Alignment question

[Stan]

Maybe try to check the alignment yourself? It's really not that hard. You can check camber with a string and a weight. Toe with some string or an adjustable shower rod. The alignment issue may complicate your shock evaluation efforts.

If you can't do a DIY or PRO alignment, my suggestion would be to use the stock ride height. And you can safely yank the front camber shims as they don't have any real effect on toe or caster on our cars. That should help your tires and gain grip.


>>> The pedals obviously were not designed to be changed as per lotus. Also the pedal placement can easily be made a non-issue by simply getting used to them. Lastly, i don't advocate anything. I couldn't care less what people do with their own cars. There were posts in that thread that basically stated it is impossible to drive the car properly with the current pedal setup. I simply posted to illustrate that this is not the case. Given the choice between performing a brake modification that even a Lotus Tech (who has no vested interest in you not flying into a brick wall) condemns when the problem can be solved by altering your technique seems ridiculous to me. <<<

If this is more comfortable for you, fine. But remember that Lotus MUST say what they say here for legal reasons. They also don't advocate changing shocks or ride height or camber or tire pressure and you want to do this stuff. The thing is they can't have someone graunch down on the brake pedal rubber bush such that it can't move anymore. They can't have someone tighten the wheel bolts to 190 lb/ft either. As you gain experience you discover that there are always ranges to things like this, and that this can be useful at times. If you are not comfortable with a mod then DON'T DO IT. Those that are, will, though.

[offroadr35]

Originally posted by Stan

If this is more comfortable for you, fine. But remember that Lotus MUST say what they say here for legal reasons. They also don't advocate changing shocks or ride height or camber or tire pressure and you want to do this stuff. The thing is they can't have someone graunch down on the brake pedal rubber bush such that it can't move anymore. They can't have someone tighten the wheel bolts to 190 lb/ft either. As you gain experience you discover that there are always ranges to things like this, and that this can be useful at times. If you are not comfortable with a mod then DON'T DO IT. Those that are, will, though.

i totally 100% agree. that is what i tried to express in my last post. however, at the same time, i think as a member of this board, especially one with considerable track time in the car now, I can be helpful by presenting alternate solutions and my opinions.

-Steve

[mact3333]

Originally posted by offroadr35
i totally 100% agree. that is what i tried to express in my last post. however, at the same time, i think as a member of this board, especially one with considerable track time in the car now, I can be helpful by presenting alternate solutions and my opinions.

-Steve

With all due respect Steve, "considerable tracktime"???...didnt I hear you say that you have done a total of 3 track days with the Elise and 3 w/out??...now what you do with your money is totally your business only but wouldnt it be prudent to run on your current suspension for a full track yr to establish a baseline?...I know I learn something new everytime I go out...I do realize you logged alot of laps in the those 3 days though(believe you said you have logged 600hrs in Elise so far...thats lot more than I could do in 3 events thats for sure)...if you have done substantially more track days than I have noted above, then please disregard my post.


Also, we had a friendly debate(Vantage, I said debate and not argument...) in the past regarding the base suspension...you said the base setup was very adequate for even aggressive/spirited driving and that most people couldnt fully tap its potential...believe I got ripped a new one for pounding my fist for ordering LSS package to get a more neutral package from the factory.

Guess Im posting this cause I am abit surprised from your previous posts regarding the base suspension you are already changing over to double adjustable Penske's and I believe you have already swapped out the wheels and tires too???

Hope this post doesnt come across as being negative or anything but just curious why the change of heart already regarding suspension?

[offroadr35]

Originally posted by mact3333
With all due respect Steve, "considerable tracktime"???...didnt I hear you say that you have done a total of 3 track days with the Elise and 3 w/out??...now what you do with your money is totally your business only but wouldnt it be prudent to run on your current suspension for a full track yr to establish a baseline?...I know I learn something new everytime I go out...I do realize you logged alot of laps in the those 3 days though(believe you said you have logged 600hrs in Elise so far...thats lot more than I could do in 3 events thats for sure)...if you have done substantially more track days than I have noted above, then please disregard my post.


Also, we had a friendly debate(Vantage, I said debate and not argument...) in the past regarding the base suspension...you said the base setup was very adequate for even aggressive/spirited driving and that most people couldnt fully tap its potential...believe I got ripped a new one for pounding my fist for ordering LSS package to get a more neutral package from the factory.

Guess Im posting this cause I am abit surprised from your previous posts regarding the base suspension you are already changing over to double adjustable Penske's and I believe you have already swapped out the wheels and tires too???

Hope this post doesnt come across as being negative or anything but just curious why the change of heart already regarding suspension?

i'll try to answer concisely this time. I have now done 4 track days in the Elise, about 200 miles per time. I think very few on here have 800 track miles in their car so far. Definitely enough to know that heel-toeing is perfectly possible and easy. However, i never claim to even remotely be an expert.

I have swapped out the wheels and tires to SSR's and A048s (used to have the kodiaks). On the A048s on the track with the standard suspension I am into the bump stops fairly often. While the standard setup is very good for a street car, for a track car it definitely does not cut it. I am now using the car about 85% on the track or driving to/from the track.

The reason why i passed on the sport pack in the first place was to upgrade to adjustable shocks so this was a planned mod forever.

Oh lastly, i don't have a tremendous amount of car track experience but I raced motorcycles on dirt and on tracks since i was about 6. I would say my current skill level is a 6/10 in cars with 10/10 being Schumy, and 7/10 being a very good non-racer track day driver.

-Steve

[Arno]

Originally posted by offroadr35
the bottom line is that i cannot do it right.

Sure you can..

As the Elise must be aligned and the ride height determined/set *ballasted*. (do not align the Elise un-ballasted.. You get very weird results when driving and when the suspension starts to work in corners)

You can add *more* ballast to the stock suspension setup, get/force the ride height you want to run with the new dampers and then align it how you want.

Once they arrive, swap on the new dampers, put in the correct ballast (70kg in each seat, 1/2 tank fuel) and re-set to the ride height you used previously to align the car. (I assume these dampers have adjustable collars)

All done!

It's ride height that influences stuff like toe and camber.

Bye, Arno.

[meat]

Hard to set ride height when you don't have a perfectly flat surface.

I attempted to set my ride height in my garage which I thought had a flat floor.

I got it on the alignment rack it the ride height was all screwed up.

I don't see how you can "evaluate" dampers/springs when your alignment/ride height is all f'ed up. This car is VERY sensitive to air pressure changes - alignment changes are critical, IMHO.

[Surferjer]

I just want to post a "thanks!" to both Robert Puertas and 008 for actually posting their setups. I have yet to get my car aligned, but at least I have something to go by now. I wouldn't dream of doing this one myself. I HAVE removed the front shims only thus far.

Thanks again and Happy Holidays!