New SC Kit.

[ace996]

Originally Posted by charliex

Mot doing meth/water injection, i'm not a huge fan of it, since what happens when you run out, or forget to fill etc.


.

Very disappointing...
Run out or forget to fill?..you mean like letting your car run out of gas???
They have low-level sensors, like the ones in windshield washer bottles, and flow meters that let you know when the system isn't spraying due to a malfunction. The current units are as safe as can be...running out unexpectedly doesn't happen.

Shame, as an intercooler is not even needed and bettered in performance by a properly set-up and tuned meth/water injection system.

Perhaps in the future you'll try one out and that would be something I'd be very interested in.

Be good,
TomK

[TroyLotus]

What amount of boost with the different pully's?

[charliex]

Its just personal preference for water injection, i'd rather just have it fire and forget.

Pulley sizes,a nywhere between 7 and 10lbs really, though an updated clutch would be in order for the sub 3"'s

[2-Y-CHROMOSOMES]

Originally Posted by charliex

Its just personal preference for water injection, i'd rather just have it fire and forget.

Pulley sizes,a nywhere between 7 and 10lbs really, though an updated clutch would be in order for the sub 3"'s

You know charlie I think I will delete my previous post. I was just chit chatting and I do not want this to deter what this thread is about.

[chuck_risen]

Originally Posted by charliex

Its just personal preference for water injection, i'd rather just have it fire and forget.

Pulley sizes,a nywhere between 7 and 10lbs really, though an updated clutch would be in order for the sub 3"'s

+1

One less thing to have to check and to go low on giving me a little light to look at. I am not a fan of nitrous either. When you run out all you have is a bunch of piping and tanks which is dead weight. Great if I was going to drag race but the Elise/Exige were not designed for drag racing.

[charliex]

Originally Posted by 2-Y-CHROMOSOMES

You know charlie I think I will delete my previous post. I was just chit chatting and I do not want this to deter what this thread is about.

no worries mark, i'm all about the chit chatting plus you posted actual info,

If enough people wanted WI then i'm sure it'd be considered, just seems like something only a small percentage of the small percentage that want or need an FI application would go for.

[ace996]

Originally Posted by chuck_risen

+1

One less thing to have to check and to go low on giving me a little light to look at. I am not a fan of nitrous either. When you run out all you have is a bunch of piping and tanks which is dead weight. Great if I was going to drag race but the Elise/Exige were not designed for drag racing.

Chuck,
Not to go OT but water injection is used by every WRC car...not drag-racing. Formula1 used to use it, too. Not comparable to drag racing.
Just an FYI, here's my STI on a conservative dyno tune for roadcourse duty with meth/water injection and my boost/AFR maps, too. Believe me, my system is not "dead weight"...and my AFRs are well within safety levels where my motor would not go BOOM if my system malfunctioned...





Now I'm sure you'd be interested in a gain like that, with NO HEATSOAK, and a spotless-clean combustion chamber... just need to fill the tank when the little light tells you to...

Sorry for the thread jack, it won't happen again.

Be good,
TomK

[dmh]

ace996-

Don't get me wrong; I use water/meth on a few eaton s/c track cars. But I thought you might be able to answer this since you are a "lateral g-addict": how do you control the mixture from pickup starvation when the tank is running low and you are in a corner. And how big a tank do you think is required for 1 hour of track duty (the length of most enduros not requiring a 5 minute pit stop)?

Thanks,
Don

[uglyduck]

I have a custom made 1.5 gallon meth/water tank and can get a full track day out of it no problem. The Aquamist system I am using has a low level warning light so at 1/4 tank a light on my dash tells me I should fill up. Another safety feature is a sensor that twitches to a lower state of tune ans well as shuts off the pump if it senses meth/water starvation.
I like Charlie's intercooler setup, so maybe will be able to add it in the near future.....

Originally Posted by dmh

ace996-

Don't get me wrong; I use water/meth on a few eaton s/c track cars. But I thought you might be able to answer this since you are a "lateral g-addict": how do you control the mixture from pickup starvation when the tank is running low and you are in a corner. And how big a tank do you think is required for 1 hour of track duty (the length of most enduros not requiring a 5 minute pit stop)?

Thanks,
Don

[turbophil]

Guys, before we all get too far OT with all the water/meth injections or spraying, let Charlie do some real world track testing/posting on how fast the IC cools down from sitting in traffic or slow speeds. At the end of the day, this system may not really have much heatsoak to contend with...

Heat soak is only an issue if the IC can't get enough air-flow at speed and/or if the IC is simply too small. Remember well designed A/A ICs cool down very quickly... At this point, we don't have any data saying that heat soak is going to be an issue with this setup.

Personally, before I'd go strapping injection/spraying systems on the car, I'd adjust the tune to deal with potential heatsoak... Something tells me that Charlie is on the same page. Leave the water for the WRC and old F1 cars

Best,

Phil

[Mattnshilp]

Wow Charlie, you just answered my question as to whether I should enter Elise'dom with a stock Elise or an Elise SC...

I'll go Elise and "The Charlie SuperCharger" or TCS for short - for lack of a more formal name...

I'll be anxiously watching and waiting with the others...

Thanks.

[Ol'Racer]

Originally Posted by turbophil

Guys, before we all get too far OT with all the water/meth injections or spraying, let Charlie do some real world track testing/posting on how fast the IC cools down from sitting in traffic or slow speeds. At the end of the day, this system may not really have much heatsoak to contend with...

Heat soak is only an issue if the IC can't get enough air-flow at speed and/or if the IC is simply too small. Remember well designed A/A ICs cool down very quickly... At this point, we don't have any data saying that heat soak is going to be an issue with this setup.

And not all the cars were dragsters. A few had them set up for tracking or moutain roads. Handling and braking!

Personally, before I'd go strapping injection/spraying systems on the car, I'd adjust the tune to deal with potential heatsoak... Something tells me that Charlie is on the same page. Leave the water for the WRC and old F1 cars

Best,

Phil

Exactly! And when we were doing this (TB days 15-20 years ago) we just used the intercoolers A/A for cooling and used meth/alchy instead of 117-112-etc for octane. We also mixed Toluene114-Ethanol116-Xylene 117-mixed with X amount of gas in our main tanks.

We later used ---methanol113...in the spray tank when running boost (some guys running 35+ lbs of boost. Even tried Xylene instead of Meth. Keeping the engine clean ? That was a residual effect and not purposeful. With all of the octane we were pushing through the engine...IT WAS CLEAN!!!

Nothing new...no revelations...all old school. Nothing wrong with old school, but like Phil, I'd say let the intercooler tests play first. JMO

Not all the guys were dragsters. Some had their cars setup for tracking (Willow Springs) or mountain driving.

So Meth/alchy/water was used in place of OCTANE ...Not in place of an intercooler or innercooler. This was proven by literally thousands of guys in the know.

I'm with Phil---just let Charlie do his thing and not try to discover the Americas again. It's already been done.

[andrewgotanelise]

what are the dimensions of the intercooler?

[BrianK]

Originally Posted by Ol'Racer

So Meth/alchy/water was used in place of OCTANE ...Not in place of an intercooler or innercooler. This was proven by literally thousands of guys in the know.

+1

Good to see an IC solution for the Elise.

[charliex]

Do WRC rules limit boost ?

[Thomasio]

Originally Posted by charliex

Mot doing meth/water injection, i'm not a huge fan of it, since what happens when you run out, or forget to fill etc.

Wait a minute Charlie, you have to be careful when you rule water/meth out.

If a car is tuned so aggresively that it *relies* on water/methanol injection simply to run without detonation, that is a circumstance where you cannot run out of water/methanol.

In other cases, such as the RLS water/methanol injection, you won't harm anything by running out... you just won't see the decreased intake air temperatures until you refill.

Agreed, yes?

[charliex]

I'd like to see a data log of say a 15 degree hill for 3 minutes at sustained load in 5 or 6th gear with a water injection system and the resulting inlet/outlet temperatures, with 90o ambient, preferably with a base line too.

[andrewgotanelise]

Originally Posted by charliex

I'd like to see a data log of say a 15 degree hill for 3 minutes at sustained load in 5 or 6th gear with a water injection system and the resulting inlet/outlet temperatures, with 90o ambient, preferably with a base line too.

was my question purposefully avoided? I understand if its a secret

[charliex]

Originally Posted by andrewgotanelise

was my question purposefully avoided? I understand if its a secret

nope, i don't have the exact dimensions for you yet. i'll post it when i have it.

[andrewgotanelise]

Originally Posted by charliex

nope, i don't have the exact dimensions for you yet. i'll post it when i have it.

thanks!