New Corvette: 495hp mid-engine, Under $60k - Page 4 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #61 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 07:32 AM
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The looks are fine, its not like the 720 or 488 are lookers themselvs.
To me the issue is weight and stiffness. The last great vette imo was the C6 z06, at 3150 with a real hipo na motor it looked like the vette team was serious. Then on the C7 they got lazy and put in lots of cheap supercharged to overcome the bloat. in the end they had to make the Gs just to have a car that could live on track.

Now the C8 is heavier still. Its like last decades supercar, the aventador, heavy powerful exotic, whereas the future is loosing weight.
Also as many others have said, vettes despite their paper numbers drive like Gt car's, not suprising given the lack of tub stiffness and the customer demographic. I mean no one accuses the vette of being a precision tool, despite their capability. So will this one steer with precision of aeuro car, what will the steering feel like.

So now we have yet a heavier vette, that ccording the chevy is 10% stiffer than the last noodle. So its a vette, just this time the engine is in the middle, but its still a vette with all the good and bad that implies.

Im intereted to see if they make a lighetr more driver focussed one, like porche is able to stretch the bandwith from a 3600lbs turbo to a 3200lbs Gt3.

can the vette team make this car 300lbs lighter at 100k, do they even care. Or are we just going to see the super vette with a 1000hp hybrid setup as wow factor but ultimately a useless dead end like the NSX.

Hopefully the vette team is takign a page out of the porche playbook and offering everyhting from base cars to huge pwer cars to GT3 track type cars off one platform. Yeah Gt3s dont sell in huge numbers, but that is the car porche hangs it s hat on, it give the 911 range credibility and that 911 credibility is how they sell all thgose rebadgesd audi suv's.

Can the C8 be really made to dance on track and still be road legal, thats the formula for me. Given how much lighter the light evora's are now, Im guessing for 30k vette can loose 3000lbs, theres probably 70lbs to loose in thsoe electric seats alone.


The Evora is dead, it should have started with the 400. By now its just outclassed by porche and even chevy, nice as it is there is no no usp.
That car should never have been a quasi 2+2, it should have been shorter lower and lighter.
Can't say I disagree with much above. One common misconception about Porsche is that the GT cars are rare, actually they are not. They are over 1/3 of total car production, though SUVs are vast majority now. I think with aluminum Tub there is a limit to the light-weighting that GM can do. I could see a limited run "GT3" car with CF Hood, Roof, Light weight manual seats, wheels, and Carbon Ceramic brakes which are sure to show up in the Z06. All of that is maybe 120lbs. Maybe there are other things, I don't know. I would LOVE to see a flatplane NA revver in this car as a Z06. Even if it has less power than the C7Z, who cares. If they could make a 6.2L with 550-600 NA HP and 9k redline and take out 100lbs, sign me up!

For as much as I LOVE the 991.2 GT3, you can't escape the feel of that weight behind the rear axle. They've done alot to get around it, but it is still there and still noticeable at the limit.
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post #62 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 07:35 AM
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Can't say I disagree with much above. One common misconception about Porsche is that the GT cars are rare, actually they are not. They are over 1/3 of total car production, though SUVs are vast majority now.
You beat me to it. Anyone who goes to a PCA track day knows that there are an amazing number of GT3s and RSs present. There's nothing rare about a GT3.
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post #63 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 08:17 AM
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Porsche is a borderline exotic brand at best, and more like a high range European sports car brand akin to BMW or Audi, who have sporting lineage the same way.

The only difference is Porsche kept the 911 and is still clinging to that as their main stay identity even though they're selling way more sedans and SUV and crossover than sports cars. In that way, they're no different than BMW or Audi whose main business is sedans, SUV, and crossover, with a halo car like the R8 and i8, and minor sports cars like the Z4 and TT to compete with the 718.

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post #64 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 08:22 AM
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Porsche is a borderline exotic brand at best, and more like a high range European sports car brand akin to BMW or Audi, who have sporting lineage the same way.

The only difference is Porsche kept the 911 and is still clinging to that as their main stay identity even though they're selling way more sedans and SUV and crossover than sports cars. In that way, they're no different than BMW or Audi whose main business is sedans, SUV, and crossover, with a halo car like the R8 and i8, and minor sports cars like the Z4 and TT to compete with the 718.
Corvettes are a rung down from there. That's their market position and the C8 doesn't change that.
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post #65 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 08:23 AM
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The Gt porche dont have to be rare, just good. The Rarity, is to me artificial limitations which are a PITA if you want to buy one and a pity.

People who spend more than a few days on track figure out what works and what does not. Porche consistently makes cars that work on track, as does lotus. Certainly the tracks I go to we lots of e36's arriving on trailers(now some e46's tracked out), miata, porches on trailer and driving in, some vettes(occasionaly one on a trailer), and a disproportionate number of lotus(compared to production). Beyond that ocasionaly a camaro or R8, but theyre not really players being too heavy or not durable(R8).

Between Gt3 and caymans porche has it down for the out the box road car to track segment, imo no one does it better yet, well the elige was better but its not in prod for USA..

Many other cars are really just fast road cars posing as being trackable, I hope the vette comes out with a real "trackday" car, the last z28 was close(except for weight and that was a yuge issue), it had lots of the right bits and attention to detail, so it can be done by chevy.

Since nascar is all plastic, and most race cars relation to track cars tenuous its not win on sunday sell on monday, we now have another category. Joust best on track, and people take notice and buy your car, ( that also gives all your other similar looking luxury Gts cred), the Gt3 in nutshell. Lets see a vette competitor..
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post #66 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 08:32 AM
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Exactly. That's what the Corvette has always been about. The C8 just looks more like an exotic in part due to the mid engine layout whereas the other Corvettes were good looking but stayed with traditional American looks that are allowed by the traditional front engine layout.

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Porsche is a borderline exotic brand at best, and more like a high range European sports car brand akin to BMW or Audi, who have sporting lineage the same way.

The only difference is Porsche kept the 911 and is still clinging to that as their main stay identity even though they're selling way more sedans and SUV and crossover than sports cars. In that way, they're no different than BMW or Audi whose main business is sedans, SUV, and crossover, with a halo car like the R8 and i8, and minor sports cars like the Z4 and TT to compete with the 718.
Corvettes are a rung down from there. That's their market position and the C8 doesn't change that.

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post #67 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 08:36 AM
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Unfortunately selling just to track junkies won't sustain your car business.

Rarity is artificial, because market demand is artificial, as in there's no "natural" order of things for human demand of a luxury product. They will make enough to satisfy demand but not more that will just sit in showrooms rotting away because there aren't enough people to buy it.

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The Gt porche dont have to be rare, just good. The Rarity, is to me artificial limitations which are a PITA if you want to buy one and a pity.

People who spend more than a few days on track figure out what works and what does not. Porche consistently makes cars that work on track, as does lotus. Certainly the tracks I go to we lots of e36's arriving on trailers(now some e46's tracked out), miata, porches on trailer and driving in, some vettes(occasionaly one on a trailer), and a disproportionate number of lotus(compared to production). Beyond that ocasionaly a camaro or R8, but theyre not really players being too heavy or not durable(R8).

Between Gt3 and caymans porche has it down for the out the box road car to track segment, imo no one does it better yet, well the elige was better but its not in prod for USA..

Many other cars are really just fast road cars posing as being trackable, I hope the vette comes out with a real "trackday" car, the last z28 was close(except for weight and that was a yuge issue), it had lots of the right bits and attention to detail, so it can be done by chevy.

Since nascar is all plastic, and most race cars relation to track cars tenuous its not win on sunday sell on monday, we now have another category. Joust best on track, and people take notice and buy your car, ( that also gives all your other similar looking luxury Gts cred), the Gt3 in nutshell. Lets see a vette competitor..

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post #68 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 09:21 AM
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Unfortunately selling just to track junkies won't sustain your car business.

Rarity is artificial, because market demand is artificial, as in there's no "natural" order of things for human demand of a luxury product. They will make enough to satisfy demand but not more that will just sit in showrooms rotting away because there aren't enough people to buy it.
Its not a binary choice between either a trackday car and a bloaty luxury GT.

The beauty of porche is how far they stretch one platform, from the heavy luxury turbo to the relatively light and lively Gt3 and evrything in between, thats what make 911 sales sustainable and workable.

In the 2ks track junkies is what gives your sportscar cred, you dont need to sell more than 1-2k per year.
I think ford has been doing just fine with the mustang Gt350. Its a solid market.

BMW brand was built off the 2002, they were drivers cArs and it caught on with everyone else as "better". Since then they spent decades blanding their prodcut and its become just another lease car, one misstep away from nothing. Same thing happened at honda who were about to be lost in sea of korean and chinese mee too sedans. Now honda is getting some mojo back and sees both a buisness and marketing case for the civic type R.
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post #69 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 09:24 AM Thread Starter
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$10K? Try $25K over MSRP. I couldn't believe it. I was going to buy a Type R for my son, but I told him there was no way it was worth $60K. I got him an STI Limited and he's been more than happy with it.
Yeah that's no surprise. I think what's really remarkable is the fact that it has maintained that level of markup, even most of the way into a typical car's model run when it's due for a refresh.

Also; Lucky kid. My parents never bought me a car.

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Guess I was wrong about dealer greed and the $10-15k markup... I under estimated them by quite a bit.
Honest question: given that markups have been the situation for highly desirable new cars for which there is limited supply, why so much condemnation for the dealers? It's just market economics at work, and prices are almsot certainly going to drop below MSRP in 18 months. Is being the first on the proverbial block (for what will surely become a common sports car) really that important?

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Now the C8 is heavier still. Its like last decades supercar, the aventador, heavy powerful exotic, whereas the future is loosing weight.
Also as many others have said, vettes despite their paper numbers drive like Gt car's, not suprising given the lack of tub stiffness and the customer demographic. I mean no one accuses the vette of being a precision tool, despite their capability. So will this one steer with precision of aeuro car, what will the steering feel like.

...

Im guessing for 30k vette can loose 3000lbs, theres probably 70lbs to loose in thsoe electric seats alone.
#1: is lighter weight really the future? Rational or not, huge fractions of the American carbuying public are moving into increasingly heavier, larger, and less efficient SUVs and trucks and seem wholly accepting of the consequent performance penalties. I'd argue that light weight and agility don't seem to hold tons of mindshare in the market these days, where the dominant themes appear to be intimidation (often thinly veiled as "capability") and imposition, weight be damned.

#2: I feel like losing 3000 lbs on a 3500lb car is a bit of a reach. You can probably easily lose 1000lbs for the (low, low) cost of a Sawzall though.

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post #70 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 11:13 AM
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Honest question: given that markups have been the situation for highly desirable new cars for which there is limited supply, why so much condemnation for the dealers? It's just market economics at work, and prices are almsot certainly going to drop below MSRP in 18 months. Is being the first on the proverbial block (for what will surely become a common sports car) really that important?



#1: is lighter weight really the future? Rational or not, huge fractions of the American carbuying public are moving into increasingly heavier, larger, and less efficient SUVs and trucks and seem wholly accepting of the consequent performance penalties. I'd argue that light weight and agility don't seem to hold tons of mindshare in the market these days, where the dominant themes appear to be intimidation (often thinly veiled as "capability") and imposition, weight be damned.

#2: I feel like losing 3000 lbs on a 3500lb car is a bit of a reach. You can probably easily lose 1000lbs for the (low, low) cost of a Sawzall though.
If there are big markups it just tells me the manufactuerer has missed an opportunity. Funny how the markups are always on "performance" cars but supposedly no one buys performance cars anymore.

Yeah 3000lbs weight loss, lol. I was being reasonable in only asking for 300lbs weight loss, but seriously an all new vette should have a 3000lbs version if the C6 z06 was 3150, wheres the real progress in weight gain?.

Lighter weight which is not quite light weight but lighter weight is the future as we see at Mclaren and ferrari, seems like 3000lbs wet is the practical number. As we know performance cannot just be a measure of 0-60 or one lap, although these metrics do sell cars in magazine "tests". Theres a reason why a veyron with all its pwer sucks on track, cool on road though.

Some percentage of a manufactuers sports cars go to the track, and some very high percentage of sports cars sell because people percieve them to be track capable. GT3 track capability imbues the rest of the 992 line with cred and by extension all porche products.

I see plenty of trackdays where there are 4 or 5 vettes about, woudnt it be taken more seriosuly if they really perfomed all day. Course you hardley find serious track people running vettes, if its not a miata then its a e36 BMW, lotus or porche.

All I ask for is a vette version of a Gt3, not some overpowered road monster.
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post #71 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 11:27 AM
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I feel like the C8 Corvette is what the "new NSX" should have been...a everyman's, reliable, attainable, mid-engine exotic.

I was supremely disappointed when the new NSX came out with 17 motors, 3 different powertrains (I think there's a Japanese Gerbil in there, along with the gas engine, and the electric drivetrain)...for an absolutely STUPID amount of money.

*If* (and that's a big "if") GM has really done what they've claimed they've done, it's gonna be a game-changer for the sports car market - not just the "mid-engine'd sports car market".
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post #72 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 11:34 AM
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Nice thread.
Some things come to mind after reading through it...
The fact that the corvette is a performance bargain is nothing new. It always has been. In 2006 the zo6 was pretty untouchable performance wise with anything less than double its price. (Not literally but close enough)
The new car is very appealing, you cant argue the performance aspect. I think it looks very good, not in love with the back end, but....I guess only other drivers will ever see it.

Would I buy one?
Maybe.
Im not all about the all out performance at this point. Im more of a Viper guy anyway. Plus the track guys won't want the base model, z51 or no z51. The drivers car will be the other models they come out with, GS, Z06, etc....The guys who buy the base corvettes are usually just people who want a corvette, the drivers buy the upscale versions.

I had a c6 z06 and I loved the car but it is watered down so to speak as far as most of the sport/performance cars I have owned. Meaning it makes a lot of concessions to being a great street car as well as performance car.
The Vipers, Elises, Nobles, GT40s, etc are more purposefully built towards the sport end of things. They have feel and they don't make many compromises to the daily driver aspect.
Is that good or bad? Depends on what you want.

That said, people have often asked me of all the cars Ive owned which one is the "best?"
We all know that is too vague of a question but Ill say this....The z06 was the best "all around" sports car or performance car Ive owned. It was certainly fast enough, it handled well enough, stopped great, was able to haul stuff in it, comfortable, capable....Thats defines corvette.
Not sure we are all want the "best" car, whatever that means anyway.
For me, i don't care how much stuff i can bring with me. I drove my Elise from Chi to Vegas and back and loved every second. I travel light.

So for me, the new vette would have to "feel" more sporty. I like the steering weighted a certain way, I like the steering to feel a certain way, I want the pedals to feel just right, the sound, etc, etc, etc....

That said i believe the people who want an Evora will still want an Evora and the people who want a vette will still want a vette.
(I think Lotus compromised a little too much to practicality with the Evora but that's a different discussion)
The base model vette for sure won't "feel" much different to drive than the previous vettes. The dynamics will be different for sure, but I think the "feel" will be about the same. Maybe its smart on GM's end. Maybe I'm wrong, we shall see.

In the next year I was going to purchase either a 2013 or so Cayman, Boxster, or an Alfa 4c. Obviously Im not looking at the fastest car for my next purchase, but Im thinking I should at least get a test drive with Chevys new boy wonder.

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post #73 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 12:22 PM
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Rarity is artificial, because market demand is artificial, as in there's no "natural" order of things for human demand of a luxury product. They will make enough to satisfy demand but not more that will just sit in showrooms rotting away because there aren't enough people to buy it.
Just like the 2017 Lotus Evora 400.
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post #74 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 01:08 PM
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Nice thread.
Some things come to mind after reading through it...
The fact that the corvette is a performance bargain is nothing new. It always has been. In 2006 the zo6 was pretty untouchable performance wise with anything less than double its price. (Not literally but close enough)
The new car is very appealing, you cant argue the performance aspect. I think it looks very good, not in love with the back end, but....I guess only other drivers will ever see it.

Would I buy one?
Maybe.
Im not all about the all out performance at this point. Im more of a Viper guy anyway. Plus the track guys won't want the base model, z51 or no z51. The drivers car will be the other models they come out with, GS, Z06, etc....The guys who buy the base corvettes are usually just people who want a corvette, the drivers buy the upscale versions.

I had a c6 z06 and I loved the car but it is watered down so to speak as far as most of the sport/performance cars I have owned. Meaning it makes a lot of concessions to being a great street car as well as performance car.
The Vipers, Elises, Nobles, GT40s, etc are more purposefully built towards the sport end of things. They have feel and they don't make many compromises to the daily driver aspect.
Is that good or bad? Depends on what you want.

That said, people have often asked me of all the cars Ive owned which one is the "best?"
We all know that is too vague of a question but Ill say this....The z06 was the best "all around" sports car or performance car Ive owned. It was certainly fast enough, it handled well enough, stopped great, was able to haul stuff in it, comfortable, capable....Thats defines corvette.
Not sure we are all want the "best" car, whatever that means anyway.
For me, i don't care how much stuff i can bring with me. I drove my Elise from Chi to Vegas and back and loved every second. I travel light.

So for me, the new vette would have to "feel" more sporty. I like the steering weighted a certain way, I like the steering to feel a certain way, I want the pedals to feel just right, the sound, etc, etc, etc....

That said i believe the people who want an Evora will still want an Evora and the people who want a vette will still want a vette.
(I think Lotus compromised a little too much to practicality with the Evora but that's a different discussion)
The base model vette for sure won't "feel" much different to drive than the previous vettes. The dynamics will be different for sure, but I think the "feel" will be about the same. Maybe its smart on GM's end. Maybe I'm wrong, we shall see.

In the next year I was going to purchase either a 2013 or so Cayman, Boxster, or an Alfa 4c. Obviously Im not looking at the fastest car for my next purchase, but Im thinking I should at least get a test drive with Chevys new boy wonder.
Good Post, well-stated. I have found over the years after owning a Lotus, then creating the XP Frankenlotus, that street cars largely are unimpressive to me compared to a race car. I can't see a world where I wouldn't have a Lotus because the purity of the driving experience in a roadcar is unmatched. That said, having crossed the country both ways in an Elise, I really don't ever want to do it again! A compromise car that has a wide performance comfort envelope has its place too, it just won't be the first set of keys I reach for when heading for the mountain roads for a brief drive. If the drive is 5 hour trip away for the weekend and some touring, other things might fit the bill better. The C8 won't have the pure performance of some aspects of the Evora i.e. weight and most likely steering feel, but it will deliver much of it and more power, luggage space etc. etc. The C8 will absolutely NOT be special, but it isn't designed to be..... Tadge Juechter said it best: "Corvette has to be beautiful, functional, and attainable. And it has to fit into our customer's lives as naturally and completely as our front engine cars do"

For Chevy to make the business work they have to get the unit sales up much higher levels than Lotus or other niche cars. The do this buy making it appeal the widest audience which means performance and liveability at an attainable price. For that very reason it won't be as special as a Lotus.


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post #75 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 01:22 PM
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Good Post, well-stated. I have found over the years after owning a Lotus, then creating the XP Frankenlotus, that street cars largely are unimpressive to me compared to a race car. I can't see a world where I wouldn't have a Lotus because the purity of the driving experience in a roadcar is unmatched. That said, having crossed the country both ways in an Elise, I really don't ever want to do it again! A compromise car that has a wide performance comfort envelope has its place too, it just won't be the first set of keys I reach for when heading for the mountain roads for a brief drive. If the drive is 5 hour trip away for the weekend and some touring, other things might fit the bill better. The C8 won't have the pure performance of some aspects of the Evora i.e. weight and most likely steering feel, but it will deliver much of it and more power, luggage space etc. etc. The C8 will absolutely NOT be special, but it isn't designed to be..... Tadge Juechter said it best: "Corvette has to be beautiful, functional, and attainable. And it has to fit into our customer's lives as naturally and completely as our front engine cars do"

For Chevy to make the business work they have to get the unit sales up much higher levels than Lotus or other niche cars. The do this buy making it appeal the widest audience which means performance and liveability at an attainable price. For that very reason it won't be as special as a Lotus.
Agreed.
People often ask me what car they should buy and I always ask them what they want to do with it.
Most of them aren't really "car guys" like us and they don't really get that question.
We do.
If you're going to daily drive your sportscar, the C8 might be the perfect car for you.
I don't daily them, so i can go with something more special, unique, focused.
That said, a great car is a great car.
I want to see how it feels, I want to see some of the other models, and Im very interested in the convertible coming out a year later.

Im thinking a nice 2013 Boxster S with a manual for less money might work for me.
(yes, i know, not as pure or direct as a lotus or even a 4C but im not shall we say "proportioned" as well as I once was and I find those cars a little tight.)
LOL

If the 4C was a manual Id own it already.
I love the Cayman/Boxster...Good balance between street and feel. Pricey for what you get though and even those are getting to refined for me.
I really like the Evora 400 but a little pricey for me. Ill take another look in a year.

When the C6 came out, esp the z06, i felt it moved the envelope not only for corvettes but the rest of the industry.
I know the C8 will do that to, whether i like the car or not.

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post #76 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 01:37 PM Thread Starter
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If there are big markups it just tells me the manufactuerer has missed an opportunity. Funny how the markups are always on "performance" cars but supposedly no one buys performance cars anymore.

Yeah 3000lbs weight loss, lol. I was being reasonable in only asking for 300lbs weight loss, but seriously an all new vette should have a 3000lbs version if the C6 z06 was 3150, wheres the real progress in weight gain?.

Lighter weight which is not quite light weight but lighter weight is the future as we see at Mclaren and ferrari, seems like 3000lbs wet is the practical number. As we know performance cannot just be a measure of 0-60 or one lap, although these metrics do sell cars in magazine "tests". Theres a reason why a veyron with all its pwer sucks on track, cool on road though.

Some percentage of a manufactuers sports cars go to the track, and some very high percentage of sports cars sell because people percieve them to be track capable. GT3 track capability imbues the rest of the 992 line with cred and by extension all porche products.

I see plenty of trackdays where there are 4 or 5 vettes about, woudnt it be taken more seriosuly if they really perfomed all day. Course you hardley find serious track people running vettes, if its not a miata then its a e36 BMW, lotus or porche.

All I ask for is a vette version of a Gt3, not some overpowered road monster.
I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at when you say the markups are an example of the manufacturers missing an opportunity. Do you mean the opportunity to sell a high-spec car at a much higher price? Or do you mean they priced the car too low?

I feel like I should push back on your assertion that you only ever see markups on performance cars. I would argue that your perception is perhaps misled by the fact that performance cars are often halo vehicles that 1. get lots of press (and therefore sales attention) and 2. aren't often built in mass market quantities. As a result, very-early cars are going to have very high price adjustments attached to them (due to businesses optimizing profits under supply and demand) because enough people with money are willing to pay to be the proverbial first kid on the block, and you're much more likely to hear about it because of the existing hype.

Then I'd add a prime counter-example: when it debuted, the PT Cruiser (now widely panned on the internet as being a truly terrible car) saw similar dealer markups (percentage-wise) as you're likely to see with the C8 (on average, sure there's going to be dealers trying to sell their very first unit for like $200k) - it wasn't unheard of to find out someone paid $5k over MSRP to get one. I'm also under the impression that the latest-generation Lincoln Navigator land whale also had dealer markups because of limited supply. The Prowler also saw pretty big markups, despite not being nearly as fast as its (very arguable) good looks might suggest.

I couldn't agree with you more that the great majority of sports cars are sold based on the promise of performance even though their owners may never approach those limits. I'd add the argument that some sports cars (especially the exotic variety) are Veblen goods - their desirability is (in part) due to their high price. The Veyron you mentioned is a prime example.

Regarding the small number of Vettes at trackdays; I think thats why the "waxer" sterotype exists.

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post #77 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 01:57 PM
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I like to imagine that there are quite a few car people like me, who have considered a used exotic (Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc.).

I think "Yeah, I could swing the $60K, $70K, $80K asking price for a nice used one."

And then I do the research on the ongoing maintenance costs (especially like a Ferrari 355 or 360). Fugedabout if something breaks, just the price of ownership with the recurring maintenance...and I'm like "Nope, I'm out."

But, a mid-engine exotic...new, with a warranty, with a huge dealership network, with "reasonable" ownership costs...yeah, I'm interested.

I'm not gonna pay a $15K "dealer markup" to be the first guy on my block to own that depreciating asset. But, when the prices have settled, and maybe find a deal on a low mileage CPO example...just maybe.
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post #78 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 02:14 PM
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I like to imagine that there are quite a few car people like me, who have considered a used exotic (Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc.).

I think "Yeah, I could swing the $60K, $70K, $80K asking price for a nice used one."

And then I do the research on the ongoing maintenance costs (especially like a Ferrari 355 or 360). Fugedabout if something breaks, just the price of ownership with the recurring maintenance...and I'm like "Nope, I'm out."

But, a mid-engine exotic...new, with a warranty, with a huge dealership network, with "reasonable" ownership costs...yeah, I'm interested.

I'm not gonna pay a $15K "dealer markup" to be the first guy on my block to own that depreciating asset. But, when the prices have settled, and maybe find a deal on a low mileage CPO example...just maybe.
I've often considered a used exotic and have come to the same conclusion as you, I can swing the purchase price but I don't want to be paying for services let along when something really goes wrong. The new Corvette is tempting but not sure I'll sign up for year one's costs and likely 1st gen issues (yeah it'll have some issues being the fist gen with mid engine). I've been considering a purpose build race car recently but this has me tempted too.
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post #79 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 03:10 PM
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Great thread! I really like the new C8. The fact that it is a targa and can store the top insitu is great. What do I see? Many wrecked C8 Corvettes! now that the engine is moved the current C7 drivers must adapt to the weight differential. I foresee many spins due to the change in physics dynamics. Over a hill lift throttle and gone! I do think that the quality of the GM products are really good. My $.02 Tommy

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post #80 of 163 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 05:12 PM
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