Found metal shavings on oil dipstick - any advice? - LotusTalk

masheen · 06-11-2009, 08:43 PM

i found what appeared to be metal shavings on my oil dipstick the other day. any advice for me?

i am expecting that a look under the valve cover is in order.

i am not having any problems otherwise.

kmt63 · 06-11-2009, 09:09 PM

how many miles are on the motor?if not many it would be normal to see some from break in.if more than a few thousand then i would be checking those cams.

Monkeywrench · 06-12-2009, 11:29 AM

Intake cam and rocker wear?

edit: I noticed you're in Detroit. Bring it by if you want us to check it out.

Simba · 06-12-2009, 01:39 PM

If it's a brand new engine, it's fairly normal, so long as you're talking very small flakes and not chunks. If you've got more than 500 miles on it, and have done at least one oil change, it's probably something very unhappy.

If the engine has a few thousand miles on it, I'd dump the oil and have a look at it, pull the pan and inspect things, and section the oil filter to see what's in there.

Make sure you flush out your oil coolers once the problem is resolved.

TheViper · 06-12-2009, 01:53 PM

Send an oil sample to a lab.
Michael

masheen · 06-12-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kmt63

how many miles are on the motor?if not many it would be normal to see some from break in.if more than a few thousand then i would be checking those cams.

about 18,000

my first thought was cams, but i was hoping someone would say that it could be something benign.

masheen · 06-12-2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monkeywrench

Intake cam and rocker wear?

edit: I noticed you're in Detroit. Bring it by if you want us to check it out.

i will be taking the valve cover off to take a look.

is there a common approach now to deal with the cam-rocker problem? especially at an early stage (nothing broken yet) like mine probably is.

masheen · 06-12-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simba

If it's a brand new engine, it's fairly normal, so long as you're talking very small flakes and not chunks. If you've got more than 500 miles on it, and have done at least one oil change, it's probably something very unhappy.

If the engine has a few thousand miles on it, I'd dump the oil and have a look at it, pull the pan and inspect things, and section the oil filter to see what's in there.

Make sure you flush out your oil coolers once the problem is resolved.

is taking the pan off difficult?

masheen · 06-12-2009, 07:53 PM

i was/am thinking about doing those other suggestions too. thank you.

NHG35GUY · 06-13-2009, 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masheen

i will be taking the valve cover off to take a look.

is there a common approach now to deal with the cam-rocker problem? especially at an early stage (nothing broken yet) like mine probably is.

The only way to fix it is to replace the cams and rockers. Be sure you do both at the same time. If you do factory cams I think they are like 400-500 for the set. Piper stage 2 cams are between 800 and 900. Rockers are 200.00.

The piper stage 2 cams do not need to have the ECU tuned.

dickedup · 06-13-2009, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masheen

about 18,000

If the car was brand new MAYBE. Get her into the shop toot sweet.

Dragon · 06-13-2009, 06:23 AM

What color was the metal? If they were copper color then it's most likely bearing material, silver being cam shaft / rocker arm stuff... You should put in a magnetic oil plug as it will catch some of the debris and keep it from being recycled threw the system...

masheen · 06-13-2009, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragon

What color was the metal? If they were copper color then it's most likely bearing material, silver being cam shaft / rocker arm stuff... You should put in a magnetic oil plug as it will catch some of the debris and keep it from being recycled threw the system...

dark grey

masheen · 06-13-2009, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NHG35GUY

The only way to fix it is to replace the cams and rockers. Be sure you do both at the same time. If you do factory cams I think they are like 400-500 for the set. Piper stage 2 cams are between 800 and 900. Rockers are 200.00.

The piper stage 2 cams do not need to have the ECU tuned.

does that really fix it though? what i mean is: if it's something like inadequate oil delivery then it will come back again.

is there any advantage to using piper stage 2 cams?

Dragon · 06-14-2009, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masheen

dark grey

Hmm.... If you still have what you found or there is more you should see if it's magnetic or not.... It could very well be some aluminum casting flash that broke loose inside the engine.

wdonovan · 06-14-2009, 06:06 AM

Cam / rocker would not be grey but silver. That's a good thing cause wear on these should be about zero. Any particles from them would be fatal. My guess is alum. Not sure where from but common areas would be piston skirt, chains contacting castings, etc. Are you sure it's not paint that was rubbed off the dipstick tube by the dipstick?
If you keep putting the dipstick back in the tube and pulling it out, are there more shavings on it each time? How big are the particles?

masheen · 07-13-2009, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wdonovan

Cam / rocker would not be grey but silver. That's a good thing cause wear on these should be about zero. Any particles from them would be fatal. My guess is alum. Not sure where from but common areas would be piston skirt, chains contacting castings, etc. Are you sure it's not paint that was rubbed off the dipstick tube by the dipstick?
If you keep putting the dipstick back in the tube and pulling it out, are there more shavings on it each time? How big are the particles?

could something silver soaked by oil look grey?

i am not sure that it is not paint from the dipstick tube: i hope it is - the dipstick is hard to get in and out and, as much as i try, it scrapes the tube now and then.

the size is about 2 mm x 2 mm.

i did not find the shavings repeatedly, although i did not try that many times.

i have driven the car since without engaging the second cam.

i am still planning to look under the valve cover - i need to get back some tools i lent out and also i need to figure out the part number of gasket that i have heard is replaced every time the valve cover is taken off.

Krug1 · 07-13-2009, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masheen

could something silver soaked by oil look grey?

i am not sure that it is not paint from the dipstick tube: i hope it is - the dipstick is hard to get in and out and, as much as i try, it scrapes the tube now and then.

the size is about 2 mm x 2 mm.

i did not find the shavings repeatedly, although i did not try that many times.

i have driven the car since without engaging the second cam.

i am still planning to look under the valve cover - i need to get back some tools i lent out and also i need to figure out the part number of gasket that i have heard is replaced every time the valve cover is taken off.

I would use a magnet to see if it is metal. Obviously if it is copper, aluminum,or paint (suggestions on this thread) it won't stick. If it does stick to the magnet, then more concern is in order. Just my .02.

I hope for your sake it's paint!

Andy

masheen · 07-14-2009, 08:05 PM

i don't have the bits anymore.

but i will apply the magnet test if i see them again.

masheen · 07-29-2009, 11:35 PM

i looked under the valve cover tonight. i took some pictures, but can't post them right now. but i have seen the same pictures before, basically some bluish discoloration and some white streaks, but everything feels perfectly smooth to the touch and does not look distorted. i don't know if that is normal, or a sign of trouble. i posted about it here where the pictures like mine are:

Camshaft cover defect causing rocker-arm breakage (P1302)?

my post is #355. my engine looks like pictures in posts 73 and 346.

so is that normal?

(i don't think the shavings i found came from the camshaft as that would have been obvious. - i am guessing they are from the oil dipstick tube. i am also sending my oil for analysis.)

06-11-2009, 08:43 PM	#1 (permalink)
masheen Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 723	Found metal shavings on oil dipstick - any advice? i found what appeared to be metal shavings on my oil dipstick the other day. any advice for me? i am expecting that a look under the valve cover is in order. i am not having any problems otherwise.

06-11-2009, 09:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
kmt63 Elise Driver Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: vancouver wa Posts: 391 Images: 2	how many miles are on the motor?if not many it would be normal to see some from break in.if more than a few thousand then i would be checking those cams. __________________ rls west~nci motor sports fabrication

06-12-2009, 01:53 PM	#5 (permalink)
TheViper Alarmed & Dangerous Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boca Raton FL Posts: 3,205	Send an oil sample to a lab. Michael __________________ Cobra OEM - Alarm, Immobilizer, CDL Emergency Override with warranty Additional Emergency Touch Keys - see link above Brand New Cobra Alarm Remote with warranty Cobra Remote Key Fob Strap Cobra Window Closing Module - Add to your existing Cobra alarm 3 Piece Front Clam Protection Kit with Center Bumper Undertray Removal Tool INFORMATION Improved AC & Heating System Battery Choices & Information Remote Key Fob, Alarm & Immobilizer Programming Light Bulb Conversions 2005

06-13-2009, 06:23 AM	#12 (permalink)
Dragon Hydrocarbons Rule Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Okinawa Japan Posts: 1,748 Images: 2	What color was the metal? If they were copper color then it's most likely bearing material, silver being cam shaft / rocker arm stuff... You should put in a magnetic oil plug as it will catch some of the debris and keep it from being recycled threw the system... __________________ 2006 Exige; BWR Supercharger, Adj Sway Bar, Ohlins Suspension, BSK Oil Catch Can, Moroso Oil Pan, ORC Clutch, Custom Exhaust, Black Volk Racing CE28N's w/ Toyo R1R's, 2 piece rotors, Pagid Blue Pads, BSK Wet Carbon (Side Skirts, Front Lip Spoiler, Gas Cap Cover, Center Console, Door Panels), Dry Carbon rear Diffuser, Harness Bar, BWR Gauge Mount, OMP Superquadro steering wheel, LETSLA Short Shifter, V2arms, Rear Tow Link Brace, RLS Battery Bracket, BOE Tow Bar, Stickers.

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06-12-2009, 11:29 AM	#3 (permalink)
Monkeywrench Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 118	Intake cam and rocker wear? edit: I noticed you're in Detroit. Bring it by if you want us to check it out.

06-12-2009, 01:39 PM	#4 (permalink)
Simba 2/3 hp to the paws. Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: NY Posts: 497	If it's a brand new engine, it's fairly normal, so long as you're talking very small flakes and not chunks. If you've got more than 500 miles on it, and have done at least one oil change, it's probably something very unhappy. If the engine has a few thousand miles on it, I'd dump the oil and have a look at it, pull the pan and inspect things, and section the oil filter to see what's in there. Make sure you flush out your oil coolers once the problem is resolved.

06-12-2009, 07:53 PM	#9 (permalink)
masheen Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 723	i was/am thinking about doing those other suggestions too. thank you.

06-14-2009, 06:06 AM	#16 (permalink)
wdonovan Registered User Join Date: May 2009 Location: Jersey shore Posts: 60	Cam / rocker would not be grey but silver. That's a good thing cause wear on these should be about zero. Any particles from them would be fatal. My guess is alum. Not sure where from but common areas would be piston skirt, chains contacting castings, etc. Are you sure it's not paint that was rubbed off the dipstick tube by the dipstick? If you keep putting the dipstick back in the tube and pulling it out, are there more shavings on it each time? How big are the particles?

07-14-2009, 08:05 PM	#19 (permalink)
masheen Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 723	i don't have the bits anymore. but i will apply the magnet test if i see them again.

07-29-2009, 11:35 PM	#20 (permalink)
masheen Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 723	i looked under the valve cover tonight. i took some pictures, but can't post them right now. but i have seen the same pictures before, basically some bluish discoloration and some white streaks, but everything feels perfectly smooth to the touch and does not look distorted. i don't know if that is normal, or a sign of trouble. i posted about it here where the pictures like mine are: Camshaft cover defect causing rocker-arm breakage (P1302)? my post is #355. my engine looks like pictures in posts 73 and 346. so is that normal? (i don't think the shavings i found came from the camshaft as that would have been obvious. - i am guessing they are from the oil dipstick tube. i am also sending my oil for analysis.)

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