Video Discussion with Nick Adams regarding Tire Sizes - LotusTalk

lancer360 · 09-07-2007, 10:46 AM

I just posted this in another thread, but thought it should have its own thread. This is a discussion I had with Nick Adams at the VIR Lotus Track Day after he took my car for a spin around VIR full course. It has some very good info in it regarding tire sizes and other topics.

Enjoy!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...17955484&hl=en

JeffersonRaley · 09-07-2007, 01:53 PM

Thanks for posting, it was interesting to hear Nick's thought processes relative to the tire setup.

RA1s like more pressure than it sounds like you were running. Toyo specs them at "high 30s, low 40s for the hot pressure range. Nick's advice on the video corresponds with that. I run mine in the high 30s hot.

kaz · 09-07-2007, 02:09 PM

Yeah like I always say tire pressures are like voodoo...my car gets skittish when the RA1's are high pressure. I like 25.5F 26.5R hot...seems like people are split 50/50 on this.

codymac · 09-07-2007, 02:16 PM

Awesome - thanks!

Especially like seeing mikelr cruise by in the background around 8:10.

lancer360 · 09-09-2007, 06:06 AM

At LOG 27 Yokohama had a tech session regarding tires. The explained the proper way to set your tire pressures based on temperature. You don't have to have a expensive pyrometer either to get pretty close. Just one of those point and shoot infrared laser temperature probes you see will work fine. They were at the LOG autocross and setup between runs to take your tire temps and help adjust your pressures. Based on those results, 24/29 was about right for my tires with the alignment that I currently have. I haven't been back to the track yet though to try them further.

Now granted adjusting tire pressure can also effect the suspension of the car so what is ideal to get the most out of the tire may adversly effect the suspension and negate any gains. This is where adjustable shocks come into play so you can set your tire temps to get the most out of the tire and then change the shocks to get the handling you want. A nice set of adjustables is next on my list.

jim-clayton · 09-09-2007, 09:34 AM

Great video.
Is it possible to list what you were running (rims and tires) and what he recommended?

lancer360 · 09-10-2007, 05:11 AM

I was running the Volk CE28 15x7/16x8 with 225/245 Toyo RA1's.

RichS · 09-28-2007, 02:30 PM

That was cool.

At 5:54 Nick Adams says "We bias our cars to a gentle high speed understeer."

Good to know...

Buz · 09-28-2007, 02:57 PM

It seems even Nick could use a lower rpm cam change on a few of the corners.

Jack · 09-29-2007, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lancer360

I just posted this in another thread, but thought it should have its own thread. This is a discussion I had with Nick Adams at the VIR Lotus Track Day after he took my car for a spin around VIR full course. It has some very good info in it regarding tire sizes and other topics.

Enjoy!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...17955484&hl=en

Nice video.

The other interesting comment had to do with your clutch adjustment and possible syncro issues. I'm guessing you had done the Stan mod to your clutch which reduces the clutch travel. A friend recently experienced grinding during some shifts while on track and discovered it was caused by the clutch travel having been reduced too much. The Stan mod worked great for his street driving but not on track.

Thanks for sharing.

RichS · 10-01-2007, 01:11 PM

For everyone who already runs this setup (RA1s 225/45/15 front and 245/45/16 rear), do you feel that it was mostly the OPs tire pressure that made Nick make these comments or do you feel that 205s would be better for the fronts than the 225s?

I sort of remember that some of you tried 205s and then moved to the 225s with better results, but maybe I'm on crack.

My CE28ns are here (gloss black, and man are they light! I got 9.4 and 12.6 on a scale with only .2 lb accuracy) and I'm about to get the tires. I'm ordering 225s, but this post got me thinking about maybe doing 205s.

ZTEC · 10-01-2007, 01:16 PM

Are there really no RA1 tire options for us in 16x7 and 17x8 rim sizes?

RichS · 10-01-2007, 01:23 PM

Also, what's a good price on the RA1s? Any good places to order them from? I've got a TOYO dealer around the corner from my house, and I'm about to call him and get prices.

RichS · 10-01-2007, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZTEC

Are there really no RA1 tire options for us in 16x7 and 17x8 rim sizes?

Yes, there are no RA1 tire options for us in 16x7 and 17x8 rim sizes.

ZTEC · 10-01-2007, 01:29 PM

Thanks, I am just starting my tire research and it looks like 15/16 inch rim combo is the way to go!

ZJChaser · 10-01-2007, 01:32 PM

I run RA1s 225/245 and have found that I aim for 26F and 28R hot pressures..the car really gets skittish over 30

RichS · 10-01-2007, 02:30 PM

Just got a call back from the TOYO dealer here in town.

$140 for the fronts (225/45 15)
$188 for the rears (245/45 16)

That's without mounting. The rears seem to be a bit more expensive than I thought they would be, but still loads cheaper than the A048s at $209 for the fronts and $252 for the rears.

$656 vs. $922 seems great to me!

Canyon Red Elise · 10-01-2007, 02:58 PM

Just was reading this and had a question, is the only reason to switch from the A048's a matter of price or are the RA1's a better tire?

RichS · 10-01-2007, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canyon Red Elise

Just was reading this and had a question, is the only reason to switch from the A048's a matter of price or are the RA1's a better tire?

The general consensus seems to be that the RA1s are a better tire. They grip just as well if not better, we get extra width on each tire giving even more grip and finally they don't heat cycle out the way the A048s do.

Oh yeah, they are cheaper too.

Canyon Red Elise · 10-01-2007, 04:04 PM

OK. Cool Thank you.

09-07-2007, 01:53 PM	#2 (permalink)
JeffersonRaley www.HillCountryDrives.com Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 826	Thanks for posting, it was interesting to hear Nick's thought processes relative to the tire setup. RA1s like more pressure than it sounds like you were running. Toyo specs them at "high 30s, low 40s for the hot pressure range. Nick's advice on the video corresponds with that. I run mine in the high 30s hot. __________________ Jefferson www.thedriversedge.net www.hillcountrydrives.com

09-07-2007, 02:09 PM	#3 (permalink)
kaz JabStrongFierce Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Downtown LA + SF Posts: 2,422	Yeah like I always say tire pressures are like voodoo...my car gets skittish when the RA1's are high pressure. I like 25.5F 26.5R hot...seems like people are split 50/50 on this. __________________ 2006 Elise : JFG \| Nitrons \| 2bular 8" Single \| Reverie diffuser and misc. carbon bits \| Tripoint Engineering W/A Intercooler \| Ronin supercharger \| DRS EFI and tuning

09-07-2007, 02:16 PM	#4 (permalink)
codymac short angry bloke Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: where the east tapers out and the west begins Posts: 9,278 Images: 19	Awesome - thanks! Especially like seeing mikelr cruise by in the background around 8:10. __________________ torque (tôrk) n. - an excuse for the lack of momentum. - let's bring back CanAm & Group B! - have you hugged your Exige today? I'm currently working on my performance driving merit badge. There's always somebody faster, sometimes it's me.

09-09-2007, 06:06 AM	#5 (permalink)
lancer360 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,216	At LOG 27 Yokohama had a tech session regarding tires. The explained the proper way to set your tire pressures based on temperature. You don't have to have a expensive pyrometer either to get pretty close. Just one of those point and shoot infrared laser temperature probes you see will work fine. They were at the LOG autocross and setup between runs to take your tire temps and help adjust your pressures. Based on those results, 24/29 was about right for my tires with the alignment that I currently have. I haven't been back to the track yet though to try them further. Now granted adjusting tire pressure can also effect the suspension of the car so what is ideal to get the most out of the tire may adversly effect the suspension and negate any gains. This is where adjustable shocks come into play so you can set your tire temps to get the most out of the tire and then change the shocks to get the handling you want. A nice set of adjustables is next on my list. __________________ '05 Lotus Elise Saffron Yellow, Touring, Sport, Stainless Brake Lines, Moroso Oil Pan, RTD Brace KBS Mark 7 Formula 500 with a heart transplant in progress '09 600cc GSX-R Due to hit the track in August '09

09-09-2007, 09:34 AM	#6 (permalink)
jim-clayton Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida Posts: 1,684	Great video. Is it possible to list what you were running (rims and tires) and what he recommended? __________________ 2005 Elise Storm Titanium Last edited by jim-clayton : 09-09-2007 at 09:43 AM.

09-10-2007, 05:11 AM	#7 (permalink)
lancer360 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,216	I was running the Volk CE28 15x7/16x8 with 225/245 Toyo RA1's. __________________ '05 Lotus Elise Saffron Yellow, Touring, Sport, Stainless Brake Lines, Moroso Oil Pan, RTD Brace KBS Mark 7 Formula 500 with a heart transplant in progress '09 600cc GSX-R Due to hit the track in August '09

09-28-2007, 02:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
RichS No, it's only an N/A Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 3,295	That was cool. At 5:54 Nick Adams says "We bias our cars to a gentle high speed understeer." Good to know... __________________ Useful links to vendors removed at Nadeem's request. "Nice avatar by the way, I doubt Colin Chapman would have followed the herd as I have seen many here do. --Nadeem"

09-28-2007, 02:57 PM	#9 (permalink)
Buz Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,923	It seems even Nick could use a lower rpm cam change on a few of the corners.

10-01-2007, 01:11 PM	#11 (permalink)
RichS No, it's only an N/A Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 3,295	For everyone who already runs this setup (RA1s 225/45/15 front and 245/45/16 rear), do you feel that it was mostly the OPs tire pressure that made Nick make these comments or do you feel that 205s would be better for the fronts than the 225s? I sort of remember that some of you tried 205s and then moved to the 225s with better results, but maybe I'm on crack. My CE28ns are here (gloss black, and man are they light! I got 9.4 and 12.6 on a scale with only .2 lb accuracy) and I'm about to get the tires. I'm ordering 225s, but this post got me thinking about maybe doing 205s. __________________ Useful links to vendors removed at Nadeem's request. "Nice avatar by the way, I doubt Colin Chapman would have followed the herd as I have seen many here do. --Nadeem"

10-01-2007, 01:16 PM	#12 (permalink)
ZTEC Third Eye Open Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 1,786 Images: 3	Are there really no RA1 tire options for us in 16x7 and 17x8 rim sizes? __________________ GO: Vision Function Stage II Intercooled Bliss with Charlie's ECU magic and Ronin's Tenacity! STOP: DBA 4000's, Porterfield R4! TURN: Nitron S/A's Toyo RA1's 225/245 on Rota's! Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is not putting it into a fruit salad.

10-01-2007, 01:23 PM	#13 (permalink)
RichS No, it's only an N/A Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 3,295	Also, what's a good price on the RA1s? Any good places to order them from? I've got a TOYO dealer around the corner from my house, and I'm about to call him and get prices. __________________ Useful links to vendors removed at Nadeem's request. "Nice avatar by the way, I doubt Colin Chapman would have followed the herd as I have seen many here do. --Nadeem"

10-01-2007, 01:29 PM	#15 (permalink)
ZTEC Third Eye Open Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 1,786 Images: 3	Thanks, I am just starting my tire research and it looks like 15/16 inch rim combo is the way to go! __________________ GO: Vision Function Stage II Intercooled Bliss with Charlie's ECU magic and Ronin's Tenacity! STOP: DBA 4000's, Porterfield R4! TURN: Nitron S/A's Toyo RA1's 225/245 on Rota's! Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is not putting it into a fruit salad.

10-01-2007, 01:32 PM	#16 (permalink)
ZJChaser Blue Wheel Pimp Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Laguna Hills, CA Posts: 2,885	I run RA1s 225/245 and have found that I aim for 26F and 28R hot pressures..the car really gets skittish over 30 __________________ AJ - Akua Solutions - #128 Lotus Exige - JRZ Suspension - Innovative Mounts - Toyo Tires - TW Research Development

10-01-2007, 02:30 PM	#17 (permalink)
RichS No, it's only an N/A Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 3,295	Just got a call back from the TOYO dealer here in town. $140 for the fronts (225/45 15) $188 for the rears (245/45 16) That's without mounting. The rears seem to be a bit more expensive than I thought they would be, but still loads cheaper than the A048s at $209 for the fronts and $252 for the rears. $656 vs. $922 seems great to me! __________________ Useful links to vendors removed at Nadeem's request. "Nice avatar by the way, I doubt Colin Chapman would have followed the herd as I have seen many here do. --Nadeem"

10-01-2007, 02:58 PM	#18 (permalink)
Canyon Red Elise Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 524	Just was reading this and had a question, is the only reason to switch from the A048's a matter of price or are the RA1's a better tire?

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10-01-2007, 04:04 PM	#20 (permalink)
Canyon Red Elise Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 524	OK. Cool Thank you.