Factory Track Pack Recommended Set up - Page 2 - LotusTalk

Buz · 03-02-2006, 09:21 AM

The rears have no remote resovoir though.

goelise · 03-18-2006, 12:40 PM

I am bumping this thread because I am still very curious what the rear chassis brace kit is all about.

I just came from my test drive of the Elise at Fox Valley Motocars in West Chicago.

I pretty much know what I'd like to specify with the Elise EXCEPT for the track package as the stated 'Rear Chassis Brace Kit' eludes me. What is this?

Sounds like something to actuall improve the safety/integrity of the car.

Please someone post a pic.

Thank you in advance.

spider · 03-18-2006, 12:48 PM

Here you go:

http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/show...ght=rear+brace

Supposedly, the one the comes with the Track Pack is a little different. The one above is a stand-alone version, but not sure if it was superseded by the Track Pack version.

Randy Chase · 03-18-2006, 12:50 PM

Here is my kit...

As you said, it is to prevent chassis problems and improve safety, when the car is used under high grip loading conditions.

goelise · 03-18-2006, 02:08 PM

Thank you very much for the informative posts Spider and Randy Chase.

OK, so here's my next track pack question - I assume the track pack is factory installed. I hope this is not a stupid question but what is the ride height set to when you receive a Elise ordered with the track pack? Is it lower or the same as a Elise with a sport pack? On a visit today to a dealer I saw for myself the ride height on a '05 Elise with sport pack and it looked ok for the street.

I am VERY interested in ordering the Elise with this package but admittedly I will drive it more on the street than on the track. I will, in the future bring it to a track and like knowing that there are already provisions for mounting a harness, etc... I have participated in open track days before so yes, I am an addict. I love the idea of not having to piece meal this together in the future and have the car setup with this on day 1 when I pick it up from the dealer.

Uh oh...ok, i think now I am just writing tryng to convince myself that it is worth it.

Mark Starr · 03-18-2006, 02:14 PM

Hey Goelise.
They are delivered at the same ride height as a car without the Track Pack but can be lowered so that the center of gravity is lower and better suited for the track. The lower set ups my not be advisable for street use...............It's always a compromise............

goelise · 03-18-2006, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Starr

Hey Goelise.
They are delivered at the same ride height as a car without the Track Pack but can be lowered so that the center of gravity is lower and better suited for the track. The lower set ups my not be advisable for street use...............It's always a compromise............

Thanks Markstar.

Good, on it's ride home I prefer it set that way.

Thanks again to all who posted. What a great community.

Mark Starr · 03-18-2006, 05:15 PM

Randy,
I'd love to hear your thoughts on the rear brace after you install it and get a few sessions on it..........Please keep us posted. I have had several requests for installations but haven't done any as of yet..........

Randy Chase · 03-18-2006, 05:19 PM

Hey Mark, I will do that. As soon as I get my car back together....

ronin · 03-18-2006, 05:26 PM

you won't feel a thing but peace of mind knowing that a weak link has been made stronger....as it should have been in the first place.......I've had mine on since November 05.....

Mark Starr · 03-18-2006, 05:29 PM

I should add that I have gone through many sets of rear wheel bearings due to the added grip of running with slicks. I would imagine that the rear brace kit would help eliminate or at least lessen that added wear and tear of the added and not anticipated stress that slicks add to the rear suspension????? I have not seen that probem arise as of yet on the S2 but expect that this second season of track use with S2's and many running with slicks or Hoosiers, we'll start to see that problem. I would suggest that anyone with lots of track time give a real hard look at the rear wheel hubs and check for play. It's not fun when they go. I have also broken several of the 10.9 strength bolts that secure the rear hubs. If you are out there and running on slicks, I STRONGLY suggest changing the bolts as a precaution. They don't cost much and if you break one when you are on the track loading a wheel, it's not fun!!!!! I have broken them several times and have just made it in with 1 bolt hanging on to the hub keeping my wheel on the car. The warning sign is a wheel bearing noise when one side is loaded up but goes away when unloaded...............PULL IN AND STOP!!!! The cars were NOT designed to run on slicks.............The AO48's allow the rear end to rotate more freely and lessen the stress.............

Mark Starr · 03-18-2006, 05:32 PM

Randy,
Stop reading and writing and turn some wrenches!!!!

Mark Starr · 03-18-2006, 05:35 PM

I'll see Nick Adams and Matt Becker next week and ask them about it as well and let you know thier thoughts..............

ronin · 03-18-2006, 10:03 PM

have you seen this?

theob · 03-22-2006, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Starr

I should add that I have gone through many sets of rear wheel bearings due to the added grip of running with slicks. I would imagine that the rear brace kit would help eliminate or at least lessen that added wear and tear of the added and not anticipated stress that slicks add to the rear suspension????? I have not seen that probem arise as of yet on the S2 but expect that this second season of track use with S2's and many running with slicks or Hoosiers, we'll start to see that problem. I would suggest that anyone with lots of track time give a real hard look at the rear wheel hubs and check for play. It's not fun when they go. I have also broken several of the 10.9 strength bolts that secure the rear hubs. If you are out there and running on slicks, I STRONGLY suggest changing the bolts as a precaution. They don't cost much and if you break one when you are on the track loading a wheel, it's not fun!!!!! I have broken them several times and have just made it in with 1 bolt hanging on to the hub keeping my wheel on the car. The warning sign is a wheel bearing noise when one side is loaded up but goes away when unloaded...............PULL IN AND STOP!!!! The cars were NOT designed to run on slicks.............The AO48's allow the rear end to rotate more freely and lessen the stress.............

I assume that you must have done also someting with the oil supply. The 111R cannot sustain long periods with > 1.1G, so in order to fit slicks and deal with higher Gs, we should also consider changing either the oil pan, or adding an accusump or fitting a dry sump

I'm seriously considering fitting slicks in the very near future, but oil comes first...

Randy Chase · 03-22-2006, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyElise

Randy - Are you doing the install and toe adjustment?

Yes.

And the oil pan.

adamant · 03-24-2006, 07:19 AM

Mark,
As I now have the Ohlins installed, I am assuming that for track use, the alignment above would benefit me also? I currently have the stock height beacuase I was told that any lowering would create bump steer. I am only going to do AX this year with a Caterham so I would like the best setup for track I can get. Thanks.

Mark Starr · 03-24-2006, 09:30 AM

Het Adamant,
Suspension set up opinions are like butt holes..........Everyone has one. My suggestion is to find out what works for you. As far as Lotus is concerned, I just spent some time with Nick Adams in Atlanta and they prefer the car set up with a softer suspension allowing for the car to move freely. The stock suspenion is remarkable right out of the box. You have to take into consideration that it was also designed to be driven on the street. If you go lower and stiffer, you will be sacrificing that aspect of the suspension. I prefer a stiffer, lower setting. My car is set up lower than any Elise I have seen stateside and like it that way. Other than being hard to load on a trailer and destroying my inner wheel arches, I love the lower center of gravity and firm bite my Nitrons provide. Stiff springs with softer damping for grip. Hell what do I know. Matt Becker, the chief engineer for Ride and Handling for the Elise will be driving my car and we'll see what a real pro thinks................

meat · 03-24-2006, 09:43 AM

Mark

I'm at 100/110mm ride height. Are you lower than this?

Also - do you have the uprated uprights and toe-links?

Randy Chase · 03-24-2006, 09:48 AM

Side note about the rear track brace installation. I always find the Lotus supplied instructions... well... interesting. I read it a few times and dry fitted things and it seems pretty easy actually to install. Probably the most time consuming thing is the alignment.

With one exception. The rear brace main part has a tab welded on to it that has two holes in it. These two holes use the engine mount attachment bolts to tie the brace into the crossmember structure. The instructions note that your car might have the nuts for the engine mount welded to the crossmember, and if so, they need to be chiseled/ground off. What is worse, is that the two nuts are bit shielded by the engine mount itself, so working room is problematic.

So... anyone have hints on the easiest way to chisel or grind off off the nuts? Maybe a dremel????

03-18-2006, 12:48 PM	#23 (permalink)
spider Team Fiscal Irresponsible Join Date: May 2004 Location: Redondo Beach, Cali49A Posts: 790	Here you go: http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/show...ght=rear+brace Supposedly, the one the comes with the Track Pack is a little different. The one above is a stand-alone version, but not sure if it was superseded by the Track Pack version. __________________ '05 Arctic Silver/Ruby Red - Touring/SS/HT 15"/16" CE28N's/RA-1's/Penske's/Hypercoil's/Goodridge brake lines/Pagid RS-14's/TC Design tow hook/steering wheel hub extension/K&N filter/original Lotus rear brace/Valeo wiper/Sector 111 Bootie, microMIRROR, battery bracket/Odyssey PC680/ReVerie Alcantara CF seat/Lotus UK Alcantara trims: binnacle & shroud, HVAC surround, center console w/ gaitors, sill pockets/sill cupholder/7" 2bular single/Maddog diffuser/Von Hep license plate bracket/1,882 lbs

03-18-2006, 12:50 PM	#24 (permalink)
Randy Chase Forum Founder Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego and where ever the roads lead Posts: 23,314 Images: 761	Here is my kit... As you said, it is to prevent chassis problems and improve safety, when the car is used under high grip loading conditions. __________________ *** V E R I T A S * A E Q U I T A S *** We have been feeling the buzz since 2002 2006 Noble M400. Getrag tranny, Quaiffe LSD, Hinged clams. Duratec dual turbo V6. Hoosier 315-18 tires. 2350 pounds. 0-60mph in 2.9 seconds.

03-18-2006, 02:14 PM	#26 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	Hey Goelise. They are delivered at the same ride height as a car without the Track Pack but can be lowered so that the center of gravity is lower and better suited for the track. The lower set ups my not be advisable for street use...............It's always a compromise............ __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

03-18-2006, 05:15 PM	#28 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	Randy, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the rear brace after you install it and get a few sessions on it..........Please keep us posted. I have had several requests for installations but haven't done any as of yet.......... __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

03-18-2006, 05:19 PM	#29 (permalink)
Randy Chase Forum Founder Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego and where ever the roads lead Posts: 23,314 Images: 761	Hey Mark, I will do that. As soon as I get my car back together.... __________________ *** V E R I T A S * A E Q U I T A S *** We have been feeling the buzz since 2002 2006 Noble M400. Getrag tranny, Quaiffe LSD, Hinged clams. Duratec dual turbo V6. Hoosier 315-18 tires. 2350 pounds. 0-60mph in 2.9 seconds.

03-02-2006, 09:21 AM	#21 (permalink)
Buz Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,892	The rears have no remote resovoir though.

03-18-2006, 12:40 PM	#22 (permalink)
goelise AR #1275 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Midwest, USA Posts: 2,163 Images: 1	I am bumping this thread because I am still very curious what the rear chassis brace kit is all about. I just came from my test drive of the Elise at Fox Valley Motocars in West Chicago. I pretty much know what I'd like to specify with the Elise EXCEPT for the track package as the stated 'Rear Chassis Brace Kit' eludes me. What is this? Sounds like something to actuall improve the safety/integrity of the car. Please someone post a pic. Thank you in advance.

03-18-2006, 02:08 PM	#25 (permalink)
goelise AR #1275 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Midwest, USA Posts: 2,163 Images: 1	Thank you very much for the informative posts Spider and Randy Chase. OK, so here's my next track pack question - I assume the track pack is factory installed. I hope this is not a stupid question but what is the ride height set to when you receive a Elise ordered with the track pack? Is it lower or the same as a Elise with a sport pack? On a visit today to a dealer I saw for myself the ride height on a '05 Elise with sport pack and it looked ok for the street. I am VERY interested in ordering the Elise with this package but admittedly I will drive it more on the street than on the track. I will, in the future bring it to a track and like knowing that there are already provisions for mounting a harness, etc... I have participated in open track days before so yes, I am an addict. I love the idea of not having to piece meal this together in the future and have the car setup with this on day 1 when I pick it up from the dealer. Uh oh...ok, i think now I am just writing tryng to convince myself that it is worth it.

03-18-2006, 05:26 PM	#30 (permalink)
ronin BANNED Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 457	you won't feel a thing but peace of mind knowing that a weak link has been made stronger....as it should have been in the first place.......I've had mine on since November 05..... Last edited by ronin : 03-18-2006 at 10:14 PM.

03-18-2006, 05:29 PM	#31 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	I should add that I have gone through many sets of rear wheel bearings due to the added grip of running with slicks. I would imagine that the rear brace kit would help eliminate or at least lessen that added wear and tear of the added and not anticipated stress that slicks add to the rear suspension????? I have not seen that probem arise as of yet on the S2 but expect that this second season of track use with S2's and many running with slicks or Hoosiers, we'll start to see that problem. I would suggest that anyone with lots of track time give a real hard look at the rear wheel hubs and check for play. It's not fun when they go. I have also broken several of the 10.9 strength bolts that secure the rear hubs. If you are out there and running on slicks, I STRONGLY suggest changing the bolts as a precaution. They don't cost much and if you break one when you are on the track loading a wheel, it's not fun!!!!! I have broken them several times and have just made it in with 1 bolt hanging on to the hub keeping my wheel on the car. The warning sign is a wheel bearing noise when one side is loaded up but goes away when unloaded...............PULL IN AND STOP!!!! The cars were NOT designed to run on slicks.............The AO48's allow the rear end to rotate more freely and lessen the stress............. __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

03-18-2006, 05:32 PM	#32 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	Randy, Stop reading and writing and turn some wrenches!!!! __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

03-18-2006, 05:35 PM	#33 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	I'll see Nick Adams and Matt Becker next week and ask them about it as well and let you know thier thoughts.............. __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

03-18-2006, 10:03 PM	#34 (permalink)
ronin BANNED Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 457	have you seen this? Attached Images

03-24-2006, 07:19 AM	#37 (permalink)
adamant Time to DRIVE Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 1,314 Images: 2	Mark, As I now have the Ohlins installed, I am assuming that for track use, the alignment above would benefit me also? I currently have the stock height beacuase I was told that any lowering would create bump steer. I am only going to do AX this year with a Caterham so I would like the best setup for track I can get. Thanks. __________________ 2006 Exige Chrome Orange

03-24-2006, 09:30 AM	#38 (permalink)
Mark Starr Lotus Sales Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: South Salem, New York Posts: 609	Het Adamant, Suspension set up opinions are like butt holes..........Everyone has one. My suggestion is to find out what works for you. As far as Lotus is concerned, I just spent some time with Nick Adams in Atlanta and they prefer the car set up with a softer suspension allowing for the car to move freely. The stock suspenion is remarkable right out of the box. You have to take into consideration that it was also designed to be driven on the street. If you go lower and stiffer, you will be sacrificing that aspect of the suspension. I prefer a stiffer, lower setting. My car is set up lower than any Elise I have seen stateside and like it that way. Other than being hard to load on a trailer and destroying my inner wheel arches, I love the lower center of gravity and firm bite my Nitrons provide. Stiff springs with softer damping for grip. Hell what do I know. Matt Becker, the chief engineer for Ride and Handling for the Elise will be driving my car and we'll see what a real pro thinks................ __________________ Good judgement is based upon experience. Experience is based upon BAD JUDGEMENT!!! Mark Starr 914 217-4817

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03-24-2006, 09:43 AM	#39 (permalink)
meat Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,172	Mark I'm at 100/110mm ride height. Are you lower than this? Also - do you have the uprated uprights and toe-links?

03-24-2006, 09:48 AM	#40 (permalink)
Randy Chase Forum Founder Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego and where ever the roads lead Posts: 23,314 Images: 761	Side note about the rear track brace installation. I always find the Lotus supplied instructions... well... interesting. I read it a few times and dry fitted things and it seems pretty easy actually to install. Probably the most time consuming thing is the alignment. With one exception. The rear brace main part has a tab welded on to it that has two holes in it. These two holes use the engine mount attachment bolts to tie the brace into the crossmember structure. The instructions note that your car might have the nuts for the engine mount welded to the crossmember, and if so, they need to be chiseled/ground off. What is worse, is that the two nuts are bit shielded by the engine mount itself, so working room is problematic. So... anyone have hints on the easiest way to chisel or grind off off the nuts? Maybe a dremel???? __________________ *** V E R I T A S * A E Q U I T A S *** We have been feeling the buzz since 2002 2006 Noble M400. Getrag tranny, Quaiffe LSD, Hinged clams. Duratec dual turbo V6. Hoosier 315-18 tires. 2350 pounds. 0-60mph in 2.9 seconds.