]

I don't think so... As long as the whole part is heated, it should increase the ID of the flywheel as well as the OD...

A quote from jeff: "The manual says the aluminum flywheel has to go on tighter due to the fact it expands at twice the rate of steel when heated. It even suggests heating the flywheel up on a hot plate."

Which follows traditional press-fit, heating and cooling practice... If you're ever board, give it a try and mic the ID before and after. I installed a fidanza in a customer's car over the weekend. Would have been a good opportunity to try it then His press fit on as normal though, so there was no need to get creative...

Later,

TP

[luxige]

Phil's right; the entire part stays the same shape, just gets bigger. So the hole becomes bigger too. Standard machinist/patternmaker practice.

This also works for freeing up a stuck pressed-in shaft, even though you have to heat the two parts together. The whole assembly gets larger, so the minute gap between the two parts increases also.

[Dragon]

Roger that.. I guess it would have to do with uniform heating of the whole part... I was thinking along the lines of if you take say a 2 inch hole saw and start drilling in to a fairly thick piece of aluminum it will swell and start pinching the blade as it heats up. You can get the same issue when chopping thick pieces of aluminum with a chop saw or jig saw as well. I guess this would be do to localized heating of just the cut area of the part and not the whole part.

[erics75218]

great thread, inspirational...now if I just had a garage......and a lift......and some tools.....

damn you California

[Eyelise]

Yup,

I confirm the Fidanza fitment tips included heating. I re-read them and they also mentioned a file could be used to remove excess material if necessary. I chose the later. It went on like the OEM flywheel. I don't think the expansional differential will cause problems. The flywheel was followed by the friction and pressure plate. I replaced the release bearing as well. I spent a lot of time with the alignment tool adjusting the position of the friction plate while tightening the pressure plate bolts. It really amounted to eyeballing the center splines of the friction plate ensuring it was centered with respect to the opening in the pressure plate. I'm not sure if there is a better way.

Originally Posted by turbophil

I don't think so... As long as the whole part is heated, it should increase the ID of the flywheel as well as the OD...

A quote from jeff: "The manual says the aluminum flywheel has to go on tighter due to the fact it expands at twice the rate of steel when heated. It even suggests heating the flywheel up on a hot plate."

Which follows traditional press-fit, heating and cooling practice... If you're ever board, give it a try and mic the ID before and after. I installed a fidanza in a customer's car over the weekend. Would have been a good opportunity to try it then His press fit on as normal though, so there was no need to get creative...

Later,

TP

[Eyelise]

The real challenge was getting the transaxle bolted back to the engine block. The input shaft has to slide thru the pressure plate opening and into the splined friction plate. The angle has to be perfect. Fitment is complicated by limited clearance laterally and to the rear. After many hours of struggling I came to the conclusion that you have to tilt the engine near on end to get the necessary clearance. I then aligned all the holes using several jacks/floor stands. I pushed and pulled and it finally popped into place. As sad as it might be, that moment was as pleasing as any.....well use your imagination.

[Eyelise]

I spent a good part of the day installing the innovative motor mounts and the TRD toe link brace. I used directions on Sector 111 site. The directions are quite good. I installed the right one first, the front one next (hardest to get to) then the left followed by the rear. The left motor mount did not align with the chasis holes. I tried for quite some time to get it into positon. Finally I tried the OEM mount and found it aligned perfectly. I had to ovalize the mount holes a bit more which fixed the problem. I worked on the rear mount last b/c I'm installing the toe link brace.

[Eyelise]

I discovered that the spacers provided with the TRD brace do not fit with the innovative mounts. Off to the hardware store Monday.

[Eyelise]

Once I have the toe links together I'll reinstall the left suspension and put both drive axles back into the tranny.

[Eyelise]

Back to work, was on vaca with family and at Pocono with M3. I got the starter put back together at a cost of $50. Also ordered new outer Toe links for the TRD brace. The tranny is together but I need a new torque wrench to get in the tight spots. Any have suggestions on a brand? I'm going to put the drive axles in today. To date I have finished the Clutch/flywheel, motor mounts, and TRD brace, and new steering arms. Now on to the fuel upgrade, EFI, and supercharger.

[robains]

Sweet -- more pics and keep'em coming.

Rob

[Eyelise]

Only had an hour or two but I managed to put both driveshafts back in the transaxle. It was much easier than removing. The left driveshaft was a pain to remove but using the right tools it popped back in in about 30sec.To get it back in I placed the "claw" side against the inner housing and gave the other end a wack with a rubber mallet. It popped right in.

[Eyelise]

Just remember to grease the "C" clip well and it should be a snap I'm still waiting for the outer toe links to finish the TRD install.

[Eyelise]

Next up is the Fuel system upgrade. I also ordered an Oil Catch Can (OCC) that I will install at the same time. A friend had a SC engine failure resulting from oil sucked into the intake from the crank case. He has cool pics of huge plums of blue smoke trailing behind him on the front straight at the Glen. It sounds like a good idea for any FI engine. Apparently Lotus is installing OCCs on the cup cars and 211s. They bought a huge batch from Michi Suaiti (?spelling). I did notice Robains has the GReddy one. The install on the one I ordered looks like it will work with a clam tilt if I should go that way.

[sleepe]

I am pretty sure engine failure isn't solely attributable to oil being sucked into the intake.

[Westrock]

Originally Posted by sleepe

I am pretty sure engine failure isn't solely attributable to oil being sucked into the intake.

Just to reinforce this, pretty much any production vehicle sold in the United States since the mid 90's has been sucking oil through the intake (emissions law).

Not that a catch can is bad, but just realize that engines CAN deal with it. Now pushing the limits of the octane rating and then introducing oil which reduces the effective rating can lead to problems.

[Eyelise]

Very true although the Elise is different. We all know the Elise traps oil in the head when cornering. If you then add FI the oil can potentially be dumped into the intake a quart at a time. This is what was thought to have happened to my friends car. It was a catastrophic failure after a sweeping turn with huge amnts of blue smoke. I doubt this would happen if our engines oil return drains were adequate.

Originally Posted by Westrock

Just to reinforce this, pretty much any production vehicle sold in the United States since the mid 90's has been sucking oil through the intake (emissions law).

Not that a catch can is bad, but just realize that engines CAN deal with it. Now pushing the limits of the octane rating and then introducing oil which reduces the effective rating can lead to problems.