Evora is a heavier than a BMW 3 series?

[fitfan]

...so i got to thinking - wich is allways dangerous! reading the US specs for the Evora. what if you looked at weight per gross square inches of 'real estate foot print' ??

Evora: .2448 lbs per sq"
3,046 lbs
170.9 L x 72.8 W = 12,441.5 sq" footprint

BMW 328 coupe: .2369 lbs per sq"
3,351 lbs
181.1 L x 78.1 W = 14,143.9 sq" footprint


comparatively the BMW 328 is only 300lbs heavier overall... for a bigger car with more "content" stuffed into it, that suprised me.

of course the evora will stomp all over the bmw performace #'s wise. and the 335 which would probably be a fairer 'performance' comparision is heavier...

anyways - thought it was an interesting comparision

i am still a big Evora fan boy though

[...m...]

...i'm not sure if weight per unit area is a particularly useful metric, since area in and of itself doesn't tell us much about drag and downforce...

[aschen]

Run that calc for a liter sized motorcycle. Those things are heavy and slow.

[fitfan]

Originally Posted by ...m...

...i'm not sure if weight per unit area is a particularly useful metric, since area in and of itself doesn't tell us much about drag and downforce...

was no real usefull point intended! - just triva and maybe another way of considering weights of cars. as i mentioned - not a performance metric. just "weight by the yard" size by size, the evora is heavier by that comparision - kinda wierd as its faster true, but less luxurious and less content. (power sunroof, folding rear seats, etc..) common sense would think the evora would be a little lighter - or the relatively traditionally constructed and not so expensive BMW would be a bit heavier.

just think about these things will driving it around

[jplotus]

Originally Posted by fitfan

...so i got to thinking - wich is allways dangerous! reading the US specs for the Evora. what if you looked at weight per gross square inches of 'real estate foot print' ??

Evora: .2448 lbs per sq"
3,046 lbs
170.9 L x 72.8 W = 12,441.5 sq" footprint

BMW 328 coupe: .2369 lbs per sq"
3,351 lbs
181.1 L x 78.1 W = 14,143.9 sq" footprint


comparatively the BMW 328 is only 300lbs heavier overall... for a bigger car with more "content" stuffed into it, that suprised me.

of course the evora will stomp all over the bmw performace #'s wise. and the 335 which would probably be a fairer 'performance' comparision is heavier...

anyways - thought it was an interesting comparision

i am still a big Evora fan boy though

I had the pleasure of driving the Evora last week in Atlanta and it is a stellar car. Handling, fit and finish were excellent. It did not feel like and elise but it had the crispness of it. It had plenty of giddy up and I am sure when they sc that bad boy it will be sub 4 seconds for a gt.

[...m...]

Originally Posted by jplotus

I had the pleasure of driving the Evora last week in Atlanta and it is a stellar car. Handling, fit and finish were excellent. It did not feel like and elise but it had the crispness of it. It had plenty of giddy up and I am sure when they sc that bad boy it will be sub 4 seconds for a gt.

...sub-four is the magic number these days - if lotus can pull it off with the evora, that will go a long way toward legitimizing it as something more special than just a cayman competitor...

[fitfan]

Originally Posted by ...m...

...sub-four is the magic number these days - if lotus can pull it off with the evora, that will go a long way toward legitimizing it as something more special than just a cayman competitor...

AGREED - porsche has the right marketing model, FISRT introduce the performance version, get gret press, THEN follow it with the lower priced "volume" car.

lotus should have introduced the supercharged car, the only down side would be "its kind of expensive" but then the n/a car would answer that....

[zcar222]

Originally Posted by fitfan

AGREED - porsche has the right marketing model, FISRT introduce the performance version, get gret press, THEN follow it with the lower priced "volume" car.

lotus should have introduced the supercharged car, the only down side would be "its kind of expensive" but then the n/a car would answer that....

I think they are sticking to the recipe that worked so well for the elise. I have a feeling that for the number of cars that will be produced, the evora should sell just fine.

-Whit

[jplotus]

Originally Posted by ...m...

...sub-four is the magic number these days - if lotus can pull it off with the evora, that will go a long way toward legitimizing it as something more special than just a cayman competitor...

The evora is not a cayman competitor but rather a 911. Its ability to be a 2+2 as well as a 2 seater sets it apart from the cayman. I have driven both cars and the evora is heads and shoulders over a cayman. Not only the looks but the feel of the car is more precise. The Cayman in my opinion is another boxster version which has imho has no sex appeal. The lines of the evora evoke a sense of exotic that the cayman never had.
I disagree with releasing the s/c first the purpose of this car is to attract a new buyer that would consider its versatitlity and looks to be worth the $.
I have not ordered an evora but will certainly consider it after 2009.

[JohnnyQuest]

Originally Posted by fitfan

was no real usefull point intended! - just triva and maybe another way of considering weights of cars. as i mentioned - not a performance metric. just "weight by the yard" size by size, the evora is heavier by that comparision - kinda wierd as its faster true, but less luxurious and less content. (power sunroof, folding rear seats, etc..) common sense would think the evora would be a little lighter - or the relatively traditionally constructed and not so expensive BMW would be a bit heavier.

just think about these things will driving it around

Actually, I think it is useful as well as very interesting. In addition to the BMW having all the power-operated (heavy) things you mention, it has a steel body. The whole point of a plastic body is to reduce weight and why Lotus and the Corvette have continued to use plastic despite its inherent problems. If there is no weight savings by using plactic why bother? It seems that you get all the negatives (difficulty to maintain fit and smoothness, difficulty to avoid creaks and groans, etc), without the benefits.

The weight comparison to the Cayman is even more profound. The Cayman weighs a little less than that Evora and again does so without a plastic body.

For 2011 the Cayman and Boxster will be completely redesigned. In addition to getting more power and better handling, the 2011 Camyan/Boxster are expected to be lighter by at least 150 - 200 lbs.

I honestly can not understand how the Evora can weigh as much as it does. I was convinced that the production numbers wold undercut the estimates. I just can't see how the Evora can weigh 3,000 lbs. It makes no sense.

[DeanG]

Originally Posted by JohnnyQuest

...A The whole point of a plastic body is to reduce weight and why Lotus and the Corvette have continued to use plastic despite its inherent problems. If there is no weight savings by using plactic why bother? It seems that you get all the negatives (difficulty to maintain fit and smoothness, difficulty to avoid creaks and groans, etc), without the benefits....

The point of a plastic body is affordable tooling for low production. Its tough to have a low production inexpensive car. If Lotus churned out cookie cutter cars like Porsche they would probably use a different material.

[LotinElite]

Originally Posted by JohnnyQuest

Actually, I think it is useful as well as very interesting. In addition to the BMW having all the power-operated (heavy) things you mention, it has a steel body. The whole point of a plastic body is to reduce weight and why Lotus and the Corvette have continued to use plastic despite its inherent problems. If there is no weight savings by using plactic why bother? It seems that you get all the negatives (difficulty to maintain fit and smoothness, difficulty to avoid creaks and groans, etc), without the benefits.

The weight comparison to the Cayman is even more profound. The Cayman weighs a little less than that Evora and again does so without a plastic body.

For 2011 the Cayman and Boxster will be completely redesigned. In addition to getting more power and better handling, the 2011 Camyan/Boxster are expected to be lighter by at least 150 - 200 lbs.

I honestly can not understand how the Evora can weigh as much as it does. I was convinced that the production numbers wold undercut the estimates. I just can't see how the Evora can weigh 3,000 lbs. It makes no sense.

...weight per area means nothing.

There is weight savings by using the plastic body... plastic weighs less than steel.
Like you said, the whole point of the "plastic" body is to reduce weight. That means overall weight, not weigh/in^2. It does that. The weight of the Evora would be more if they used steel. Consequently, power/weight would go down and performance would suffer.

I could make a vehicle out of little more than a jet engine and the lb/in^2 would be very high, but so would the power/weight, which is what is important.

Conversely I could put a set of wheels on a pinwheel and achieve a very low lb/in^2. ...I'd rather have the 'heavier' jet engine.

[Bavarian Motorist]

3,046 lbs is an optioned out Evora. 3,351 lbs is a NO OPTIONS stripper 3 series. A typical 328 will be up in the 3450 lb range easily.

Supposedly the stripper weight of an Evora is 2,976 lbs.

[...m...]

...seventy pounds is a lot of weight for options on a lotus - what are we talking about?..

[Bavarian Motorist]

The back seat is probably the biggest one. Are power seats an option?

[ghastley]

I have been assuming that the same logic applies here as did with the Elise. Use an engine that's already legalised by Toyota and then Lotus-ifiy it later, as a legitimate development of the existing motor. If they brought in the S/C engine first I think they'd have to treat it as a brand new one.

[Bibs]

A large cup of mercury is heavier than an Evora, that means as much as this comparison.

One is a supercar, the other a rep-mobile. One is one of the finest handling cars available in the world today, the other is a mundane anony-car driven by many people because their employers forces them too.

I'm fortunate enough to have driven the Evora and give me 100 BMW's and I'll turn you down for 1 Evora. What a very odd comparison.

[Mbuble]

Just curious, but since all the cars that everyone likes to compare to the Evora, (Porsche Cayman, and 911, know even BMW) have been around for quite a bit longer than the Evora, maybe we should wait to speculate what the Evora is going to be just a bit longer. Think about the fact they have a 2 seater version, SC version, and even a convertible version coming out in a couple of years don't you think that they could make quite a bit of changes by then?

[glb]

Originally Posted by LotinElite

...weight per area means nothing.

There is weight savings by using the plastic body... plastic weighs less than steel.
Like you said, the whole point of the "plastic" body is to reduce weight. That means overall weight

Isn't there another, more basic reason for plastic?: Molds for this must cost only a fraction of what tooling for stamping would run, especially spread over relatively few cars.

[aviator]

Originally Posted by fitfan

AGREED - porsche has the right marketing model, FISRT introduce the performance version, get gret press, THEN follow it with the lower priced "volume" car.

fitfan, it's not entirely accurate! for instance, Boxster was introduced first, followed by S version (i had to switch my deposit from base to S and hence wait longer). GT3 and above models follow the 'regular' 911s.

cheers.

henry.