918 piston options / ceramic coating? - LotusTalk

mdfowler · 01-23-2008, 11:45 AM

I have recently been thinking of going with forged pistons this summer when i break open my v8. Then, i had a thought. :-) I was reading that people are using a ceramic coating on the forged pistons to help one step further in relation to heat.

Has anyone done this coating to the stock pistons?

Would there be any gain, besides cost?

Not wanting to run over 16psi, intercooled.

Any thoughts on this idea?

I also posted this in the motor area, maybe more info in the esprit area?

Dmbrown34 · 01-23-2008, 12:07 PM

As you said...its for heat protection more than anything else. Ive *heard* that it could help prevent carbon from building up on the pistons.

A lot of modern 4 bangers (other engines might have them too) have squirters at the end of oil passengers to shoot oil on the back side of pistons to help keep them cooler. Serious performance guys will remove these squirter b/c the oil on the pistons create weight and hinder performance. To compensate for no oil on the pistons they will coat the pistons.

Its just extra protection for your engine.

Buz · 01-23-2008, 02:51 PM

I have heard that a good ceramic coating is money well spent on pistons, valves, and head of a forced induction motor that is already apart. I plan on coating at least the pistons on the Elise.

Feffman · 01-23-2008, 03:34 PM

Ceramic coatings on top of the pistons and "diamond like" coatings on the piston skirts, rings, rod ends, bearings, etc.. If you are going to rebuild it, spend the extra money.

Feff

JeffYoung · 01-23-2008, 04:59 PM

HIGLY recommended. I use coatings on brake caliper pistons on my race car; works great, and not that expensive (I think I had 8 done for less than $100).

I also HIGHLY recommend these guys: Calico Coatings in Charlotte. They do all the NASCAR work, great guys, fast turnaround, good work.

This is a faily inexpensive thing to do if you are rebuilding a 918 anyway, and worth it in my view.

mdfowler · 01-24-2008, 02:02 AM

I think i WILL do the ceramic coating, but my question is, do i spend the extra money to get the forged pistons as well, or is the ceramic coating on stock pistons enough of a safety net to keep me safe with occasional high boost? I'm NOT looking to go 20+ on boost... and i also plan to have a killer intercooler setup.

I guess i am looking for some facts about the ceramic coating.

Thanks for the info thus far! This will be my first time having the 918 open, and i am excited!

JeffYoung · 01-24-2008, 04:46 AM

If I had a 918, or a 910 for that matter, a part in a turbo charged application, I'd use forged pistons unless I couldn't afford it. It's worth it, in the sense that you won't have to worry about that again. Given what it costs to replace/rebuild a 918, I think the additional cost for forged is well, inconsequential?

Feffman · 01-24-2008, 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdfowler

I think i WILL do the ceramic coating, but my question is, do i spend the extra money to get the forged pistons as well, or is the ceramic coating on stock pistons enough of a safety net to keep me safe with occasional high boost?

Get the forged pistons, have them coated AND make sure you install the head stud kit (call Jeff at JAE -www.JAEParts.com) to replace the stock Lotus "torque-to-yield" head bolts.

Feff

mdfowler · 01-24-2008, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feffman

Get the forged pistons, have them coated AND make sure you install the head stud kit (call Jeff at JAE -www.JAEParts.com) to replace the stock Lotus "torque-to-yield" head bolts.

Feff

Hey Feff,

looks as if we are only a few hours from each other. Do you know of any good ceramic coating companies there in stl? I have been in touch with Jeff from JAE a few months back, helping to gather some thoughts with my project. It just comes down to wanting to do a 20k improvement on a 10k budget. But... i guess it's only money. (currently taking donations) :-)

Toxic · 02-25-2009, 07:32 PM

There are actually three coatings you can apply to a piston.
The best known is the thermal barrier coating applied to the dome. This insulates the piston from the heat of combustion, keeps more heat in the chamber for combustion and more power and reduces the amount of heat transferred to the incoming air/fuel charge helping to reduce pre-ignition and therefore detonation.

The second are skirt coatings to reduce friction, galling and wear. The coating I use actually retains the oil to the piston increasing sealing and making sure there is lubrication under the most severe conditions.

The third is a coating for the underside of the piston to help the piston shed the oil that is splashed onto the piston. This prevents the oil from staying on the piston too long and absorbing less heat and preventing cooler oil from reaching the piston.

If you have any more questions or need more info let me know.

-Rande

01-23-2008, 11:45 AM	#1 (permalink)
mdfowler Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Springfield, MO Posts: 12	918 piston options / ceramic coating? I have recently been thinking of going with forged pistons this summer when i break open my v8. Then, i had a thought. :-) I was reading that people are using a ceramic coating on the forged pistons to help one step further in relation to heat. Has anyone done this coating to the stock pistons? Would there be any gain, besides cost? Not wanting to run over 16psi, intercooled. Any thoughts on this idea? I also posted this in the motor area, maybe more info in the esprit area?

01-23-2008, 12:07 PM	#2 (permalink)
Dmbrown34 Grrrrrr Baby Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,617	As you said...its for heat protection more than anything else. Ive heard that it could help prevent carbon from building up on the pistons. A lot of modern 4 bangers (other engines might have them too) have squirters at the end of oil passengers to shoot oil on the back side of pistons to help keep them cooler. Serious performance guys will remove these squirter b/c the oil on the pistons create weight and hinder performance. To compensate for no oil on the pistons they will coat the pistons. Its just extra protection for your engine. __________________ 2005 Lotus Elise LSS 2003 Corvette 50th Anniversary Convertible

01-23-2008, 03:34 PM	#4 (permalink)
Feffman Grand Poobah Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. Louis, Mo. Posts: 865	Ceramic coatings on top of the pistons and "diamond like" coatings on the piston skirts, rings, rod ends, bearings, etc.. If you are going to rebuild it, spend the extra money. Feff __________________ MVP Track Time

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01-23-2008, 02:51 PM	#3 (permalink)
Buz Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,920	I have heard that a good ceramic coating is money well spent on pistons, valves, and head of a forced induction motor that is already apart. I plan on coating at least the pistons on the Elise.

01-23-2008, 04:59 PM	#5 (permalink)
JeffYoung Registered User Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 837	HIGLY recommended. I use coatings on brake caliper pistons on my race car; works great, and not that expensive (I think I had 8 done for less than $100). I also HIGHLY recommend these guys: Calico Coatings in Charlotte. They do all the NASCAR work, great guys, fast turnaround, good work. This is a faily inexpensive thing to do if you are rebuilding a 918 anyway, and worth it in my view.

01-24-2008, 02:02 AM	#6 (permalink)
mdfowler Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Springfield, MO Posts: 12	I think i WILL do the ceramic coating, but my question is, do i spend the extra money to get the forged pistons as well, or is the ceramic coating on stock pistons enough of a safety net to keep me safe with occasional high boost? I'm NOT looking to go 20+ on boost... and i also plan to have a killer intercooler setup. I guess i am looking for some facts about the ceramic coating. Thanks for the info thus far! This will be my first time having the 918 open, and i am excited!

01-24-2008, 04:46 AM	#7 (permalink)
JeffYoung Registered User Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 837	If I had a 918, or a 910 for that matter, a part in a turbo charged application, I'd use forged pistons unless I couldn't afford it. It's worth it, in the sense that you won't have to worry about that again. Given what it costs to replace/rebuild a 918, I think the additional cost for forged is well, inconsequential?

02-25-2009, 07:32 PM	#10 (permalink)
Toxic Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: St. Louis Posts: 3	There are actually three coatings you can apply to a piston. The best known is the thermal barrier coating applied to the dome. This insulates the piston from the heat of combustion, keeps more heat in the chamber for combustion and more power and reduces the amount of heat transferred to the incoming air/fuel charge helping to reduce pre-ignition and therefore detonation. The second are skirt coatings to reduce friction, galling and wear. The coating I use actually retains the oil to the piston increasing sealing and making sure there is lubrication under the most severe conditions. The third is a coating for the underside of the piston to help the piston shed the oil that is splashed onto the piston. This prevents the oil from staying on the piston too long and absorbing less heat and preventing cooler oil from reaching the piston. If you have any more questions or need more info let me know. -Rande

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