New Porsche 718 Cayman GT4! - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 04:17 AM Thread Starter
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New Porsche 718 Cayman GT4!

I just found out that Porsche is launching a GT4 on the 718 platform, with a flat 6!

Here are the quick specs:
Horsepower: 414
Torque: 309lb-ft.
Weight: 3300lbs

That means the Evora 400 and the 718 GT4 will be very competitive! I can't wait to see how this car is in real life!

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...4-photos-info/
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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 05:01 AM
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I was honestly pretty disappointed with the announced details for this car. They put in the absolute least amount of effort possible to make improvements. It's essentially just a 981.2 GT4. The motor makes the same power as the 991.1 CS released in 2013 despite having 5% more displacement. The 10 second ring time improvement is due mostly to newer tire compound and a number of corners of the track being repaved.

According to AP the weight gain isn't as much as it appears due to changes in how the cars have to be homologated. The actual weight gain is just 30kg if you compare a similarly equipped Cayman GT4 to a 718 GT4. The weight gain is basically due to things like adding start stop (heavier battery and starter), rear back-up camera, cylinder deactivation, and larger brakes.

The engine is all new but it's still just a parts bin car. It's likely this engine will serve as the base of the 992 Turbo and Turbo S cars. They provided an all new engine to the car and then had to gimp the torque curve because they couldn't be bothered to update the transmission which still has gears that are too long and is only rated for 309ft-lbs of torque. If you look at the dyno curve that Porsche provided it is clear they are artificially limiting the torque of the engine. The torque has a perfect plateau at peak torque that never occurs in an uncorked NA engine.

After recycling almost the entire car from the previous generation they then increased the base price by 19%. GTFO Porsche.
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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 05:25 AM Thread Starter
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Is it bad that I'm just happy the Cayman has a six cylinder again?

I wouldn't trade my Evora 400 for a 718, but that four cylinder they have in the other 718s is gawd awful. I had one as a rental and really couldn't stand it.

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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 06:58 AM
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At any rate it’s a great looking car! Plus it’s only available in a 6-speed manual. Bravo!!!
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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 02:58 PM
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I was honestly pretty disappointed with the announced details for this car. ...After recycling almost the entire car from the previous generation they then increased the base price by 19%. GTFO Porsche.
One part of me agrees with you. Homologating a car is expensive and parts bin engineering a necessary evil. Frankly, I'm a fan of that Camry motor in the Evora. It's a very nice solution that delivers dynamically and sonically!

The reality is that Porsche is in the business to make money and this car, delivered with these perceived 'short-comings', will sell out. I'm glad they are offering it. Any NA motor nowadays is a refreshing offering compared to those flatulent turbos...yes, the turbo power is hard to argue with but I'll take a hi revving NA motors or SC any day over a turbo.

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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 08:51 AM
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I like it. If it drives equal to or better than the last GT4 it will be a spectacular drivers car.

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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 11:05 AM
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So 414hp out of 4.0 NA flat 6... I think itís pretty impressive. I wish the Evora could do 400hp without SC.
In any cases Iím sure itís a great car, and probably will hold value better than the 400/410 (or any Lotus for that matter).
Still the Evora is better looking.


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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 04:46 PM
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Fist, I'm going to admit that I have no idea what the pricing is on these is. However, after seeing the 718s at the Chicago Auto show with display prices of like $98k [visualize "seriously?" face here], I'm half-expecting the GT4 to be like $200k.

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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 05:15 PM
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I wonder if they fixed the strut towers
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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 05:23 PM
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It starts at $99,200 + $1,250 delivery fee. I don't think the 718 GT4 is a bad car. I am sure it will objectively be a good car.I just expected more from Porsche.

The engine would be impressive if it came from anyone other than Porsche. They have had NA flat sixes churning out more horse power with less displacement since 2007. Couple that with the fact that they recycled the rest of the car from the previous iteration 4 years ago an it's just a little disappointing.

I know emissions plays a role here but they are also intentionally gimping the car just to keep it in its place. They could have atleast updated the transmission for additional torque and better gearing.
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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 06:57 PM
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Aesthetically the Elise is more appealing, imo. Still, decent specs on the Porsche.
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-19-2019, 07:49 PM
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I got to preview the 718 (along with the new Supra) long before I could talk about it, and the interior was very nice. I like the looks of it, but I never know which model of Porsche I'm looking at when I see them on the road.

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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 12:40 AM
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I played around with a configurator for about a half an hour and came to this conclusion.

I should probably just go look at Radicals...
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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 12:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forkmeupscotty View Post
I played around with a configurator for about a half an hour and came to this conclusion.

I should probably just go look at Radicals...
Come on, tell us how much the version you configured was going to cost, or how much the Radicals you'd consider cost.

Edit: I played with the configurator and didn't get a price. I'm guessing if you have to ask....

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Last edited by oldmansan; 06-20-2019 at 01:17 AM. Reason: Done playing with the configurator
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 02:22 AM
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Come on, tell us how much the version you configured was going to cost, or how much the Radicals you'd consider cost.

Edit: I played with the configurator and didn't get a price. I'm guessing if you have to ask....

San
The price is on the top right corner.

The paint and a bucket seat alone is $9,440 already, and then I added a few 'extras' and it was going over 20K in options.
I didn't really go nuts on the options. Just a thing here and there, which adds up quite a lot as how the Porsche game is always played. I, with some hesitation, declined on the $1,040 carbon fiber owner's manual cover, though.

Then I thought maybe I'll just order one without any of the options, which reminded me of a friend of mine where the dealer basically refused since all he's going to do is take up a build slot and don't make much money for the dealership.
Yeah, the GT4 is indeed fast AF and overall a great product....
But then I realized I'm a weirdo who'd rather go all-out in driving experience and cut out ALLLLLLL the fat. Hence a Radical. Too bad we can't drive it here in the US unlike UK.

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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 05:39 AM
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I am on the list for a new Spyder (since last fall). So why did I order an Evora GT this spring. An update from my post in Jan 2017.

I sold my '03 Boxster S in 2018. I owned an '84 Carrera before that (Awesome feel).

I want a car with a lot of character and feel. This was, but is not Porsche today. I was/am really disappointed with Porsche due to the IMS issue. I am willing to sacrifice luxury and performance to get such a car. Low weight is more important than high power. Other aspects I sought: roadster preferred (with roll bar, to qualify at the track), manual transmission, A/C, heat, radio, and a style I liked. I'd also like to be able to do most all maintenance and some repairs myself. I wanted enough comfort so that I could travel AND my wife would travel in it to. That way I get to drive it more.

The short list:

Lotus Elise (normal) - Very light on the controls, to the point of less feel. I drove slower. I'd want to tweak some of the looks. Easy to drive. Liked a lot, but just not quite sold on one. My wife did NOT like getting in/out.

Alfa 4C - good steering feel. felt more solid than expected, no stick, new car, unsure about reliability and durability. My wife really liked, but getting a stick was more important that having a roadster. Also wanted a bit more performance. Could be a fun purchase down the road, as I expect significant depreciation as they come off warranty.

Drove Evora 400 and 2016 Boxster Spyder (both twice). I was/am still on the list for a 2020 Spyder, but expect to drop off. All my test drives were very calm/conservative. I relied on what others wrote, who drove the cars aggressively. The Spyder became my 2nd choice and and 964/964 Carrera/Turbo a very close 3rd.

981 Spyder - loved the look, the sound, lots of extras in terms of electronic aides that are nice, but... Poor steering feel under 40mph. I really expected I would buy one, but hated the steering. It looked sports, but most of the sports feeling seemed refined out of the car. Newer was not better, I liked the feel of my 2003 more.

Evora 400. It felt more like my Boxster, and even more direct. I liked it, it is what Porsche was. Then they came out with the GT, which was more of what I like. The Evora GT is also much more unique and rare. The backseat is a bonus for my new grandpa status as well.

The kicker from various reviewers: People always glow about Porsche, how great they are, the numbers, the features the performance, but when reviewers (often the same ones) talk about the Evora (particularly the 410/430) they become more emotional, less clinical. They talk about how the Evora makes them feel.

I expect more of the same from Porsche and the upcoming Corvette.

I ordered an Evora GT.
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 06:11 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by nintense View Post
So 414hp out of 4.0 NA flat 6... I think itís pretty impressive. I wish the Evora could do 400hp without SC.
In any cases Iím sure itís a great car, and probably will hold value better than the 400/410 (or any Lotus for that matter).
Still the Evora is better looking.


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The 2GR can make 400hp, just depends on how deep your pockets are.

https://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/04/...mance-engines/

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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 06:24 AM
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The 2GR can make 400hp, just depends on how deep your pockets are.



https://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/04/...mance-engines/


This is 4.0L race car, not 3.5L road legal.

I surprise you canít get more than 300 on the NA with basic tuning, unless thereís something out there.


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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 06:51 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintense View Post
This is 4.0L race car, not 3.5L road legal.

I surprise you canít get more than 300 on the NA with basic tuning, unless thereís something out there.


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There are Darton sleeves to punch it out to 4.0L, so it isn't out of the realm of possibility that someone given enough time, money, and motivation to make a streetable 4.0L N/A 400hp 2GR. Keeping the displacement the same, but re-engineering the intake plenum, upgraded cams, lightweight valve train, and a free flowing exhaust, 360~hp would be achievable. Just look at the Cosworth GTE road cars, they were 355hp N/A. 414HP at 4.0L is 103.5 HP/L and 355HP at 3.5L is 101.4HP/L, meaning they are in the ballpark, just there is a displacement advantage for the Porsche.

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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-20-2019, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintense View Post
So 414hp out of 4.0 NA flat 6... I think itís pretty impressive. I wish the Evora could do 400hp without SC.
In any cases Iím sure itís a great car, and probably will hold value better than the 400/410 (or any Lotus for that matter).
Still the Evora is better looking.


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Except that the 911 GT3 makes 500hp out of a 4.0L flat six... Granted, the 718 is only down by 30 lb-ft of torque, but still.

I drove the 991.2 GT3, and that is a fantastic engine. I would expect this to be as good. But cracking into six figures, there is some fantastic competition. And I would expect the Evora 400 to be a fine competitor to this car (especially since it weighs about 100 kilos less).
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