Jimmy Carter steals Jackson and Sharpton's thunder

[Moto44]

Some would be quick to call this "bleeding heart liberal" talk. Read my rule number two:

Originally Posted by Moto44

2. We expect everybody to take personal responsibility, not play the blame game.

I find it concerning that "compassion" and "empathy" have become politically charged. Just because someone voices the need for compassion doesn't mean that they deny the need for "personal responsibility". They go hand-in-hand.

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by Lotus Fury

The problem is that the people protesting against the fiscal waste are being bunched in with the racists - no matter how few there are. Rush really isn't helping the matter:
Raw Story Limbaugh: We need segregated buses

Until the Republicans take the time to expunge these jackasses from the party instead of the moderates the Republican's aren't going to get ANY traction on the issue. Again, when the Republicans are minorities in both houses of Congress, a minority of the Governorships and we don't have a Republican President what kind of voice do we have? We're become the whiny minority.

This is true. However, I'd say that the people that want to lump the majority in with a racist 1% in order to avoid actually having to think about what the 99% are saying will always be able to do so with a video camera and lots of screaming. Clever editing helps, too. But yes, I think you're right.

[ezmoney]

Originally Posted by Lotus Fury

Until the Republicans take the time to expunge these jackasses from the party instead of the moderates the Republican's aren't going to get ANY traction on the issue. Again, when the Republicans are minorities in both houses of Congress, a minority of the Governorships and we don't have a Republican President what kind of voice do we have? We're become the whiny minority.

In case you didn't notice the Republican Party ran Bob Dole against Bill Clinton in 1996. Dole is a moderate and was soundly beaten by Clinton.
Popular Vote for the 1996 Presidential Election
Clinton 47,400,125
Dole 39,198,755

Last year we ran another moderate Republican, John McCain, and he too was beaten.

If the Republican Party is ever to regain any power it will have to run true conservative candidates. We tried your way with moderate candidates and failed. If you do the same things over and over and expect different results . . . . . I think you get the point.

BTW how to you propose to expunge anyone from a political party???

[Cardinal]

Originally Posted by ezmoney

In case you didn't notice the Republican Party ran Bob Dole against Bill Clinton in 1996. Dole is a moderate and was soundly beaten by Clinton.
Popular Vote for the 1996 Presidential Election
Clinton 47,400,125
Dole 39,198,755

Last year we ran another moderate Republican, John McCain, and he too was beaten.

If the Republican Party is ever to regain any power it will have to run true conservative candidates. We tried your way with moderate candidates and failed. If you do the same things over and over and expect different results . . . . . I think you get the point.

BTW how to you propose to expunge anyone from a political party???

Oops, good eye. The way the elections are now run, I'm not sure how a moderate could win. I think there was a thread about this some time ago.

By moderates, I think he means the non-extremist, non-racist types instead of moderate conservatives. Maybe I'm wrong though.

[Moto44]

Originally Posted by ezmoney

If the Republican Party is ever to regain any power it will have to run true conservative candidates. We tried your way with moderate candidates and failed. If you do the same things over and over and expect different results . . . . . I think you get the point.

Sounds plausible, yet this would be a mistake. Winning elections is about pulling together enough different constituencies with different agenda onto your side to reach that magic number of 50 plus percent of the vote...and turning them out to vote.

The true battle ground hasn't changed...it's about attracting the moderates and the undecideds. You only get to move further to the left or right with your message when you have a comfortable lead and can afford to give up some votes.

The republican platform was close enough to the middle the last election to pull off a win under normal circumstances. But, these weren't normal circumstances. The democrats fielded a candidate that was able to stir up passion. You rarely win an election when your opponent is able to stir up passion.

Clearly, by the next election much of this passion will have subsided. If the republican party decides to move further to the left and forfeit some of the middle, they would be making a mistake.

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by Moto44

Sounds plausible, yet this would be a mistake. Winning elections is about pulling together enough different constituencies with different agenda onto your side to reach that magic number of 50 plus percent of the vote...and turning them out to vote.

The true battle ground hasn't changed...it's about attracting the moderates and the undecideds. You only get to move further to the left or right with your message when you have a comfortable lead and can afford to give up some votes.

The republican platform was close enough to the middle the last election to pull off a win under normal circumstances. But, these weren't normal circumstances. The democrats fielded a candidate that was able to stir up passion. You rarely win an election when your opponent is able to stir up passion.

Clearly, by the next election much of this passion will have subsided. If the republican party decides to move further to the left and forfeit some of the middle, they would be making a mistake.

The Republican Party needs to run candidates that are representative of the majority of the country...i.e. fiscal conservatives and social moderates. They would have huge majorities if they stuck with Reagan fiscal policies and left out the God stuff.

[Moto44]

Without guns and God, the republicans don't stand a chance.

[Rob T]

Originally Posted by Lotus Fury

The problem is that the people protesting against the fiscal waste are being bunched in with the racists - no matter how few there are. Rush really isn't helping the matter:
Raw Story Limbaugh: We need segregated buses

Until the Republicans take the time to expunge these jackasses from the party instead of the moderates the Republican's aren't going to get ANY traction on the issue. Again, when the Republicans are minorities in both houses of Congress, a minority of the Governorships and we don't have a Republican President what kind of voice do we have? We're become the whiny minority.

I don't need to defend Limbaugh, but you should realize that he wasn't actually arguing in favor of segregated buses. It's called sarcasm, and he was making a point about the allegations of racism coming from the left.

[Rob T]

Originally Posted by ezmoney

If the Republican Party is ever to regain any power it will have to run true conservative candidates. We tried your way with moderate candidates and failed. If you do the same things over and over and expect different results . . . . . I think you get the point.

Originally Posted by Moto44

Sounds plausible, yet this would be a mistake. Winning elections is about pulling together enough different constituencies with different agenda onto your side to reach that magic number of 50 plus percent of the vote...and turning them out to vote.

The true battle ground hasn't changed...it's about attracting the moderates and the undecideds. You only get to move further to the left or right with your message when you have a comfortable lead and can afford to give up some votes.

Then please explain how Ronald Reagan won two consecutive landslide victories, some of the most lopsided victories in our history?

He was not a moderate candidate "running to the center".

[Moto44]

The issues that most concern people are continually changing. That's why polling never stops. Without this info, you are blindly guessing about what will turn out the votes.

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by Moto44

Without guns and God, the republicans don't stand a chance.

I don't know, are the Christians conservatives going to vote for Democrats? Are they going to stay home perhaps? If Republicans can find a true fiscal conservative that just keeps his/her mouth reasonably tight lipped about such things...or at least seems moderate about god to most people, the way Obama steered himself to a moderate persona during the election cycle, I think they would win. Regardless of how people feel about the president's policies, I think the next election cycle will be about deficits.

[Moto44]

More guessing...

There's a reason politicians come to rely on polls. One man's opinion is insignificant. We need consensus.

[Moto44]

Have you ever considered how easy it would be to shift the political argument from the pulpit to one of "compassion", "love thy neighbor", and "turn the other cheek"? The Republican hold on Christians is tenuous.

Without abortion, how sure are you that Christians would more likely fall into the Republican camp?

[Lotus Fury]

Originally Posted by ezmoney

If the Republican Party is ever to regain any power it will have to run true conservative candidates.

The Republican party is dying off. They could run anyone and get the same results - failure. Michael Steele had a great opportunity to revamp the party and he choose to continue in the same vein that has gotten us to where we are today. We need leadership that will push us in a new direction. If not we'll win exactly nothing. We'll lose more in Congress. We'll end up with the Southeast and nothing else. We'll have no ability to set any policy. No filibusters. We'll be a joke.

Originally Posted by ezmoney

BTW how to you propose to expunge anyone from a political party???

The same way to do to the "RINO'S". Actively tell them they are not wanted. Ignore them.

[Lotus Fury]

Originally Posted by Rob T

I don't need to defend Limbaugh, but you should realize that he wasn't actually arguing in favor of segregated buses. It's called sarcasm, and he was making a point about the allegations of racism coming from the left.

When taken out of context like everything does he appears like a racist bigoted jackass that ignites the left wing. It gives Democrats an easy out and a rallying point.

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by Moto44

Have you ever considered how easy it would be to shift the argument from the pulpit to one of "compassion", "love thy neighbor", and "turn the other cheek". Republicans hold on Christians is tenuous.

Their hold on Christian conservatives is absolute. Reagan appealed to the Christian conservatives, but his main message was fiscal. Also, times have changed and a Sarah Palin type would never win. She'd get that 30% that would just love her and everyone else would flee. They have the registered Republicans, just like the Dem have the registered Democrats. They are in the bag. It's the independents that win elections. Obama won in a fairly tight race in an economic meltdown at a time of a hugely unpopular war against a 140 yo opponent. If deficits are projected in the trillions each year, he'd have a problem with a moderate social candidate running on fiscal restraint.

[Lotus Fury]

Originally Posted by slaughtr

If Republicans can find a true fiscal conservative that just keeps his/her mouth reasonably tight lipped about such things...or at least seems moderate about god to most people, the way Obama steered himself to a moderate persona during the election cycle, I think they would win. Regardless of how people feel about the president's policies, I think the next election cycle will be about deficits.

Romney. He's the best qualified candidate there is for the job. The issue with him being a Mormon is the only sticking point. He's a religious person without the need to shove it down everyone's throat. It's other's fear of his religion that put him down in the last election. From a fiscal standpoint he would be awesome (I hope).

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by Lotus Fury

Romney. He's the best qualified candidate there is for the job. The issue with him being a Mormon is the only sticking point. He's a religious person without the need to shove it down everyone's throat. It's other's fear of his religion that put him down in the last election. From a fiscal standpoint he would be awesome (I hope).

Something about Romney's hair just screams car salesman to me.

[Moto44]

The republican hold on Christians can be summed up in one word...abortion. That is the only string that keeps many christians tied to the Republican party. And it isn't necessarily enough to ensure Republicans can keep the majority of the Christian vote.

[slaughtr]

Originally Posted by Moto44

The republican hold on Christians can be summed up in one word...abortion.

I would add gay marriage as a signature issue to most of them. Again, I'm not talking about all Christians, just the Christian Conservative block.