Attempting to fix heatsoak, re-flash needed?

[Thomasio]

Here is what I'm getting with both RLS Intercooler and RLS Injection:
(Data recorded at Autbahn raceway in Joliet, Illinois after 20 minutes of track time).

[spectre]

Question for the knowing.
Does engine temp correlate at all to intercooler temps?
Say if its reading 205 than on average the intercooler is # hotter.

So in the chart above 228 pre intercooler, what was the engine temp at that time?
Just trying to get a ball park to see where Im running.

[Thomasio]

Originally Posted by spectre

Question for the knowing.
Does engine temp correlate at all to intercooler temps?
Say if its reading 205 than on average the intercooler is # hotter.

So in the chart above 228 pre intercooler, what was the engine temp at that time?
Just trying to get a ball park to see where Im running.

The engine coolant temp isn't a good indicator of the intake air temp (IAT).

With the stock intercooler, after just a few minutes of hard running, IAT temperature spikes (post intercooler) can reach over 170 or 180 degrees F and average temps can exceed 150 or 160 degrees F quite easily.

[spectre]

I gotcha. So how much does ambient temp effect it?
I would think that a 60 degree day would be different than 90 right or does it just take longer to spike?

[EliseAtLeast]

Thanks for the info Thomas. So with 20 mins on track with just the RLS IC, the post temp is 120 deg.

What would be the post temp in the same situation with the stock IC?
(never mind. Thomas just answered that. Thanks.)

Is 120 deg within a good temp range so that the ECU don't have to intervene?

Will the RLS IC allow us to swap for a smaller pulley (with a reflash of course)?

I guess the ultimate goal for us S owners is to swap for a smaller pulley since its the cheapest way for us to get more hp/torque.

[Thomasio]

I think that Charlie has seen bad results w/ the smaller pulley. My car has been fine w/ the RLS Intercooler and smaller pulley, but I watch my AFR gauge nonstop. I believe that the smaller pulley is risky w/out Charlie's ECU work.

Charlie's Gotham will net you more power than a pulley will, so why not go that route?

Re: ambient temperature: yes, ambient temperature has a direct impact on IAT. At some point, if ambient is hot enough, there will not be enough airflow to cool the intercooler. For example, 105 degrees in the desert will tax the cooling system to the max. At that point, water/methanol injection will help. (On a 90+ degree day, with water/methanol injection, my intercooler is cool to the touch on the right-hand-side when I pull off of a 30 minute track session.)

Here are the things that you can do to minimize heatsoak:
1) improve cooling air both by "fettling" the intake tract and by creating a larger intake, for example Cup roof
2) improve the intercooler efficiency by increasing thermal mass of intercooler, volume and flow of intercooler, and cross sectional area of intercooler [Note: supercharger heat-causing parasitic losses are reduced by increasing intercooler internal flow]
3) use rubber mounts in between intercooler and engine instead of hard mounts that transfer heat
4) water/methanol injection, primary injection after intercooler, secondary injection externally on front side of intercooler (must be an extremely fine, atomized spray). 50/50 water/methanol will be best for most U.S. climates.
5) a radiant heat barrier / shield in between the intercooler and the engine will help a bit.

P.S. water/methanol injection cools both the charge air and the in-cylinder temperatures, and keeps heads, cylinders and pistons oh-so-clean.

[EliseAtLeast]

Originally Posted by Thomasio

Charlie's Gotham will net you more power than a pulley will, so why not go that route?

Because a smaller pulley + Charlie's tune will give even more power.

Seriously I think most S owners (me included) will be happy with the "Gotham Power" but only if it can be maintained in track conditions.

According to Charlie if I'm not mistaken (in track conditions):
Gotham + Stock Intercooler = Heatsoak
Gotham + RLS IC requires a retune

So if that is the case then might as well get smaller pulley + RLS IC + New Charlie tune to get even more power. Hope this makes sense.

[jah29]

Originally Posted by Thomasio

2) improve the intercooler efficiency by increasing thermal mass of intercooler, volume and flow of intercooler, and cross sectional area of intercooler [Note: supercharger heat-causing parasitic losses are reduced by increasing intercooler internal flow]

This doesn't quite make sense to me.

Increasing thermal mass means it's harder to change the temperature of the intercooler. It doesn't mean it will always be at a lower temperature. The thermal mass argument, it seems to me, only leads to the conclusion that heat soak takes longer to occur. And maybe that is fine, if the heat soak time exceeds the length of a normal trackday session.

Also my understanding of intercooling is that proper internal flow speed is crucial. Speeding up flow means the air spends less time in the intercooler and has less time to be cooled. Too much flow can be just as bad as too little flow.

[jah29]

Originally Posted by EliseAtLeast

Because a smaller pulley + Charlie's tune will give even more power.

Seriously I think most S owners (me included) will be happy with the "Gotham Power" but only if it can be maintained in track conditions.

According to Charlie if I'm not mistaken (in track conditions):
Gotham + Stock Intercooler = Heatsoak
Gotham + RLS IC requires a retune

So if that is the case then might as well get smaller pulley + RLS IC + New Charlie tune to get even more power. Hope this makes sense.

I think charlie has said that he can't tune much further than gotham without upgrading injectors and the fuel pump. I don't want to do that stuff. Well not yet anyway.

[ZJChaser]

Originally Posted by EliseAtLeast

Because a smaller pulley + Charlie's tune will give even more power.

Seriously I think most S owners (me included) will be happy with the "Gotham Power" but only if it can be maintained in track conditions.

According to Charlie if I'm not mistaken (in track conditions):
Gotham + Stock Intercooler = Heatsoak
Gotham + RLS IC requires a retune

So if that is the case then might as well get smaller pulley + RLS IC + New Charlie tune to get even more power. Hope this makes sense.

smaller pullies will build much more heat much faster from that blower. I'd stick with the stock pulley and have it tuned.

[shay2nak]

I have the RLS intercooler and fettled the roof opening. Keep stock boost, like AJ said, you'll create even more heat.

I can think of a few things to help reduce heatsoak.

1st is to get more air into, through and out of the engine compartment to reduce heat build up. Using larger side intakes with grilles removed and rear panel removed. Maybe even use some curved panels after the side intakes to direct air more towards the engine...

2nd is to possibly create a heatshield that sits under the intercooler (an integrated bracket/heatshield) that blocks it from the motor and the supercharger.

3rd is if you have much larger side intakes, run 3" diameter flexible hose from one side into the intercooler shroud or just have it blow air onto the intercooler to cool the unit down.

4th is if you have aftermarked headers/exhaust system ceramic coat them to reduce heat radiation.

[LBC111]

^ Also... puller fans on the intercooler. That's my next project. I just need to fabricate (or find someone to fabricate) a housing that can go over the back of the intercooler to block any areas not covered by the fans.

[HKFEVER]

Originally Posted by shay2nak

I
2nd is to possibly create a heatshield that sits under the intercooler (an integrated bracket/heatshield) that blocks it from the motor and the supercharger.

3rd is if you have much larger side intakes, run 3" diameter flexible hose from one side into the intercooler shroud or just have it blow air onto the intercooler to cool the unit down.

.

I am looking to custom make a frame inside the plastic hood to house 2 push fans.

And 4 to 6 parts CF heat shield with gold plated bottom to seperate the intercooler from the rest (funny ideafrom the PS).

[ads_green]

I can see where you're going with the heatshield but I would expect adding the CF heat barrier between the IC and the engine would affect the cooling to the engine. The mesh on the back is the primary exit vent for the engine cooling airflow as air is taken in through the VRIS vents on the floor and the sidepods and out through the engine cover.

Fundamentally the IC is mounted in less than ideal position and airflow to the engine bay is not great to begin with.

[HKFEVER]

Originally Posted by ads_green

I can see where you're going with the heatshield but I would expect adding the CF heat barrier between the IC and the engine would affect the cooling to the engine. The mesh on the back is the primary exit vent for the engine cooling airflow as air is taken in through the VRIS vents on the floor and the sidepods and out through the engine cover.

Fundamentally the IC is mounted in less than ideal position and airflow to the engine bay is not great to begin with.

Add 8" Fan on each side force air downward

Or We can use the Lotus heat shield kind of material, which will be much easier to form fit instead of CF.

[shay2nak]

FYI, my OBDII reader displays IAT and i was between 90 and 104 out driving in the canyons in about 75* weather today.

Originally Posted by HKFEVER

I am looking to custom make a frame inside the plastic hood to house 2 push fans.

And 4 to 6 parts CF heat shield with gold plated bottom to seperate the intercooler from the rest (funny ideafrom the PS).

Looks like that whole section is blocked off. Do you have the side intakes blocked, too? You want those open to feed cool air into engine bay.

Originally Posted by ads_green

I can see where you're going with the heatshield but I would expect adding the CF heat barrier between the IC and the engine would affect the cooling to the engine. The mesh on the back is the primary exit vent for the engine cooling airflow as air is taken in through the VRIS vents on the floor and the sidepods and out through the engine cover.

Fundamentally the IC is mounted in less than ideal position and airflow to the engine bay is not great to begin with.

The heatshield would be slightly larger than the intercooler's footprint and slightly raised front and back. It won't block any airflow. all the heat is coming from beneath the IC.

[HKFEVER]

The Photoshop is only a sketch idea. Just a suggestion.

No, don't block the whole engine bay. Need opening for venting air from the covered bay area direct out to the top of the hatch. Need opening for oil change and oil check...

Need fans on side vents to provide continue air flow for the bay.

But not sure how much weight will add

Or may be a small bath tube shape heat shield that can sit the intercooler in to shield off the heat radiation from the engine bay.

Check out these: ACL Race Series Heat Shield Material Clevaflex - Applications Both can easily form fit no need to have special equipement, just need cutters.