Need advice: Buying a bicycle

[Chococar]

I've almost made a commitment to do a multiple-day long bike ride next summer (e.g., across state, across country, etc.). My bicycle is a 20-year old Klein fat-tube aluminum bike with criterium angles and Dura-Ace components. I'm 6'5" tall, so the frame is custom.

I would like something more comfortable, to support days or weeks in the saddle. I would like a modern grupo also. I want to be able to use a triple up front to handle the mountains, wind and elevation all at once.

I've never had a bike this before. I've always had very aggressive bikes that were stiff to facilitate climbing/sprinting.

I'm willing to spend the money to buy a nice bike (but it might delay purchase of a TVS...).

I'm assuming that carbon fiber is the way to go for such a bike. Agreed?

Any suggestions on particular brands/models/features?

Thanks,

Joe

[MikeinAlexandria]

Trek and Cannondale make great bikes in a variety of price ranges. Funny, I have an old Cannondale that sounds similar to your Klein... fat aluminum tubes, short criterium style wheel base, etc.

I used to work for a bike store, and honestly, my best advice is go test riding. Ride everything from a $500 bike to about $8000. You might find you want the most expensive bike... or not.

One thing you definitely want is very high quality components. I'm tall too, and have ridden many different bikes. The ones with crappy components broke very easily. Stick with strong, light alloys for the components and things will last alot longer. As for the frame, it has alot to do with fit and your taste. Be sure and get the bike you choose professionally fitted by a reputable bike shop. It sounds like you are planning alot of riding!

[Chococar]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the sage advice. Any idea how the high-end Campy components compare to the high-end Shimano components these days?

[NSR]

Hey Joe,

Don't forget SRAM, very good components.

I've got a titanium from Seven, awesome company, no extra money for custom, they even have Ti/carbon combos. I've ridden long distances on titanium, very comfortable.

Jae

[Kjakk]

At 6'-5" it may be tricky to get a good carbon fiber frame that fits. I use aluminum with a full carbon fork and that works fine for me.

The thing about Campy is that there are very minimal differences between the Chorus and the Super Record groups in terms of performance, quality and weight so unless you really want it, you dont need the very top line to get great stuff and the price drops down quite a bit.

[Tormac]

Are you looking for a bike to do full loaded touring, or more of a sport bike for “credit card” touring (i.e. are you camping and carrying most everything with you, or are you sleeping in hotels and eating out and only carrying a minimum of gear).

If you are buying a full on touring bike, I think the best thing out there is one of Waterford's adventure cycles.

(Waterford Precision Cycles, Welcome to Waterford Precision Cycles)

You won’t find a better riding full touring frame. I’ve used one for years and am very happy with it. The lugged steel frame gives a very pleasant ride, with just enough compliance unlike oversized aluminum frames. The steel is also going to be more durable and repairable in the long run (assuming it is protected from rust).

Of course they are pricey, and if this is a bike you just plan on using once or twice, then a traditional lugged frame may be too expensive, and a cheaper made aluminum or carbon fiber bike might make more sense.

I believe Waterford will do custom frames if you’re personal build requires one.

If you’re on more of a budget Cannondale makes a nice line of touring bikes as well.

( 2009 Cannondale Touring 2 )

The trek is not bad either.

( Trek Bikes | Bikes | Road | 520 )

As far as the parts go, you are likely looking at a mix of Shimano Deore parts with some road parts. To handle the larger gear range of a triple and large rear cog the drive train is going to be mountain bike parts. Campy has made some mountain bike groupos, but are very pricey, and have developed a reputation for being cranky and require constant maintenance.

Like MikeinAlexandria suggested, trying to find a bike shop in the area where some of the guys do loaded touring.

What kind of riding do you do? Since you mentioned having a 20 year old criterium set up I’m assuming you used to do triathlons? Or were you into more specialized road riding like time trials? While you’re pricing out things be sure to include racks, panniers, and tools if you plan on doing loaded touring. If you’ve not done loaded touring, you may not have a lot of the accessories that will be necessary.

[mikester]

I've got a Waterford (built waaay back in '93!) and they're great bikes !

I'm old skool - steel for me. I think for touring a nice steel frame may be a good way to go, at least worth considering.

[Ren Man]

My personal preferance for a frame is steel. It is a bit heavier than alot of the other materials out there but it seems to have the best mix of benifits vs drawbacks. I also like having a carbon fork to dampen some of the road vibration. As fas as components go I go with the higher end shimano it is easy to get parts for and less expensive.

[FloridaRob]

I've been very pleased with Specialized. I've got a specialized that ran in the $3,000 range. Sram components and I love it. I'm six foot three inches and the frame and handle bar position fit me better than my Trek and Cannondale did. But the best thing is just to go out and test ride them.

[fitfan]

how much do you want to spend?

if your looking to replace your klien, you can do that with a modern carbon frame - if you want a more relaxed geometry as your prime bike?

in that case i would reccomend a cyfac (what i ride, so i am biased!) but truth is... for ~4-6k range you can have a custom fit, custom geometry, state of the art, full carbon, frameset that will be lighter, sprint, accelerate, and climb, descend, turn and handle better, not beat you up and look the business. honestly, my 'road' custom cycfac is a better crit bike than my old crit bike!

you can find other carbon frames cheaper - but for long rides, the #1 thing will be fit - so you might want to consider custom size and geometry (cyfac does both - not just custom fit like some other frame builders) you really can have "just about" everything in one frame, but... its not cheap, but, it is worth every penny.

check them out in the us, talke to Eric...

Cyfac Custom Bicycle Frames

components - i would agree, scram red. compact crank

i would gues at your height your not light... so some solid wheels, nothing too low on spoke count or soft rims.

if oyu wanna go cheap... gosh, i dunno anything in the 2-3k for a complete bike range.. .they are all a comodity and comparable - just ride and get what feels like it fits the best, specialized, trek, scott, fuji.. check out felts. time are really nice imo - but your getting close to cyfac pricing, and you get so much more with the cyfac for a just a little more.

[Chococar]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts. Some answers:

I used to be a Cat IV rider (30 years ago), riding 300 miles/wk in Colorado, including mountain roads. I rode criteriums, road races, and a couple of stage races. I think time trials would have been my best event, but I never did one. One of my favorite rides took me from my house at 8,000 ft. to the top of Mt Evans, a 14,000 mountain--all on paved roads. Fantastic views, wildlife, crazy weather. The biggest danger was melting my tire glue on the scary descents :-). I did set a personal best of 56 mph on my daily descent into work down in Golden

Now, I'm just doing one 30+ mile social ride on Sundays. It's difficult for me to ride during the week because of my work schedule. I ride an exercise bike and run during the week. I will need to design a serious training plan and figure out how to put in some serious mileage for the next year to get ready for the "big ride".

The purpose of the bike is to support a possible cross-country (or cross-state) ride next year to mark my 60th birthday. I haven't quite committed myself emotionally to this goal yet, but the purchase of a new bike would embody that commitment. It would be "credit card camping", so I would be carrying minimal stuff on the bike--no panniers, tent, etc.

I think I want more of a RAAM bike than a Touring bike. Whatever that means... I've ridden a custom bike for many years now, so I'm expecting this one may be as well. I agree with the statement made by many of you: fit is the most important thing.

I'm willing to spend whatever it takes to get the "right" bike. $5K, $10K, $2K, whatever. It's much easier to afford the "best bicycle in the world" than it is to afford the "best car in the world", the "best house in the world", or even the "best watch in the world". Of course, if I could be happy with the performance of an inexpensive bike, I'd be thrilled to make that choice--I'm not dying to spend a lot of money, but I do appreciate great products.

I'm currently at 220 lbs, aiming for 199 by the start of this ride next summer. In the past, my bicycle frame selection was all about the strength of the bottom bracket, rear stays, etc. as well as steep angles and a short wheelbase. I don't have the strength I did when I was in my 20s (somehow), and I don't do as much serious climbing, so I think that's less of a concern now.

My bike rides like my Lotus, which is great for a few-hour ride, but my priorities are different for a 1-month or 1-week ride.

SRAM has certainly become a force since I bought my last bike. Back then, GripShift was new (and their only product). I bought Avid stuff from Avid, and RockShox was the rage, but I wasn't riding a mountain bike. I will definitely consider their groups.

I'm lucky to have a good bike shop: FasTrack Bicycles, owned and run by Dave Lettieri. Dave was Lance Armstrong's mechanic for the 2000 Tour de France. Dave is also a very successful racer in his own right (and also team manager). They are knowledgeable, competent, fair, quick, and carry great stuff.

I'll be heading to the bike shop on Tuesday, after my Monday track day at Willow Springs.

Thanks all!

Joe

[SweetDaddyD]

You can buy the fanciest most expensive bike in the world...and some guy on a piece of crap is still gonna hand your @ss to you. lol. I have a nice Cannondale, and it's nice to have a nice bike- but no piece of hardware makes the difference like just putting in your cardio time before hand. The last MS150 I did I actually did on knobby tires on a full suspension mountain bike. (I was strapped after just buying the bike) I had actually trained for that one and did a lot better than my coworker with a brand new fancy Italian road bike. (and I also didn't do as good as another coworker on a 20 year old garage sale bike that seemed to weigh about at least twice what mine did)

Edit: Didn't see your post. Sounds like you have that part all covered.

[Chococar]

Originally Posted by SweetDaddyD

You can buy the fanciest most expensive bike in the world...and some guy on a piece of crap is still gonna hand your @ss to you. lol. I have a nice Cannondale, and it's nice to have a nice bike- but no piece of hardware makes the difference like just putting in your cardio time before hand. The last MS150 I did I actually did on knobby tires on a full suspension mountain bike. (I was strapped after just buying the bike) I had actually trained for that one and did a lot better than my coworker with a brand new fancy Italian road bike. (and I also didn't do as good as another coworker on a 20 year old garage sale bike that seemed to weigh about at least twice what mine did).

I agree. It's just like the best thing to buy for our Lotus to go faster is driver training

[mopho]

Originally Posted by SweetDaddyD

You can buy the fanciest most expensive bike in the world...and some guy on a piece of crap is still gonna hand your @ss to you. lol. I have a nice Cannondale, and it's nice to have a nice bike- but no piece of hardware makes the difference like just putting in your cardio time before hand. The last MS150 I did I actually did on knobby tires on a full suspension mountain bike. (I was strapped after just buying the bike) I had actually trained for that one and did a lot better than my coworker with a brand new fancy Italian road bike. (and I also didn't do as good as another coworker on a 20 year old garage sale bike that seemed to weigh about at least twice what mine did)

Edit: Didn't see your post. Sounds like you have that part all covered.

Sort of a funny story that kind of relates to this: I too was a very serious rider about 15 years ago, did some training with the Harvard race team on weekends under ex Olympic cyclist John Allis , 2-300 miles a week, etc...
After a long hiatus, I recently broke out my custom DeRosa and have started training again. I have a 5 mile bike path that goes from my house to the beach (where it connects to other bike paths), so almost every day now I ride to the beach and back, and try to keep the pace up. I have become quite fast (albeit for only 10-15 miles) and not too many people pass me.
So one day I was cooking along nicely (22-23mph) and some guy in jeans, a button down shirt, and loafers on a beat up POS mountain bike with bags on the side blows past me like I am standing still. Here I am on a nearly $4K (in 1995) road bike all spandexed out and now my ego is kicking in, so I give chase. I got up to 30mph and was just able to keep him in my sites, that is until I blew up after nearly a mile of this pace. Finally had to give up and let him go.
I was gutted, I got home and told my wife (she laughed at me) and I have since been telling everyone how I got blown away by what had to have been an Olympic Cyclist or something. Well last weekend I was at a BBQ and I tell the story and a friends says, "did the bike have two bags?"... yes. "Did it have what looked like a drum brake on the front wheel?"... yes "That was an electric motor you dolt!"




Oh and STEAL IS REAL BABY!



.

[tmr]

I'm a steel frame/carbon fork fan, as this is more comfy to my 51-year-old body than others. It's all a personal choice, as I agree with others that you need to ride a few different types and get a frame that fits.

I bought a Serotta after my brother let me ride his steel frame/carbon fork Serotta with Ultegra components. His has a custom frame ($$$$) and mine was the closest stock frame that fit me. I bought mine on eBay for $650 when it was 3 years old. His was something like $3k+ around 6+ years ago. Regardless, they do a nice job and the quality is hard to beat. Here's their site:

2009 SEROTTA

Another choice in that is not as well known is Kirk. David Kirk used to work for Ben Serotta, but went out on his own a few years back. He's also a Lotus nut, having owned a MkI Lotus Cortina that I once stored in my basement for the guy who sold it to him. He later sold the Cortina and bought a Birkin Seven. Turns out that he designed my Serotta Atlanta frame, which was one of the last ones that company did with a lugged frame. Check out his site, as he appears to be VERY meticulous and will build a custom frame to fit your specific needs:

http://http://www.kirkframeworks.com/index.htm

[Chococar]

thanks for the leads. Kirk has a minimum 9-month lead time, so that won't work. The Serotta bikes look interesting--I'll find some to ride.

Thanks,

Joe

[fitfan]

an interesting thing about cyfac is they can,and do, build anything - stiff, soft, anything in between, and then geometry to match the kind of riding you do, and then custom fit to your dimension. so pretty much whatever performance charateristics you want - they can build into a frame set - its a totaly different mentality than this "trek vs specialized vs steel ve etc.." throw all that out - define what you want (or work with eric to create that deffinition) and that what you will get. (of course they sell stock sizes/geometry as well, for a good bit less)

my bike is basically road race geometry, custom fit, extremly stiff for accelerating and sprinting (if i am going to win, thats how...) but it is not harsh, i rode a 235km race through the high tatra's in poland, 500 mile week in france, and feel fresh as a daisy after - i am in disbelief that a bike can go like stink, be instantly reponsive, yet handle smooth and descend like a dream, and be as comfy as any frame... its weird - hence why i praise them so much. stiffnes AND compliance... (that's what i wanted)

wierd french juju in that frame - i love it. (alain prost carbon engineering )

off the self - moderate priced frames will allways be a compromise between the two.

personaly i think top of the line trek frames are the worst i have ever riden, i can't imagine how anyone rides them... jittery and dead. but... different strokes for diffferent folks! you gotta go with what you like, want, need, value. everyone has their own opinion of whats "good" and they are all right for themselves, but maybe not for you.

i have old dura-ace 10sp, and hate it... will switch over to scram red next year i think.

[macdady2424]

didn't read much of the post, but the most important thing you can do is get a proper fitting for the bike. Especially if on long rides with it, b/c if a crank is to long, or handle bar reach is to great, you will eventually start having aches and much earlier fatigue.

[steuspeed]

Litespeed might be worth a look.

Litespeed Territory Select

[Chococar]

Thanks for all the advice.

I rode a Trek Madone 5.2 bike today that fit me extremely well! They offer a "64 cm" frame in this model along with the possibility of a triple crankset in the Ultegra group. I can't seem to find 180 cranks in a triple. In theory there is a Dura Ace 180 triple, but it may exist only on paper...

It's amazing how well a modern bike feels compared to my 20-year old bike. So light, responsive and the shifting is just amazing!

I'll try to ride some more on Tuesday.

Joe