Do Supercar Owners Have More Fun?? - Page 2 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #21 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 07:46 AM
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Bobsy Racer. Thanks for your post. That is great info on the 570.

Also, I love both of those orange cars!
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post #22 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by chiarov View Post
Great writeup on the 570S/Evora and awesome pictures. I'm sure you don't get any attention in either of those.

Curious about your take on the modern Porsche's if you've owned or driven any of them. I have been considering a 991 S as a daily driver to compliment my Elise/Exige (have both at the moment, but will likely only keep one.) I don't expect it to be anything like my Lotus, but as Porsches have gotten bigger have they lost their magic?
I have not driven any of the late water cooled Street Porsches.
I did drive a friend's Cayman GT4 Clubsport Factory Race Car at the Road America Races, and it was WONDERFUL. It is so easy to drive, and the brakes and dual clutch shifting are terrific.
Several of my friends have GT3's, GT3RS's, and a GT3 4.0, but they do not interest me.
Like many old Porsche enthusiasts, I think that the air cooled 993's are the last of the great Porsches. If I were to have another Porsche street car, it would be a 993.
When I decided to sell my early 911, along with my Porsche 928 GT, a rare Factory lightweight car with aluminum panels, big turbo brakes, high HP engine, and stiff suspension, I made up my mind I would only buy an unusual car, not frequently seen. It had to be a car with outstanding handling, great brakes, a good canyon carver, all while being civilized to drive.
The Evora met my criteria. I thought about a Nobel, Maserati Bora, Bizzarini Strada, and other vintage cars, but modern cars are so much more fun to drive, comfortable, and reliable that I decided to go with a new car. I only wish that I had not been misled about "Buy the NA Now, and you can upgrade it to an S next year, with the Factory Kit".
The 570S also meets my criteria, but just a a higher performance and price point.
For now, I'm keeping both my Evora and 570S.
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post #23 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
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You have convinced me to test drive a 570S.
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05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

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post #24 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by PDR447 View Post
I think it really comes down to how much the car is worth relative to your income/available cash.
I mostly agree with this, but I also think that the 'fun' of a car is really hard to define. There are a lot of factors that appeal to a lot of different kinds of people.

I work on exotic cars for a living, and have driven many different ones, from Ferrari 308,599,275, etc to DeTomaso, Lamborghini, ISO, Bizzarrini, Ford GT, etc.

Some cars are really magic to drive, others are terrible, and it is often hard to tell which one it will be until you actually get in and drive it. Between the look and sound of the car, throttle response, steering feel, suspension dynamics, transmission feel, interior quality and comfort, there are a huge number of factors. Then there is also what you are using a car for.

I used to have a junk miata that was my beater car. I had a huge amount of fun in that car, because I drove it at 110% all the time and didn't care if got scratched.
I have a customer that is a little more affluent than me, and has a similar relationship with a Ferrari 308.
My Elise is fun because of the speed and handling, the looks, and because it represents a kind of purity that is missing from most modern cars.
On the other hand, my FC race car is way faster than the Lotus, and more fun when actually racing, but there is an additional stress level there from lower reliability and more pressure to win that cuts into the fun factor somewhat.

A couple of my favorite customer cars that I have driven are a Ferrari Dino, which just drives really nice and had that history and beauty, and a Lamborghini 400GT, because it is a classic, fast V12 car, but still has 4 usable seats, and reserved looks and luxury compared to many sports cars. A more modern example is a Ferrari 599GTB, which is similar to the 400GT, just newer and faster, but also more complex and less rare.

I was super excited to drive a customer's Panoz Esperante once, and found it didn't have the magic for me, the carbon shell is kind of 'boomy' and flexy, and even though the car drives, looks, and handles great, it just didn't give me the feel that I was looking for.

Anyway, I'm not sure if I am explaining this well, other than to say that 'fun' isn't so simple, and based on my experience, doesn't have a super direct relationship with how fast or expensive a car is, but more how you use it and what it means to you.
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post #25 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 11:50 AM Thread Starter
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Nicely done, Pat. Thanks.

05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

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post #26 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 12:25 PM
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You have convinced me to test drive a 570S.
I went to Vegas to do just that. Royalty Exotic has the 570s, as well as the 650 and 720 now. $500 for 4 hours in the 570 was more than reasonable -and all one needed.

The 570 is stupidly fast, but there is definitive turbo lag. You will never forget that first on ramp! Sounds like a vacuum cleaner though. Oddly enough, the brakes were my favorite part of the car, just immense stopping power. In that price range, I prefer the 458 more overall. It feels more "alive" to me, more tactile, and it makes a much more agreeable noise.

All said and done, after turning it in I told my GF that I'd rather drive my Elise than the 570s. Still a fantastic car though.
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post #27 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 02:14 PM
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To many (most?) supercar owners, I believe it is a status symbol. You cannot let your wealthy friend out-do you with his new Porsche GT, you need to get the 918. I'm not knocking them for this, if you have the money to play that game then more power to you, but this has been my observation with the wealthy friends of mine. They most definitely have fun with their supercars. Besides the drives and shows, they often have lunch together, go on trips together, etc. I think money and fun go hand and hand, the supercars are just a bonus.

There are however always going to be a few snobs who wouldn't even SIT in an Elise as it's just too below them. I've literally heard someone get called a "peasant" by one of these guys because of the car they drove. These guys are miserable SOBs. It's quite obvious no amount of money nor car will make them happy.
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post #28 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 02:19 PM Thread Starter
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That Elise thing is a big question, isn't it?

I doubt we're likely to find more fun on the road, on 4 wheels.

BTW, I think I changed my mind on driving the 570S: I really want a stick shift car.

I sort of eliminated the Evora; didn't want a 2nd mid-engine car. (I do the servicing & repair work)

But, 570S is mid, and an automatic. So, Evora might be in mix. I do really like the new Mustang (gasp) for a GT type car.

05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

Driving Tips-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...art-1-a-49665/
Moss Emergency Line-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...cy-line-36631/
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post #29 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 02:49 PM
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Comparing an S1 to a 570s, I don't even understand. Compare it to a 488 then I understand.
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post #30 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by pwildfire View Post
I mostly agree with this, but I also think that the 'fun' of a car is really hard to define. There are a lot of factors that appeal to a lot of different kinds of people.
Well stated!
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post #31 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 06:45 PM
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Comparing an S1 to a 570s, I don't even understand. Compare it to a 488 then I understand.
570S is +/-- $200K ; 488 is +/-- $300K.
Big difference in cost and performance.
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post #32 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-12-2018, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by LiveToDrive View Post
To many (most?) supercar owners, I believe it is a status symbol. You cannot let your wealthy friend out-do you with his new Porsche GT, you need to get the 918. I'm not knocking them for this, if you have the money to play that game then more power to you, but this has been my observation with the wealthy friends of mine. They most definitely have fun with their supercars. Besides the drives and shows, they often have lunch together, go on trips together, etc. I think money and fun go hand and hand, the supercars are just a bonus.

There are however always going to be a few snobs who wouldn't even SIT in an Elise as it's just too below them. I've literally heard someone get called a "peasant" by one of these guys because of the car they drove. These guys are miserable SOBs. It's quite obvious no amount of money nor car will make them happy.
I agree that many Super Car owners are jerks.
I certainly don't feel elitist by owning it; Quite the opposite, I'm a little embarrassed.
I bought it purely for the driving experience.
For racing and track thrills, I have my Bobsy-Porsche, which is faster, so no need to prove anything.
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post #33 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-18-2018, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by glb View Post
That Elise thing is a big question, isn't it?

I doubt we're likely to find more fun on the road, on 4 wheels.

BTW, I think I changed my mind on driving the 570S: I really want a stick shift car.

I sort of eliminated the Evora; didn't want a 2nd mid-engine car. (I do the servicing & repair work)

But, 570S is mid, and an automatic. So, Evora might be in mix. I do really like the new Mustang (gasp) for a GT type car.
Have you driven a Ferrari 456M? Front engine V12, 6 speed, nice cars, and very reasonable right now pricewise. Not cheap to work on, but not terrible now with internet parts suppliers, and pretty reliable. Not sure if you are interested in used cars but thought I would throw that out there anyway...

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post #34 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-18-2018, 10:46 AM
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Perspective is everything. Back when I had one of the few Pontiac Solstice Coupes (1100 made), I frequented the most popular Solstice forum. Those guys would swear that their cars met the criteria for exotic, with threads hundreds of entries long defending that position. They were somewhat interesting cars in their own way...but they were virtual parts bin cars.

And of course we've seen similar, earnest positions here over the years. As big of a Lotus fan as I've been for decades, the 'Elise is exotic' argument fades when you park it next to almost any Ferrari, Lambo, Ford GT, McLaren, etc.. At least IMHO.

On up the food chain...I had my Exige at a cars/coffee in Annapolis a few years ago. A woman was parked next to me with a Ferrari Modena. She said she used to have an Elise, she felt it was a cute little car and she used it as an around town driver. Saying it was only a Lotus, so it was no big deal if it got scratched or hit...unlike her Ferrari.

Car folks tend to buy the car they can afford, and have fun with it. It's all good.

Owned, loved, enjoyed, and now gone:
1969 Europa S2 Blue
1970 Europa S2 White
1974 Europa Twin Cam Blue
1974 Europa Twin Cam Blue
1984 Turbo Esprit Calypso Red
2005 Elise Starlight Black
2005 Elise Saffron Yellow
2005 Elise Ardent Red
2006 Exige Graphite Grey
2007 Exige Canyon Red

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1970 Datsun 510
1984 Honda CRX Si
1984 Pontiac Fiero
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post #35 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-18-2018, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Bobsy Racer View Post
For now, I'm keeping both my Evora and 570S.
take good care of the 570s until you sell it to me

congrats - its epic!

"I really started paying attention to cars was when they came out with the Nissan Z, the first body. Then I seen the Cherokees, the old square ones, and I was like, “Wow, that’s cool.” Then I seen the Isuzu jeeps and I seen the Wranglers."
-Lotus Cars VP of Global Design
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post #36 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-19-2018, 03:41 PM Thread Starter
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And then, there's this: (funny)



05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

Driving Tips-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...art-1-a-49665/
Moss Emergency Line-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...cy-line-36631/
Bleeding Brakes- https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...-brakes-241138
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post #37 of 37 (permalink) Old 02-03-2018, 07:58 AM
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I tend to agree with some of the people how it is all relative to your earnings. I have had a ton of fun in sub $4000 beaters driving them 10/10 like race cars and not caring about them. Obviously if my budget allowed me to not care about a 300k vehicle i am sure i would have a blast in that as well.
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