Ronin 4.5 Turbo Build

[VBCARGUY]

I would just like to know why people think this whole idea is so new. Forcefed has already done this and sells kits. Are people taking crazy pills?

[FLuXeXigeS]

maybe so lotus owners has a choice, variety of mods etc.

[ace996]

Originally Posted by VBCARGUY

I would just like to know why people think this whole idea is so new. Forcefed has already done this and sells kits. Are people taking crazy pills?

What? Are you saying you're not impressed by someone putting a turbo on a Japanese 4-cyl motor? Sir, you must run with a pretty wild crowd (they probably experiment with hallucinogens and water-injection, too) to not be impressed by the trailblazing inventions going on here. Next thing you'll say is that a water/air intercooler isn't revolutionary....

[GTsRasta]

Originally Posted by VBCARGUY

I would just like to know why people think this whole idea is so new. Forcefed has already done this and sells kits. Are people taking crazy pills?

1) Hasn't their kit selling stopped in wake of the supercharger wave?

2) Ronin's using a turbo similar in size to a Garrett GT30 series turbo for 400+ whp. Forcedfed maxed out their GT28 series turbo setup at 350 whp, and that's with water injection as well.

3) Wouldn't you like to see what supercar performance this guy can put down on a turbocharged 400+ whp Lotus now that he's bored with 300 supercharged whp?

It's not like I said putting that much power in a Lotus would be an interesting idea back when if first signed on the site or anything...

OH LOOK!!! I'M POSTING IN A THREAD THAT WILL HAVE A 400+ WHP LOTUS WHEN COMPLETED!

[FLuXeXigeS]

yea i believe the GT28 turbo runs an internal wastegate, and its easy to max out, def not good for ~400whp

[ace996]

The point is that nothing there is revolutionary...it's been done on a thousand cars before, no big deal...no re-inventing the wheel.

What will be interesting to see is the cooling of the charge temps, which with an air/water intercooler, not the best design for cooling intake temps, with over 20lbs of boost. Air increases in temp about 10degrees for every psi in boost...so on a 90 degree day a 20psi turbo motor is blowing at least 300degrees IATs before the intercooler.
Getting the IATs close to ambient, especially after several runs when much heat is produced, may be difficult for an air/water system....heatsoak is always knocking on the door. There are very few, if any, modern raceteams that use air/water intercoolers for their cars due to the inability for enough heat to be released...they all opt for large air/air intercoolers...but Frank's been known to add an additional heatexchanger or half-dozen to shed that heat, so all should be well. Worse comes to worse, a few feet of base-board heating radiator could be run under the car with a cooler filled with ice-cubes in the trunk....that should do it.

Or water-injection can be used and the IATs can go below ambient, as they've done on thousands of cars, shattering the performance of an a/w intercooler. And think of how much money one can save installing one W/I kit vs a half-dozen heatexchangers and two water pumps, let alone the weight savings.

Here's a pretty graph of the IAT drop with different levels of W/I....


No intercooler, unless it's filled with ice...which is not feasable on the roadcourse, can drop IATs under ambient...NONE. If the mixture goes to 50%methanol/50%water, IATs will drop even further....and then performance will mimic race-gas tunes....which will be pretty impressive on any GT turbo!!!


More to come...

[Casey]

Originally Posted by GTsRasta

1) Hasn't their kit selling stopped in wake of the supercharger wave?

2) Ronin's using a turbo similar in size to a Garrett GT30 series turbo for 400+ whp. Forcedfed maxed out their GT28 series turbo setup at 350 whp, and that's with water injection as well.

3) Wouldn't you like to see what supercar performance this guy can put down on a turbocharged 400+ whp Lotus now that he's bored with 300 supercharged whp?

It's not like I said putting that much power in a Lotus would be an interesting idea back when if first signed on the site or anything...

OH LOOK!!! I'M POSTING IN A THREAD THAT WILL HAVE A 400+ WHP LOTUS WHEN COMPLETED!

Once again...lack of facts being posted by Mr Rasta...
1. We are currently using a 2871 and we make up to 395whp depending on boost levels.
2. We tested larger larger turbos(3076..3037..3076/2871 hybrid) back in 2005 and found that thay didn't deliver the appropriate powerband for what most people use these vehicles for.
3. We don't run water injection...tested it once and didn't find it needed.


I can personally say 400whp in this chassis is downright insane and would not want anymore than that on a track. We have many pro drivers test our car and most of them prefer to run it at lower power levels(@340whp) as that seems to be the sweet spot as far as balance and power are concerned.

[Casey]

Might as well go for the big numbers......1.8l

[sleepless]

Water injection is nice when it is working properly. My experience with Aquamist on an E36 M3 is that it works, but is also yet another point of failure that was aggravating so I eventually just removed it. Not mention the insane noise the pump makes!

[ace996]

Originally Posted by sleepless

Not mention the insane noise the pump makes!

Where did you have it mounted? Was it the Shurflo or the ERL pump?

On my Z06, it was in the front left quarterpanel, on the STI, it's in the right-rear quarterpanel...never heard it, not because it's not loud but because the exhaust pretty much drowns out everything on both cars.

Be good,
TomK

[sleepless]

Originally Posted by ace996

Where did you have it mounted? Was it the Shurflo or the ERL pump?

On my Z06, it was in the front left quarterpanel, on the STI, it's in the right-rear quarterpanel...never heard it, not because it's not loud but because the exhaust pretty much drowns out everything on both cars.

Be good,
TomK

Front right quarter panel. It wasn't the noise of the pump so much as it was the noise resulting from the vibration. I can't remember which of the two was installed. It was only at start up when it was priming.

[GTsRasta]

I swore I read somewhere you hit 350 whp with water injection...my mistake.

[charliex]

It'll be our first proper stock ecu turbo without a piggyback or standalone, so its new in that sense, hopefully that in turn will help the people that've contacted me loooking for a turbo tune thats more off the shelf and doesn't require scratch tuning.

probably heading out wed nite/thursday to start tuning at LAPD, woke up with a migraine this am so i hope it clears before we hit the dyno, not a fun place to be with that.

i agree with casey though 400HP is nuts.

[GTsRasta]

Is it true you added a MAP sensor to his car?

[VBCARGUY]

Originally Posted by FLuXeXigeS

maybe so lotus owners has a choice, variety of mods etc.

I am not saying that its not cool or that its not good to have a couple turbo options. I am just saying that this has been done before by Forcedfed.

Go for it I hope the goal of 400 HP is reached. It would be a monster.

[charliex]

Originally Posted by GTsRasta

Is it true you added a MAP sensor to his car?

sort of its running a wide band for the pre 02 sensor too, has 100 octane map switchable by the throttle maps (when its off), remote tuning etc.

[over40]

Originally Posted by charliex

It'll be our first proper stock ecu turbo without a piggyback or standalone, so its new in that sense, hopefully that in turn will help the people that've contacted me loooking for a turbo tune thats more off the shelf and doesn't require scratch tuning.

probably heading out wed nite/thursday to start tuning at LAPD, woke up with a migraine this am so i hope it clears before we hit the dyno, not a fun place to be with that.

i agree with casey though 400HP is nuts.

Charile I have not contacted you but have been looking for a the turbo solution. Not looking for a 400hp monster, something closer to 275 would be just fine. If forcedFed was not so expensive and did not require a different ECU. Hmmm, just looked on their site FORCEDFED SPORT 275 TURBO KIT, Lotus Elise they are now selling their kit with out engine management ($7895). Well I guess that would be one solution. Still a bit expensive. Do they still sell these? There was some talk about last runs... Is there another Turbo hardware solution out there that has everything but the engine management? And if so do you have a list of turbo solutions you will or have tuned for?

Thank you.

[cstetter]

Originally Posted by over40

Charile I have not contacted you but have been looking for a the turbo solution. Not looking for a 400hp monster, something closer to 275 would be just fine. If forcedFed was not so expensive and did not require a different ECU. Hmmm, just looked on their site FORCEDFED SPORT 275 TURBO KIT, Lotus Elise they are now selling their kit with out engine management ($7895). Well I guess that would be one solution. Still a bit expensive. Do they still sell these? There was some talk about last runs... Is there another Turbo hardware solution out there that has everything but the engine management? And if so do you have a list of turbo solutions you will or have tuned for?

Thank you.

You can still order the kit but expect to wait quite a while - I ordered over 6 weeks ago and am still waiting for the install date.

[MaineLotus]

Originally Posted by over40

Is there another Turbo hardware solution out there that has everything but the engine management?

There may be a light version of the Ronin 4.5 (the one Charlie is tuning this week).

[FLuXeXigeS]

Originally Posted by MaineLotus

There may be a light version of the Ronin 4.5 (the one Charlie is tuning this week).

what are the specs of the "light" or "diet" version? thanx