Sky-King, Hass Turbo Review

[Sky-King]

Hello all,

No my car did not blow up

I do not know how to post pics, Neil from Sector 111 had my car for a few days and he was going to post some pics for you all, however he did not get around to it. If someone will explain to me how to post some pics I would be happy to try. My car funs fine, however I think the tune could be better, I am very happy that Scottyb is working so hard to improve the quality of the tune, and I am going to try his mapping when I get the car back. It is having shocks and sway bars installed as well as new front splitter and rear spoiler (those pieces need to be prepped and painted) I am also having some heat shielding added by the turbo, because I don’t like taking chances. I am also having some of the wiring redone and a few other changes to the install since the car is in the shop. Don’t take this as problems, I am just a neat freak and I want everything very clean. Jay installed this and it was the first kit developed, so the priority was getting the car working and the kit built. To me Jay is a racer first and installer second…i.e. racer equals functionality first and cosmetics second.

Will learn how to post pictures and give an update when I get the car back.

[newman]

lol. posting pictures is about as hard as taking a leak.

[Bruce]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

My car funs fine, however I think the tune could be better

If it runs fine why do you think the tune could be better?

[Lotus F1]

Originally Posted by Bruce

If it runs fine why do you think the tune could be better?

There is always improvements that can be made. Even the stock Lotus ECU needed to be tweaked to fix the rough idle and stall issue. Something like engine managment is so complex that little tweaks can be useful. On my Miata which is turbo'd I did tweaks on it for years and the result was a smoother running turbo system that ran nicer then the stock version done by Mazda.

Right now with Scotty's last tune my car runs better then ever before and it is getting very close to the stock drivability. It idlles from a cold start and is smooth 95% of the time. It needs tweaking to get the last 5% but then again so does the Lotus tune for many.

[Bruce]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

Hello all,

No my car did not blow up

I read your car is now un-turbo'd. True?

[Sky-King]

I am having the Turbo removed, because i am thinking of selling it (the Elise)and purchasing a Noble. I dont want to sell the car with the Turbo on it, as i live in southern california and it would be a hassle. I also dont want to keep messing with the car, and try to make it something it is not (A Noble) which is what i should have purchased in the first place, however i wasnt sure i would want to spend that much on a car, however, i love driving the Elise, so i am sure i would LOVE the Noble even more, so i am 95% sure i am going to take the plunge

[Bruce]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

I am having the Turbo removed

Are you having any other engine work done when the turbo is removed?

[JLSELISE]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

I also dont want to keep messing with the car, and try to make it something it is not (A Noble) which is what i should have purchased in the first place, however i wasnt sure i would want to spend that much on a car, however, i love driving the Elise, so i am sure i would LOVE the Noble even more,

Good rationale .

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

I am having the Turbo removed, because i am thinking of selling it (the Elise)and purchasing a Noble. I dont want to sell the car with the Turbo on it, as i live in southern california and it would be a hassle. I also dont want to keep messing with the car, and try to make it something it is not (A Noble) which is what i should have purchased in the first place, however i wasnt sure i would want to spend that much on a car, however, i love driving the Elise, so i am sure i would LOVE the Noble even more, so i am 95% sure i am going to take the plunge

I can understand the switch to the Noble, but I'm still trying to figure out why you would remove your turbo. The labor for in/out seems awfully prohibitive. Sure there's not more to this story?

[JLSELISE]

Originally Posted by Dave

I can understand the switch to the Noble, but I'm still trying to figure out why you would remove your turbo. The labor for in/out seems awfully prohibitive. Sure there's not more to this story?

When a used car registered in CA is sold in CA it must pass a smog test (visual + emissions) independent of age, and the responsibity for passing that test is on the seller. I suspect risk management is the reason for removal of the turbo.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by JLSELISE

When a used car registered in CA is sold in CA it must pass a smog test (visual + emissions) independent of age, and the responsibity for passing that test is on the seller. I suspect risk management is the reason for removal of the turbo.

Maybe true, but limiting yourself to selling only in CA and not offer nationwide would be a mistake IMO. Of course, that's assuming that the turbo is working properly in the first place.

[Sky-King]

Originally Posted by Dave

Maybe true, but limiting yourself to selling only in CA and not offer nationwide would be a mistake IMO. Of course, that's assuming that the turbo is working properly in the first place.

It will be much easier to sell the car normally asperated then with the Turbo, and as i have stated, the Turbo requires constant tinkering, and i dont want the hassle of selling the car with something that if not managed properly will create lots of questions and possible issues with the new owner, i just want to sell it and forget about it, if i do sell it.

The Turbo is not a "set it and forget it option", it is a pain in the ass if you dont like playing with the car and reseting the map every few weeks.

I think that i have givin as straight as an anwser as possible, so please dont go looking for resons that are not there. And yes selling a modified car in California is not an option, also, i will only sell the car locally as selling a car out of state is a hassle and i dont need to sell it that bad, also california is a huge market and i should not have any issue selling the car if i decide to.
I may just trade it in against a new Noble that may be an option.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

...the Turbo requires constant tinkering, and i dont want the hassle of selling the car with something that if not managed properly will create lots of questions and possible issues with the new owner...

The Turbo is not a "set it and forget it option", it is a pain in the ass if you dont like playing with the car and reseting the map every few weeks.

This is what I was curious about - I could have phrased my original reply/question better...thanks for clearing that up.

As for the Noble, you'll love it. 1G Racing is just 30 minutes from my house. I test drove a M12...quite a machine. I can only imagine how the M400 performs. Best of luck on whatever direction you go.

[Sky-King]

Best of luck on whatever direction you go.[/quote]

Thank you Dave, i will keep you posted.

[PhlypSide]

Originally Posted by Sky-King

...the Turbo requires constant tinkering, and i dont want the hassle of selling the car with something that if not managed properly will create lots of questions and possible issues...

The Turbo is not a "set it and forget it option", it is a pain in the ass if you dont like playing with the car and reseting the map every few weeks....

HUGE +1 on aftermarket Turbos not being set and forget.

This is why I sold my Supra Turbo, if I had kept it any longer I would've started screwing around with it more, e.g. Single turbo conversion or maybe even upgraded twins? (meh, I still have my AEM EMS and speed-density conversion kit, I'm glad I didn't have to use it).

I bought my Elise so I could just do regular maintenance and drive it, without having to worry about special care and feeding that boosting a motor that came with 11.5:1 compression will add. The only option I see as being a happy compromise would be forking out the $$$ to get a factory installed (and warranteed) Supercharger/Turbo from Lotus. Even with factory boost there are more costs of ownership... little ones like... turbo timer anyone--just make sure your e-brake is up to par so you don't have to leave your boosted car in gear while it's idling down?

Well that and I like being able to pull up to any gas station and fill up with premium... not having to worry about 100+ octane gas is fantastic. (When I knew I'd be upping the boost in my Supra say beyond 16PSI I'd go get some 100 Unleaded just to be safe)

[Gaddock]

Hey Sky,
I'm glad that your car turned out better than mine did !
I sent my car to Jay for the "stand alone" turbo kit that he had allegedly developed. I shipped my car to him in December 2005 and did not see it again until June 29th 2006.
Jay did not complete the turbo installation, because he had no "stand alone" ECU solution and I would not opt for anything less than we had agreed upon.
I had asked him to do a few upgrades so that the 6 months that my car sat there would not be a complete waste of time.
Long story (short version):
Jay sent my car back to me (3 days before I was scheduled to race) with the back brakes left unbolted, the heat shields removed, a leaking Moroso oil pan, and a dead Braile battery (guess no one told him they need to be charged every now and then while they sit).
My check engine light came on as soon as I drove it away from the shipping truck, otherwise I would have put the car on the track (guess God was watching Jay work).
I will be posting my "Hass Turbo" experience online in more detail with the hope that Jay doesn't end up killing someone. I spent a lot of time reading reviews (like yours) before sending my car to Jay. I never read anything (seriously) negative about his work.....maybe the other guys check engine light never came on.

Good luck with your car
best regards !

[scottyb]

I've spoken to SkyKing in depth about his car and how it was handled by Jay Hass. He's such a nice guy that he doesn't like to post negative statements. But in a nutshell, this is what he had to say:

1) The install was a complete disaster!
2) there were only 2 of the 4 bolts utilized to bolt the turbo on the manifold
3) He only drove the car two times with the Turbo, for about a total of 20 miles, and experienced some strange behavior from the car, and from the looks of the install He didn’t want to take any chances, so he sent it to his Lotus Friend ASAP. The tech took his time reviewing things, and he is not one to criticize others, but after he had gone through the car, he was shocked with how bad things really were.
4) He has asked Hass for a refund and has yet to hear from Jay

[MikeW]

I'd rather hear the truth than a rosy picture. We need to know these things. I hope any comments good or bad are based on facts. We've had enough emotional responses to fill a courtroom.

[scottyb]

Originally Posted by MikeW

I'd rather hear the truth than a rosy picture. We need to know these things. I hope any comments good or bad are based on facts. We've had enough emotional responses to fill a courtroom.

As I have stated, I spoke to SkyKing on the phone and he said that he would back me up with these statements and the ones about my car. No reason to lie, I have nothing to gain nor loose. This is an issue about integrity, which Mr. Hass has little of.

[zvezdah1]

Hey guys, in fairness to Hass so he's not keeping up with multiple threads on the same subject please put postss on the subject in the main hass thread that Scottyb just started.

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/show...678#post426678

Chris