Evora's at Overseas Motors (Dallas, Tx)

[jtj]

some pics from the Evora visit to our dealership Friday night..... all of them can be seen <a href="http://jasonjones.zenfolio.com/p1006106879" target="_blank" title="more Evora photos">HERE</a>












looks like fun working on this! I only hope the rear clam comes of very easily/quickly!

[Charlie Lunsford]

Looks Jason, can't wait to see it today!!

[jtj]

you will like them Charlie... I was VERY impressed with them. If only I could have taken one for a spin....

[Nikki]

Checked them out in Houston. Stunning!

[Doghouse]

... it sure would make a nice daily driver (easier to get into and out of, lots more room inside, your stuff / the groceries would not get cooked on the way home), it has a comfortable ergonomically designed interior, a cool navigation / radio system (like a P-car) but ...

And despite what the Lotus guy said to me straight face "It will out perform an Exige S." (No I did not call him out on this.) This ain't no track car.

Too big, too heavy, the front splitter is integral to the bumper (i.e. very expensive to replace if you hit a cone), adding in a harness bar will eliminate the 2+2 configuration (granted only a small child could fit back there anyway) and the tires will be even more expensive than those for the Exige S. The weight distribution will most likely make it understeer like a big fat pig despite the big beefy tires up front. Unless Lotus engineers have changed the laws of physics, this is not the light and nimble car that the Elise / Exige is famously know as being.

It is very hard to imagine that this will have the same raw driving experience that an Elise or Exige has. IMHO, Lotus has definitely shaved the edges off the Elise / Exige in an attempt to have a broader market appeal. Sadly here in the US Lotus is niche market player and known mostly to automotive enthusiasts as a maker of streetable track cars / exotics.

At the risk of being flamed up one side and down the other, I have to say I was not all that impressed by looks of the Evora. Looks too much like a F-car or Maseratti. It did not grab my heart like the lines of the Elise / Exige and make me say "Dang that's a hot car. I sure wish I could drive it."

Sorry guys, way too much hype and kind of a MEH! for me.

[DeanG]

Originally Posted by Doghouse

And despite what the Lotus guy said to me straight face "It will out perform an Exige S." (No I did not call him out on this.) This ain't no track car.

Since when does performance = track car. Most of the exotics are not ideal track cars. Too big, complicated, expensive, parts can be hard to get and there are too few few of them to build a significant body of knowledge concerning track tuning.

Originally Posted by Doghouse

The weight distribution will most likely make it understeer like a big fat pig despite the big beefy tires up front.

I'm glad you are a better engineer than those at Lotus. You should call Lotus and let them know your opinions on the handling of the car and save them from making a big mistake.

Originally Posted by Doghouse

Unless Lotus engineers have changed the laws of physics, this is not the light and nimble car that the Elise / Exige is famously know as being...

It is very hard to imagine that this will have the same raw driving experience that an Elise or Exige has.

The Evora is not supposed to have the raw driving experience or nimbleness of the Elise. Its a different car. With all your apparent marketing acumen I would have though you could figure out that Lotus is not trying to produce yet another Elise / Exige.

so what do you think? Not bad for my first flame on LotusTalk?

[MickOpalak]

Originally Posted by DeanG

so what do you think? Not bad for my first flame on LotusTalk?

[AgentTripleX]

Wow. It looks so similar to the Tesla Roadster, but more plush inside. Hmmm...

[Doghouse]

Originally Posted by DeanG

Since when does performance = track car. Most of the exotics are not ideal track cars. Too big, complicated, expensive, parts can be hard to get and there are too few few of them to build a significant body of knowledge concerning track tuning.

Hmmm let's see there was this guy named Collin and he had this idea that lightness was the key to automotive performance on track and that form should follow function / performance. The idea was quite revolutionary because at the time the other car guys were building big heavy high horsepower cars and corresponding street cars were even bigger and heavier and had lots of gadgets and some of them even looked pretty. I think he started a company that had the basic engineering approach that the performance of a car should be measured, hmmm let's see, .... on a track. Collin and his company came to be famous for building light, nimble, no-frills, track cars and trackable street cars that 99% of automotive drivers found to be too harsh, too uncomfortable, too small, etc...

Originally Posted by DeanG

I'm glad you are a better engineer than those at Lotus.

I'm not claiming to be a better engineer than those at Lotus. I am looking at the specifications and weight distribution and thinking for myself. When a car has a 39% (front) - 61% (rear) weight distribution and is rear wheel drive it is likely to understeer. When a first car weighs nearly 1900 lbs more than the second car that you are comparing it to and the first car has only 17-20 hp more than the second car, the first car (IMHO) is rightly called a big fat pig of a car.

Originally Posted by DeanG

You should call Lotus and let them know your opinions on the handling of the car and save them from making a big mistake.

Perhaps someone from Lotus is reading / listening and appreciates a difference in opinion. They are big boys and girls, they hopefully can figure it out. If they want me to save them from making a big mistake, well that's going to cost them money.

Originally Posted by DeanG

The Evora is not supposed to have the raw driving experience or nimbleness of the Elise. Its a different car. With all your apparent marketing acumen I would have though you could figure out that Lotus is not trying to produce yet another Elise / Exige.

Indeed Lotus is clearly not retaining the best features of the Elise / Exige and that is too bad in my opinion. Unfortunately the success of the Elise / Exige was because it did provide something unique to the automotive market. That uniqueness was it's raw driving experience and nimbleness (i.e. the very same ideas that some guy named Collin thought was important.) and drop dead exterior lines. If you remove two of those three aspects to make the car more suitable to a broader driving public, hey I'm cool with that, that's what marketing people do. But don't try to fool people into thinking that the Evora will be the same as the Elise / Exige, but only bigger. Perhaps the people at Top Gear (publications) were right and perhaps the Lotus people did not like to be called out on it.... oppss so sorry to look behind the curtain Mr. Wizard of Oz...

Originally Posted by DeanG

so what do you think? Not bad for my first flame on LotusTalk?

Well at least you have an opinion and the willingness to express it and engage in a civilized discussion.

The fact that we have differing opinions about the Evora, I'm OK with that as well. Enjoy your Evora and the associated creature comforts, just don't be upset when it does not perform as well as an Elise / Exige.

[Alphonse]

Boys, boys, step back a minute and take a breather. No need for flaming. The Evora is a totally different car from the Elise/Exige line up only carrying similar visual appearences and the construction components carry-over Lotus is using to maintain the "modular" vehicle concept.
This car should appeal more to those individuals who wanted a sports car but not one as hard edged as the Elise/Exige. All those who said they really liked the cars and would get one if they were easier to live with will be back now for the Evora. the Evora is more of a road going GT car than the the hard edged performance track car that the Elise/Exige is and should be viewed as such.
As for the aesthetics, that is purely up to the eye of the beholder. As with any car, some will like it and some will not.
My 2 cents worth, the car is good looking, but what color it wears will have a significant impact on it's appeal. Certian colors do more for it's lines than others. Again, just my viewing notions.
I really liked the ability to get in and out with out having to perform a gymnastic manouver. At 6'-2" and 50+ years of age, it's the little things like comfort that make a difference.
As for the sensory portion, that will have to wait untill test drives are available. The exhaust note on the two cars that arrived in Houston was quiet to the extreme. Again, to some this will have a good deal of appeal. to others, lets hope they have a "sport" exhaust option.
First thing I did when the cars arrived from Dallas was to seek out the driver of the black car and ask him how the AC faired in the 100+ degree road temps. His reply was that the only time he broke a sweat was when he stepped out of the car and that the ride was comfy the whole way down.
Given he was a factory rep I will still leave that part to the test drive.
I think the Evora will do well in sales, especially in that portion of the market that was turned away by the difficulties in living with the car.
Let's hope that the car lives up to it's expectations so that Lotus will stay a live and viable car manufacturer, providing us with the cars and car parts we enjoy and need.

[xtn]

Originally Posted by Doghouse

When a car has a 39% (front) - 61% (rear) weight distribution and is rear wheel drive it is likely to understeer.

Hmmmm... I'd like to point out that there are many, many factors that add up to under steer. Weight distribution is only one of them. I'd also like to point out that moving the CG farther back can inherently reduce under steer - depending on all those other factors of course - not inherently increase it.

xtn

[Alphonse]

Originally Posted by xtn

Hmmmm... I'd like to point out that there are many, many factors that add up to under steer. Weight distribution is only one of them. I'd also like to point out that moving the CG farther back can inherently reduce under steer - depending on all those other factors of course - not inherently increase it.

xtn

I believe it's the other way around. Move it forward to place more weight on the front wheels and you reduce understeer. To eliminate it on the Esprit I raised the rear and lowered the front to achieve a slightly more forward weight bias.

Al

[jesterbot]

This isn't an elise/exige, so why the constant comparisons? We're talking a car that costs over 50% more, weighs 50% more, etc... totally different automotive demographic. And "ruining the beautiful lines of an elise"? Please, our cars are more akin to a bumble bee than anything else. Incredibly exaggerated lines made more pronounced by a micro-machine stature - the exige helps remedy this with it's slightly sleeker front end/spoiler, but still let's face it - our cars are photogenic from all of about... oh maybe 2 angles. With the proper lens. From the proper distance.

The new car finally looks like a real car at least - I'd rather it resemble a Ferrari than a golf cart. And with the N/A version only a couple seconds behind the Exige S (ok, Top Gear charts are dubious at best, but still)... I don't doubt the supercharged variant will have the performance to calm us down. It sounds like it has all the handling it needs, despite the weight, but could just use more power. Sound familiar?

[MyFutureSelfnMe]

Will maintenance cost $44k for the first 24,000 miles?

[jesterbot]

That being said, I was really excited to see the Evoras in person, but left with mixed feelings... I love the lines (especially on the black one, and I normally hate the curve-hiding effects of black), but the panels had poor fitment I thought, the seams around the door were wide enough to land a Cessna in, and the interior honestly had a "thin", "hollow" feel to it. Clarkson's review was pretty accurate - things sounded "tinny". Things looked pretty good, but run your hand over the door panels and it felt like pleather stretched over plastic.

Also, for a car that's so much bigger than the elise, I expected it to be roomier. While you certainly aren't rubbing shoulders with your passenger anymore, I do feel I had more room on my drivers side arm with the elise - thanks in part to the wider door sill. In the Evora, it seemed like your shoulder was rubbing on the car door panel as soon as you shut it. That felt a little claustrophobic I thought.

Then walk over to the Aston showroom, and for a car that granted costs twice as much... the interior fit and finish is some of the best i've ever seen. The sad thing is, for the cost of a new Evora, you could get a very lightly used Vantage V8. That right there would make it a no-brainer for most, but something about the exotic Evora lines and mid-engine will make that a very tough choice for me... I'm honestly hoping they improve the performance enough, and possibly make a few small refinement changes before the S/SC model comes out - then the baby Aston will lose much of its edge. Crossing my fingers.

[Doghouse]

Originally Posted by Alphonse

Boys, boys, step back a minute and take a breather. No need for flaming.

Awww come on Al, we're just having a little fun pushing back and forth a bit. All I really wanted to achieve is to break-up the unabashed love-fest over the Evora.

BTW, what was in that lemonade / Koolaide they were serving..

Originally Posted by Alphonse

The Evora is a totally different car from the Elise/Exige line up only carrying similar visual appearences and the construction components carry-over Lotus is using to maintain the "modular" vehicle concept.
This car should appeal more to those individuals who wanted a sports car but not one as hard edged as the Elise/Exige. All those who said they really liked the cars and would get one if they were easier to live with will be back now for the Evora. the Evora is more of a road going GT car than the the hard edged performance track car that the Elise/Exige is and should be viewed as such.

Yep, got to agree the Evora is a totally different car from the Elise / Exige line up. But if Lotus is going to compete in the road going GT category, there is a lot of tough competition for those customers who are willing to be separated with their money.

If that's the target market, they really need to get their game on and that includes customer service after the sale.

Originally Posted by Alphonse

I think the Evora will do well in sales, especially in that portion of the market that was turned away by the difficulties in living with the car.
Let's hope that the car lives up to it's expectations so that Lotus will stay a live and viable car manufacturer, providing us with the cars and car parts we enjoy and need.

I too think the Evora will do well in initial sales, but the proof will be in the pudding as to whether or not the relationship will last. I put up with lots of the quirks, etc... in my Exige simply because it is a unique car that provides a driving experience no other street legal car on the road can. I'm less sure that a typcial Evora customer will put up with these things for too long. Especially if they hit a parking curb or speed bump and break off the splitter / bumper to the tune of ???? let's say $2-3K. And let's face it, word of mouth is more important in selling cars than reviews in magazines.

IMHO, Lotus should have focused their efforts on bringing the new Esprit to market faster and pumping a few more years out of the Elise / Exige product line. But then again, I'm just some guy in Houston who enjoys fast cars and not an automotive marketing guru, so what do I know....

[xtn]

Originally Posted by Alphonse

I believe it's the other way around. Move it forward to place more weight on the front wheels and you reduce understeer. To eliminate it on the Esprit I raised the rear and lowered the front to achieve a slightly more forward weight bias.

Al

I certainly believe that could reduce understeer, but probably not because you've moved the CG much. Go ahead and calculate how further forward you moved the CG when you altered your front and rear ride heights slightly. The value you get won't be worth mentioning. Much more likely is that the dynamics changed due to camber changes that came along with adjusting the ride heights.

The more mass you get off the front tires, the easier it will be to rotate the front end.

xtn

[Randy Chase]

Originally Posted by xtn

The more mass you get off the front tires, the easier it will be to rotate the front end.

xtn

To some extent. I have removed weight in a previous race car and removing a front mounted battery (midengined car) and relocating it caused the front end to have no grip (to my surprise).

[Sweet Adrenaline]

I have to say I am totally smitten by the Evora!

[DeanG]

Originally Posted by jesterbot

... the panels had poor fitment I thought, the seams around the door were wide enough to land a Cessna in, and the interior honestly had a "thin", "hollow" feel to it. Clarkson's review was pretty accurate - things sounded "tinny". Things looked pretty good, but run your hand over the door panels and it felt like pleather stretched over plastic.

We know, based on statements from LCU representatives, that both the red and black cars are prototypes. Was the Top Gear car a prototype or an early production car?