First Test Drive - rather long post

[6_speed]

Hi Everyone,

I took my first test drive in a 2005 (demo) Elise at a local dealership. I have been following this forum since early this year. When I first heard about the Elise in late 2004, I almost bought one then but we were expecting a newborn, so I took a 2-year hiatus.

Now, it's time to look at the Elise again

Yesterday, I took a 10 mile test drive along some backroads and freeway (50-50). The demo car has Touring only(no LSS). Here're my impressions:
1) Looks: My neighbor bought one around early 2005, so I have had a good look at it. The demo I test drove was a 2005 too, so no visual differences.
2) Ingress: I didn't get to sit in my neighbor's car. Yesterday, it was my first time getting into the car. The car has no top, so I just watched how the salesguy got in and followed - open door, push back the seat, hold on to the top of the windshield, step on the aluminium plate in front of the seat one foot at a time, lower self onto the seat, adjust seat forward - piece of cake and it took less than 1 hour . Seriously, it was not that difficult. I'm 5' 10" and 160lbs.
3) Start engine: I had to ask the salesguy to adjust passenger's side mirror - the last time I had to do such a thing was on a 1984 Honda Civic - good to be back I turned the ignition key. Nothing happen. Oh, hit the Start button said the salesguy.
4) The drive: The car has about 300 miles on it but the salesguy said not to worry - just drive it like you stole it. The first thing I listened for was the exhaust note. It was throaty, exactly how I like them. The car hasn't moved an inch and I already like it. We hit freeway and was doing 90mph in no time and the shift was still in 5th. The steering/handling was crisp and precise. It was not heavy at all, just weighted right. We got off the freeway onto the backroads and I was in 2nd and 3rd most of the time through the switchbacks. This car reminded me of my Miata and RX7 only much lighter and tossable. The grip was fantastic and I was beginning to feel the steering at these low speeds. No complaints though. I had a chance to test the brakes when I almost slammed onto a speed bump. The brake travel was a bit weak but the car stopped without any drama. This was one of the best drives.

I was a little skeptical before taking the test drive. I thought I would be disappointed with the Elise based on its specs. My current ride is a FD3 RX7 Touring. It's one helluva car. It would take a helluva-er car to make me want to sell it. The Elise exceeded all my expectations except for straight out acceleration where the RX7's torque and turbo provides a bigger kick.

Would I replace my RX7 with an Elise?

Let's see. The Elise has almost no amenities, no insulation, bad NVH, no remote side mirror control, no place to store anything, no trunk space, no faster, bad ingress/egress, makes the RX7 drives like a GT. Hmm, not a difficult decision.

I'll take one, please

The things that sold me were all the above no's or bad's. I have been looking for such a car and found one in the RX7 (in 1993) but today the Elise takes the crown and role from the RX7.

Now, I have a few questions
1) I'm taking the Touring(wife's wants it) but might consider the LSS. Should I consider the LSS? I don't see myself going back to autoX/track for a long while and even if I do, it's going to be more recreational, not competitive. Mind you, I still drive pretty aggressive but from the test drive, I felt the 'base' should serve me well. If I were to get the LSS, I will also get LSD/TC which adds up pretty fast $$-wise for the little forseeable future use.
2) During the test drive, I missed the 2nd to 3rd a couple of times. Is this normal or was there a TB for that?
3) Soft top. I don't see much need for a hardtop(see above on track/autoX). In the SF Bay Area, it rains but not hard. Would the soft top suffice for those rainy days?
4) Tires. Better treadwear than those on LSS-equipped. I had S02 before which were rated 180 too. But Yokohama seems to monopolize and therefore can demand $175/$242. Ouch! Other options?
5) Reliability. I know there is a Yamaha/Toyota engine back there, so that should be covered but what about the other parts?

I looking at Aspen White/Solar Yellow Touring. My wife likes Graphic Grey. But we both agree that any shade of grey can be a problem with those SUVs mistaking the car for the asphalt.

Hopefully, I can post pictures when we do indeed buy one.

Thanks for listening.

[ivan1]

Originally Posted by 6_speed

hold on to the top of the windshield

don't do that!!!

I have a hardtop and only put it on in the winter in NY, and really would be just fine without it. Then again my soft top has not been on the car in months....

[JediMindGamez]

so I just watched how the salesguy got in and followed - open door, push back the seat, hold on to the top of the windshield, step on the aluminium plate in front of the seat one foot at a time, lower self onto the seat, adjust seat forward - piece of cake and it took less than 1 hour

I'd recommend not grabbing the top of the windshield. That area is nothing but fiberglass and you could damage it by grabbing it.

Unless you plan on tracking and autoxing regularly, I'd stick with the base suspension. If you ever do upgrade to a regular track rat, you can always get ohlins later.

I've never missed 2nd to 3rd, I think the most common miss I make is 4th to 5th. Maybe your just not use to the car???

The car is very reliable, there have been a few tranny issues with a handful (single digit number IIRC) of cars but besides that the car is good. Just have to remember that its a Lotus and not a Honda and minor parts (AC knobs, etc) will fall off. Also if you do the maintance yourself make sure you check that everything is torqued right and not just change the oil, etc. because this car tend to disassemble itself over time.

Good luck finding the car of your dreams.

[zvezdah1]

Definately DO NOT get sport suspension(LSS). Tire replacement because of the soft compound of the Ao48s can get expensive. The standard suspension is more than adequate for the occasional track day/fun autocross. Standard suspension is more forgiving on the street too (tho I know some of the LSS guys will fight me on this one). The standard suspension has much less transmitted road noise as well.

[fpitas]

If you think you'll ever want LSD/TC, get it with the car. It's a real pain to install it yourself.

[MattG]

1. Based on how you described using the car, I think LSS would not be worth it for you. The base suspension and tires are fantastic for recreational track or autocross use. The LSS' tires (A048) do make a noticeable difference in handling but it's not something most people would miss, I think.

2. I haven't heard of people missing upshifts.

3. Neither top is perfectly watertight, you can expect a couple drops to get in. The soft top would be just fine.

4. Can't comment much, I know people are trying other tires with success but I also know that Lotus worked with Yokohama to develop a specific version of the AD07 for the Elise. I've been really happy with the stock tires and haven't had much desire to switch.

5. Yeah, it's a Toyota engine, but Lotus managed to integrate that drivetrain such that many of the early Elises *stall*. In spite of that though, the cars are pretty reliable. They are a bit more demanding in terms of service - for example, brake fluid change every year; and there are a many bolts that need to be torqued on a regular basis.

Color: you'll be invisible to SUVs no matter what color you get!

[Ram]

2. I've missed 2-3 a few times in a few Elises, and rarely in any other car. It usually happens if I haven't driven it in a while, and I'm sure you'll get used to it.

[Donbecker]

The shifting on this car is more in the wrist.

[Darkness]

I also miss 2 -> 3 on occasion, and 4 -> 3 when double clutching. But I've only had the car for 3 days and 350 miles...

[def]

Originally Posted by 6_speed

hold on to the top of the windshield,

Yeah, don't do that!!! A friend (6'5) was getting out of my car and SLAMMED his back against my softtop's edge thing going upwards... i cringed, but all was fine.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

The car has about 300 miles on it but the salesguy said not to worry - just drive it like you stole it.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

1) Should I consider the LSS?

Doesn't seem like you need it, have to change tires often, rougher ride. I like the hard and responsive ride, and MAY get different tires after these A048's go out that last longer.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

2) During the test drive, I missed the 2nd to 3rd a couple of times. Is this normal or was there a TB for that?

Never had this issue, and I was not too experienced with a stick shift when I got my elise...

Originally Posted by 6_speed

I looking at Aspen White/Solar Yellow Touring. My wife likes Graphic Grey. But we both agree that any shade of grey can be a problem with those SUVs mistaking the car for the asphalt.

GG rocks! I think with any color you have to be careful and observant of other cars, to me this didn't matter and havent had any problems yet (knock on wood). Cops may not see it as easy either, which could be a good thing

[megatron]

- If you don't plan on going to the track much, get the base. Get an 05 and save some money.
- Get the hard top. It is well worth the price even if you don't use it much. Just ask those on ET who wish they have gotten one when they bough the car.
- Reliability. Comparing to an RX7...I don't think it is any worst.

[Scott in Houston]

Same sales guy grabbing the wind shield is saying don't worry about break in... OMG. Can we have his badge number please?

[lotuscar]

My 05 just turned 19K today! No real problems. Have the touring option with no hardtop. No need for it. I like as much open air as I can get. The rear tires will be replaced next week. LOVE the car. Makes my Elan (M100) seem like a bus.

[habendanio]

I live in the bay area. My car came with the hard top. It gives it a mean/cool look. Takes about 5 minutes to take off. I've noticed that to me it's more enjoyable with the soft top or no top. Soft top only takes a couple minutes to remove with no tools. The soft top does'nt squeak as much as the hard top, and you don't hear any squeaks with no top. The only time I put the hard top on would be If I was planning to wash the car. I've stalled a couple time with the car but mostly while it was still being broke in, It probably was me, need to remember low torque. If you decide to get the car, join us on the next Norcal run. I've been to a couple and really enjoyed the drive and meeting fellow enthusiasts.

[dododge]

Originally Posted by 6_speed

hold on to the top of the windshield

As everyone else has mentioned, this is considered a bad idea.

There's a video around of a guy quickly getting in and out of an Elise. See item #1 over in the uberpost. I've been trying his procedure the last couple days and it does work but it has some issues, such as my belt keeps catching on the door latch when I'm getting out, and the part of the door sill he puts his hand on feels like unbraced fiberglass to me.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

We hit freeway and was doing 90mph in no time and the shift was still in 5th.

Once it's broken in and you're used to the idea of revving it high I think you can hit 90 comfortably in 4th.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

2) During the test drive, I missed the 2nd to 3rd a couple of times. Is this normal or was there a TB for that?

I missed 3rd lots of times in the first week or two; I just couldn't find the notch. After a month I hardly ever miss a shift.

Originally Posted by 6_speed

Would the soft top suffice for those rainy days?

Probably. I think you can expect leakage from both the hard and soft top. I get a few drops near the windshield-door junction if I'm driving in the rain. When parked I don't think it leaks at all.

BTW the engine cover will leak into the trunk if you park it facing uphill in the rain (or when washing it). It's a design problem and it's easy to see why if you try it.

[6_speed]

Thanks for all the responses and comments. Much appreciated.

hold on to the top of the windshield
ivan1,JediMindGamez,def,Scott,dododge: don't do that!
me: thanks for the advice. I didn't know the windshield frame was not structural. Q: so in the event of a roll-over(touch wood), is the support just from the (targa) roof? Or none at all? I saw the video (on ingress/egress) once and revisited it today - should be 2nd nature after a few tries.

LSS(LSD/TC)
zvezdah1,fpitas,MattG,def,megatron: probably no need for LSS
me: agree. Q: does the LSS add anything to the steering feel? For e.g. on BMW, its SP makes the steering more responsive and precise. The base I tested was already responsive and precise but wouldn't hurt to have more.

Reliability
JediMindGamez,MattG,megatron,lotuscar: no problems
me: good to know. I am concerned with the comment that (other) things need to be re-torqued periodically. Q: Is this included in the routine maintenance or a DIY? And if DIY, which are the parts?
megatron: Comparing to an RX7...I don't think it is any worst.. Actually, I have been very lucky with mine . Almost all the bad raps - e.g. engine blowing up - are those modded incorrectly and/or poorly serviced. Don't let those stories steer you away from one.

2nd to 3rd shift
All: some has same problem, some don't.
me: The throw was also a bit longer than I expected. My miata had shorter throw and definitely more slick. My RX7 shift is about the same as Elise. I will get used to it no doubt.

Soft Top
All: most seem to not have one
me: I'll probably skip the hardtop. Besides running out of garage space, my other concern was miscoloration(sp?) with the car itself from lack of use over time.

As for color choice, my wife might win on this.

I'm still awed by the experience, all you owners are lucky None of the other roadsters come close to the unique experience - not Z4/Boxster/S2000. Maybe a specMiata...

Back to lurking and drooling.

[def]

Q: so in the event of a roll-over(touch wood), is the support just from the (targa) roof? Or none at all? There is a roll bar in the windscreen area

Q: does the LSS add anything to the steering feel?
Not technically, but the LSS tires seem to add more feeling to the road, which you can feel in the steering wheel


Q: Is this included in the routine maintenance or a DIY?
Either one, if you choose to DIY you can, but every 7500 miles the dealer should do this for you (i think)

[EburgE]

I was on the fence about whether to get LSS, and I did get it.

Now I wish I had gotten the Stage II exhaust or another aftermarket exhaust instead. I think the exhaust would have given me more pleasure for my buck.

[fpitas]

Note that for my uses I wanted the LSD, but not the LSS. Better suspension solutions are available than the LSS, although some of them will bump you out of stock class if you are racing. YMMV.

[johnson0848]

Originally Posted by lotuscar

My 05 just turned 19K today! No real problems. Have the touring option with no hardtop. No need for it. I like as much open air as I can get. The rear tires will be replaced next week. LOVE the car. Makes my Elan (M100) seem like a bus.

Are you saying you got 19K miles out of the original tires? If so great. I dont drive mine hard at all and am wondering how long the tires will last. I hope I get 19K out of mine.