Twin Oil Coolers - LotusTalk

143hawaii · 08-15-2005, 04:23 AM

Does anyone have a picture of the twin oil coolers mounted from either the front/rear or both?

Tyger · 08-15-2005, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 143hawaii

Does anyone have a picture of the twin oil coolers mounted from either the front/rear or both?

Huh? The oil coolers are just behind the small side grills in the front of the car. Not easy to get a good picture of even one without taking something apart. And no way to get a shot from the rear with the clam on, I'd say.

Randy Chase · 08-15-2005, 07:26 AM

Back in the day... YELOTUS did a lot of awesome pics on his car.

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5644

trompazo · 08-15-2005, 01:42 PM

Pics don't seem to work in that thread.

I didn't order LSS becuase I wanted new shocks and race wheels anyways. I'm thinking of upgrading to the factory cooler to run in stock class so I'm wondering how big of an undertaking installing the second factory cooler would be? Are these parts available yet and any estimate on cost?

My other option is just to run ASP and put in an aftermarket Mocal cooler which is probably alot better than the factory one anyway. Would there be any other places to mount a cooler other than the factory location if the factory location is too difficult?

One thing i have been thinking about is that it maybe is just as expensive to run in stock class than in ASP.

In stock class you would need Ohlins with the more expensive stock class parts and likely a more expensive Lotus brand cooler. Running in ASP would allow me to buy cheaper 15" wheels, cheaper 15" tires, a cheaper oil cooler, cheaper Ohlins with better springs. This may offset the price of a getting a header/intake/ecu/upgraded oil pan.

Since I'm not going to be campaigning this car at a serious level, it seems ASP may be the best route as it's not that much more expensive and would get a much more fun to drive car with the added torque/power.

Stan · 08-15-2005, 02:08 PM

I've heard that the one-cooler cars can be doubled up fairly easily...the plumbing is there, but with an extra hose replacing the second cooler. Hopefully the clam does not need to come off for the install...then again a newbie did a clam-off in 40 minutes, so it's not a disaster.

TimMullen · 08-15-2005, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trompazo

I'm wondering how big of an undertaking installing the second factory cooler would be? Are these parts available yet and any estimate on cost?

I don't know about the cost or availability, but it should be that big of a problem. There is a write up in a Service Bulletin:

Procedure for conversion from single to twin front mounted oil coolers

'Single oil cooler' cars are equipped with an oil cooler ahead of only the LH front wheel, but use the same hoses as twin oil cooler cars, with a joiner union attached to a bracket in place of the symetrically opposite RH cooler. To fit a RH oil cooler proceed as follows:

Parts Required Part Number Qty

Oil Cooler, RH, incl. foam seal A120K0020F 1

Duct, oil cooler, RH A120B0090F 1

Big Head Pop Rivet, duct fixing A089W6297F 3

Remove the front clamshell (refer Service Notes sub-section BR.6).
Disconnect oil cooler hoses from joiner union ahead of RH front wheel using 2 off 1⅛ in. spanners, and plug hose ends to minimise oil loss.
Remove hose joiner bracket and secure new oil cooler, with its pre-applied sealing foam, to mounting bracket using existing fixings. Torque tighten to 22 Nm.
Fit hoses to oil cooler. When tightening the union nut

it is essential that the oil cooler union is held using a 15/16 in. open end spanner whilst torque tightening the hose union nut (1⅛ in) to 40 Nm. Failing to follow this procedure may result in damage to the oil cooler.
Start the engine and check for oil leaks.
Secure the new cooler duct with the three big head rivets to the radiator duct.
Refit the front clamshell.

Fitting time guide: 2.3 hr.

trompazo · 08-15-2005, 02:58 PM

Thanks. I emailed HRM regarding price and availability on those part numbers.

Stan · 08-15-2005, 02:59 PM

>>> 1)Remove the front clamshell....7)Refit the front clamshell...Fitting time guide: 2.3 hr.<<<

Don't bring the car to a body shop for the work....seems like they charge an arm and a leg to remove and replace a clam!

143hawaii · 08-16-2005, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randy Chase

Back in the day... YELOTUS did a lot of awesome pics on his car.

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5644

Thanks Randy, that was exactly what I was looking for!

It's interesting how Lotus placed the two oil coolers up front considering Toyota originally built the engine w/o any oil cooler in mind. I wonder if they did anything to the pump/spring for some added pressure and flow to compensate for what was lost to the plumbing.

trompazo · 08-19-2005, 01:18 PM

Heres is pricing from Newport European:

Oil Cooler, RH, incl. foam seal A120K0020F 1 $556.20 (in stock)

Duct, oil cooler, RH A120B0090F 1 $30.16(In stock at Lotus USA 2-4 day delivery)

Big Head Pop Rivet, duct fixing A089W6297F 3 $1.73 each (in stock)

TOTAL: $591.55. Kinda expensive for an oil cooler as you can get a top-of the line Mocal for much cheaper. But if you want the factory set-up/ducting, I guess it's not too bad.

jtanner · 08-19-2005, 01:44 PM

Has anyone measured the efficiency of our oil coolers? With the MKIV Supra, the intercooler was ducted from the factory, and aftermarket side-mount intercoolers couldn't touch it, despite being larger and having a "better" design because the ducting didn't fit.

Also, ducting stock brakes is usually a better proposition than a big-brake kit with no ducts.

Jim

trompazo · 08-19-2005, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jtanner

Has anyone measured the efficiency of our oil coolers? With the MKIV Supra, the intercooler was ducted from the factory, and aftermarket side-mount intercoolers couldn't touch it, despite being larger and having a "better" design because the ducting didn't fit.

Jim

Not exactly true. Locally I saw a dyno test where a Greddy sidemount made more peak HP than the factory stock mount. However, where the Greddy sidemount got rocked is on a road course.

For drag racing, the Greddy side or FMIC will be better. For road racing, some even recommend the stock intercooler on car making over 600whp.

I run a FMIC, but use a similar setup to the stock mount ducting for my oil coolers.

jtanner · 08-19-2005, 05:39 PM

trompazo, maybe Greddy's improved their sidemount significantly, but five or six years ago there were a rash of side-by-side dyno tests of the Greddy, and every time the stock unit was clearly better or the difference was lost in the statistical noise.

A FMIC is a whole 'nother ball game. The reason some Supra road racers are switching back to side mounts is because they're having cooling issues with the big FMIC blocking the radiator. For that, the ticket seems to be a small FMIC (such as the HKS Type S) combined with the stock plastic underpieces still in place to prevent air from diverting around the radiator. I ran my Supra with the T61 like this at Road Atlanta at two events in the middle of summer with no cooling issues. Compare this to guys with an aftermarket radiator having heating problems.

Again, ducting wins.

Jim

klio · 06-21-2006, 06:08 PM

So the oil coolers arent visible from the front of the car through the two side grills?

edaddy · 06-21-2006, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klio

So the oil coolers arent visible from the front of the car through the two side grills?

They're visible, but you need to look closely. Oil temps, even on 100 degree days, stay in the 155F range with twin coolers. "Touring"

cars used to come this way too.

perryeyges · 06-21-2006, 06:59 PM

I may be selling both of my stock oil coolers and all associated hoses(perfect condition). My car is an early 2005 last three of the Vin #244. Please pm me if you guys have any interest. I am installing one large trunk mounted oil cooler. The front scoops will be used to cool the front brakes.

kverges · 06-21-2006, 08:23 PM

Cool the front brakes? You running a lot more power than stock? I know of no one with brake cooling issues stock.

BTW, since adding my oil temp & pressure gauge, my oil temps (measured in the pan) have never gone over 180 deg F, and that is on a long drive in 95deg ambient. With a turbo. On track I expect them to be higher, but on the street and in an A-X you are wasting your money on adding the second oil cooler IMO.

At least put guages on the thing to see if a cooler makes sense before adding one.

FlyLo · 06-22-2006, 07:04 AM

Local dealer quoted me $900 to install the 2nd Lotus cooler. Parts and Labor. Not bad, given that the parts are $600.

I haven't had any cooling issues yet, so I haven't done it. No evidence that it's needed for a 20-25 minute track session, even in Houston at 90 degrees. I haven't run in the summer though.

perryeyges · 06-22-2006, 07:30 AM

"On track" application, Stasis/Alcons. There will be a lower degree of fade with fresh air ducted front rotors. All steel braked cars seriously benefeit from fresh air ducted brakes under track conditions.
Moving the oil cooler to the rear is intended to reduce weight, 16' of oil hose, 6 fittings, and two (copper?)oil coolers reduced to 6' of oil hose, 4 fittings, and one aluminum cooler. You also gain oil flow rate by reducing the hose length by 10' which in turn increases heat exchange efficiency.

karajabola · 03-08-2009, 10:42 AM

Is there a way to tighten the lower oil cooler fitting without removing the clam? I can visibly inspect it for leaks by removing the front undertray, but I can't think of a way to get tools to reach both ends of the fitting (oil cooler union and hose union nut) to tighten it up.

Why? I have a slow leak from the lower fitting on my LF oil cooler. I want to check for torque before I assume the joint or oil cooler is bad) TSB 2004-21 "Connection checks Front Oil Cooler" almost seems to indicate it can be done.

Thanks!

08-15-2005, 04:23 AM	#1 (permalink)
143hawaii Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 70	Twin Oil Coolers Does anyone have a picture of the twin oil coolers mounted from either the front/rear or both? __________________ 2001 Absolutely Red MR2-S 2ZZ-GE Powered ---SOLD--- '06-'07 SM2 1st Place Hawaii Region Points Champion (2nd Place Run-Offs) 1997 ZX-6R 1st 2-wheel Love 2001 ZX-6R --SOLD-- 2003 ZX-6R --SOLD-- 2005 Titanium Kawasaki ZX-6R / 636 -- Pure Sex on 2-wheels

08-15-2005, 07:26 AM	#3 (permalink)
Randy Chase Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego and where ever the roads lead Posts: 28,175 Images: 761	Back in the day... YELOTUS did a lot of awesome pics on his car. http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5644 __________________ * V E R I T A S * A E Q U I T A S * No Longer the ADMIN here, please do not PM me asking for help. Thanks! http://www.facebook.com/randychase 1991 Toyota MR2. AutoX Beast 2006 Noble M400. Track weapon. 2009 Rossion Q1. Monaco Orange. Canyon Carver. In build: 2009 Toniq R (300whp? 1100 pounds?). Chrome Orange. Lexus GX-470 tow vehicle. On Order: Lotus Evora Next: McLaren MP4-12C

08-15-2005, 02:59 PM	#8 (permalink)
Stan - Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 6,927	>>> 1)Remove the front clamshell....7)Refit the front clamshell...Fitting time guide: 2.3 hr.<<< Don't bring the car to a body shop for the work....seems like they charge an arm and a leg to remove and replace a clam! Last edited by Stan : 08-16-2005 at 04:55 AM.

08-19-2005, 01:44 PM	#11 (permalink)
jtanner Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA USA Posts: 643	Has anyone measured the efficiency of our oil coolers? With the MKIV Supra, the intercooler was ducted from the factory, and aftermarket side-mount intercoolers couldn't touch it, despite being larger and having a "better" design because the ducting didn't fit. Also, ducting stock brakes is usually a better proposition than a big-brake kit with no ducts. Jim __________________ 2005 Ardent Red--Sport Pack--Hard Top

08-19-2005, 05:39 PM	#13 (permalink)
jtanner Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA USA Posts: 643	trompazo, maybe Greddy's improved their sidemount significantly, but five or six years ago there were a rash of side-by-side dyno tests of the Greddy, and every time the stock unit was clearly better or the difference was lost in the statistical noise. A FMIC is a whole 'nother ball game. The reason some Supra road racers are switching back to side mounts is because they're having cooling issues with the big FMIC blocking the radiator. For that, the ticket seems to be a small FMIC (such as the HKS Type S) combined with the stock plastic underpieces still in place to prevent air from diverting around the radiator. I ran my Supra with the T61 like this at Road Atlanta at two events in the middle of summer with no cooling issues. Compare this to guys with an aftermarket radiator having heating problems. Again, ducting wins. Jim __________________ 2005 Ardent Red--Sport Pack--Hard Top

08-15-2005, 01:42 PM	#4 (permalink)
trompazo Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada Posts: 485	Pics don't seem to work in that thread. I didn't order LSS becuase I wanted new shocks and race wheels anyways. I'm thinking of upgrading to the factory cooler to run in stock class so I'm wondering how big of an undertaking installing the second factory cooler would be? Are these parts available yet and any estimate on cost? My other option is just to run ASP and put in an aftermarket Mocal cooler which is probably alot better than the factory one anyway. Would there be any other places to mount a cooler other than the factory location if the factory location is too difficult? One thing i have been thinking about is that it maybe is just as expensive to run in stock class than in ASP. In stock class you would need Ohlins with the more expensive stock class parts and likely a more expensive Lotus brand cooler. Running in ASP would allow me to buy cheaper 15" wheels, cheaper 15" tires, a cheaper oil cooler, cheaper Ohlins with better springs. This may offset the price of a getting a header/intake/ecu/upgraded oil pan. Since I'm not going to be campaigning this car at a serious level, it seems ASP may be the best route as it's not that much more expensive and would get a much more fun to drive car with the added torque/power.

08-15-2005, 02:08 PM	#5 (permalink)
Stan - Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 6,927	I've heard that the one-cooler cars can be doubled up fairly easily...the plumbing is there, but with an extra hose replacing the second cooler. Hopefully the clam does not need to come off for the install...then again a newbie did a clam-off in 40 minutes, so it's not a disaster.

08-15-2005, 02:58 PM	#7 (permalink)
trompazo Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada Posts: 485	Thanks. I emailed HRM regarding price and availability on those part numbers.

08-19-2005, 01:18 PM	#10 (permalink)
trompazo Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada Posts: 485	Heres is pricing from Newport European: Oil Cooler, RH, incl. foam seal A120K0020F 1 $556.20 (in stock) Duct, oil cooler, RH A120B0090F 1 $30.16(In stock at Lotus USA 2-4 day delivery) Big Head Pop Rivet, duct fixing A089W6297F 3 $1.73 each (in stock) TOTAL: $591.55. Kinda expensive for an oil cooler as you can get a top-of the line Mocal for much cheaper. But if you want the factory set-up/ducting, I guess it's not too bad.

06-21-2006, 06:08 PM	#14 (permalink)
klio Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 4	So the oil coolers arent visible from the front of the car through the two side grills?

06-21-2006, 06:59 PM	#16 (permalink)
perryeyges Porsche-Pro Join Date: May 2004 Location: Berzerkley Posts: 3,118	I may be selling both of my stock oil coolers and all associated hoses(perfect condition). My car is an early 2005 last three of the Vin #244. Please pm me if you guys have any interest. I am installing one large trunk mounted oil cooler. The front scoops will be used to cool the front brakes.

06-21-2006, 08:23 PM	#17 (permalink)
kverges Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Dallas Posts: 926	Cool the front brakes? You running a lot more power than stock? I know of no one with brake cooling issues stock. BTW, since adding my oil temp & pressure gauge, my oil temps (measured in the pan) have never gone over 180 deg F, and that is on a long drive in 95deg ambient. With a turbo. On track I expect them to be higher, but on the street and in an A-X you are wasting your money on adding the second oil cooler IMO. At least put guages on the thing to see if a cooler makes sense before adding one.

06-22-2006, 07:04 AM	#18 (permalink)
FlyLo Laughin' Easy Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 1,863	Local dealer quoted me $900 to install the 2nd Lotus cooler. Parts and Labor. Not bad, given that the parts are $600. I haven't had any cooling issues yet, so I haven't done it. No evidence that it's needed for a 20-25 minute track session, even in Houston at 90 degrees. I haven't run in the summer though.

06-22-2006, 07:30 AM	#19 (permalink)
perryeyges Porsche-Pro Join Date: May 2004 Location: Berzerkley Posts: 3,118	"On track" application, Stasis/Alcons. There will be a lower degree of fade with fresh air ducted front rotors. All steel braked cars seriously benefeit from fresh air ducted brakes under track conditions. Moving the oil cooler to the rear is intended to reduce weight, 16' of oil hose, 6 fittings, and two (copper?)oil coolers reduced to 6' of oil hose, 4 fittings, and one aluminum cooler. You also gain oil flow rate by reducing the hose length by 10' which in turn increases heat exchange efficiency. Last edited by perryeyges : 06-22-2006 at 07:59 AM.

03-08-2009, 10:42 AM	#20 (permalink)
karajabola Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 321	Is there a way to tighten the lower oil cooler fitting without removing the clam? I can visibly inspect it for leaks by removing the front undertray, but I can't think of a way to get tools to reach both ends of the fitting (oil cooler union and hose union nut) to tighten it up. Why? I have a slow leak from the lower fitting on my LF oil cooler. I want to check for torque before I assume the joint or oil cooler is bad) TSB 2004-21 "Connection checks Front Oil Cooler" almost seems to indicate it can be done. Thanks!

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