Dual oil cooler, answer to overcooling - Page 5 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #81 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 11:05 AM
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Planning on going with the Mishimoto oil cooler sandwich plate (thanks for this thread), but I'm having a hard time locating a vendor for the m20 x 5/8 BSP adapters. Where did you purchase yours exigegus?

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post #82 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 11:11 AM Thread Starter
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they are really common in the UK, not so much here

world wide metric in NJ carries them, but they are commercial only

I already promised my spares to another LT member but have neglected to tell him what they are going to cost. hafta do that.......
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post #83 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-02-2017, 03:23 PM
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While I really want the laminova setup like what San has, I'll still with blockoffs for now. I used expanding foam, filler, and vinyl wrap and the end product is half decent. I drove it this Saturday and it did warm up significantly faster. No actual measurements though, sadly.

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post #84 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-10-2017, 04:24 AM Thread Starter
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Hasn't gotten much above 50F yet, but mid 40's to low 50's outside give me relaxed highway oil temps of 195F-205F.

Tomorrow is supposed to be warmer, so I should be able to come up with a time sequence to show the warm up speed at comparable temperatures to my previous idle tests.
I plan on using my morning commute, since it is start from cold several minutes of low speed driving then highway, then couple minutes ramp down, repeatable no traffic
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post #85 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-10-2017, 09:59 AM
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I too have had my Exige out this weekend on the highway here in Mass. Same weather as you.

In the oil pan, I'm reading 150-155 F at highway speeds. Will see what I get at the track (Palmer) in three weeks.

Hopefully next weekend I will have a base line curve at idle with stock two-oil cooler set up. Also hoping to have some plots for track sessions.

And thanks again for keeping this subject alive and I'm eager to see your plot with the 200 F thermostat.
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post #86 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 08:23 AM Thread Starter
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Outside temp 62-65 degrees

numbers at 3000-3500 rpm, except last reading at 1000 rpm[had data in spreadsheet but cannot make it come out legible]
first 3:35 20 mph +-
3:35-9:30 60-70 mph
9:30 on 20 mph +-
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post #87 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 09:14 AM Thread Starter
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for reference a colder day[42 degrees F raining]
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post #88 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 09:24 AM Thread Starter
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So what I glean from all this data:

Both oil and coolant warm faster with this sandwich plate
Oil tracks coolant temp in a pretty reliable fashion, such that during temperature ramp up one can imply oil temp from coolant temp
Once you hit 182 or so[obviously in my car with my instruments this will vary] your oil temp will be in the range where many report their oil temp stays with the stock configuration.

This seems a pretty substantial improvement in oil temp control with a pretty minimal investment. Plate and fittings can be had for $165 or so, and installation adds about 10 minutes to an oil change.
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post #89 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-15-2017, 03:01 PM
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I repeated the OP's test on my 2007 Lotus Exiges S, stock dual oil cooler set-up. Three measurement changes:

1) I measured the oil temp in the pan using an in-pan thermometer (Exigeus had used a laser thermomter, I believe)
2) I used a Kiwi 3 OBDII device to get access to water temps. NOTE: water temp sends from ambient levels...it just doesnt show up on cluster until car is 'warmed-up'
3) I took more measurements during the initial minutes

Observations:
A) You can clearly see the OEM oil thermostat open at about 22 to 24 minutes into the test. This happens around an oil temp reading of 147-150 degrees, suggesting OEM is 150 F thermostat.
B) At idle, it's clear the oil temp is much lower than water temp. This MAY be the case under highway speeds too as others seem to suggest. I anecdotally had 180 F water and 155 F oil last week on the highway at speed.
C) Letting a car idle sure doesn't warm the oil up very quickly. You could be at the second-cam's coolant operating temperature and the oil is only at, say, 125 F.

Next steps:
1) I will take my car to the track to determine the steady-state operating temperature under track conditions with OEM dual oil-cooler set-up AND to see how long it takes (ie how many laps) for me to get my oil up to that steady state temperature.
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post #90 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-15-2017, 03:57 PM Thread Starter
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thanks for the data, pretty much in line with my oem numbers

I would love to see a street data set similar to mine, before you do the track test
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post #91 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 04:48 AM
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I just did a road test. Used the voice recorder on my iPhone to record my water/oil temps as I said them while driving. As soon as I got home, I accidentally deleted the voice recording, sigh.

2007 Lotus Exige S
OEM dual oil cooler set-up

From my memory:

Outside temp 58 degrees; numbers at 3000-3500 rpm
first 6:00 40 mph +-
6:00-16:00 60-70 mph
16:00 on 40 mph +-

Observations:
(A) Water temps increased more quickly than oil temps, water reaching 180F after about 4 minutes
(B) Oil temps did not reach 150 F until probably 8 minutes into driving, long after the water temps would have allowed me to engage the second cam
(C) Oil temps NEVER, EVER went above 150 F

Oil temps were measured in the pan.

Thoughts: I'm more keen to know my track temps with the OEM set-up, but if the oil is never getting above 150 F around town OR on the highway, I'd be wary of ever getting on to the second cam on the street. Good thing is, I dont, saving the lead foot for the track.

Also, seems like the OEM dual oil coolers, in my test have excess cooling capacity, meaning, the OEM oil thermostat is holding the oil temp right at 150 F. It never gets higher...meaning the oil coolers have too much cooling.

Seems like the Mishimoto with 200F thermostat is going to be necessary.
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post #92 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 05:00 AM
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exigeus: can the OEM oil sandwich be removed WITH the oil cooler lines attached...and the Mishimoto installed with the oil cooler lines first attached to the Mish sandwich, before mounting to engine block? I ask because the oil cooler lines are a bit difficult to tighten/loosen when the sandwich is already installed...there is not much room for wrench and hands. I'm just trying to figure out the best install technique.

Also, there are two NPT gauge ports on the Mishimoto. Is the one which sits between the oil cooler fittings accessible when the fittings are installed? looks like a tight space and the flanges on the fittings could interfere with that NPT port.

Thinking ahead to my next oil change...and I know you said its a mere 10 minutes extra to install the Mishimoto..you havent seen the slothful pace at which I work...

'07 Lotus Exige S - Chili Red
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post #93 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-16-2017, 06:10 AM Thread Starter
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I think I removed the fittings with the plate attached, makes it easier to break the torque. I remember having the lines tucked up so they did not drain empty. Once you break the torque they should spin off pretty easily, oil fittings and all.

It is kind of a 3 handed job getting the sandwich plate tightened as it wants to spin. I put the adapters in the Mish plate in a cushioned vise

The center port is inaccessible. Maybe there is a fitting that could reach in there, but not with the adapters I bought.

Also, re: temp measurements, if you look, my second data set has gauge measurements which were using a oil pan sensor in the drain plug, with the same gauge I now have installed, so you can make an estimate of the difference with the infrared thermometer
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post #94 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-20-2017, 08:06 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JGalt View Post
I just did a road test. Used the voice recorder on my iPhone to record my water/oil temps as I said them while driving. As soon as I got home, I accidentally deleted the voice recording, sigh.
Iphone be damned. If you push the wrong button it starts recording right over the existing recording. Who wants this? Nixon?

In the middle of my data is a recording of me swearing at my iphone......
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post #95 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-20-2017, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exigegus View Post
Iphone be damned. If you push the wrong button it starts recording right over the existing recording. Who wants this? Nixon?



In the middle of my data is a recording of me swearing at my iphone......

If you ever do that accidentally, just shake your phone really hard for a few seconds. You will see a prompt that says "undo delete" and you can select "yes". That will restore it. You have to be in the application (it still might work ).

My wife didn't believe the iPhone does this until she tried it.
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post #96 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-22-2017, 12:32 PM
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On track my temps gets a steady 185F, I guess the OEM tsat is fully open then. On the highway around 140F ... I might try this on my next oil change thanks for the info !
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post #97 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-22-2017, 01:01 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for that data, every bit is interesting

I would still love to see some time/temp data from a Laminova equipped car.....
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post #98 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 07:03 AM
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I just did another road test. This time I was testing the effectiveness of oil cooler inlet covers which I fabricated from thick plastic (see pics).

2007 Lotus Exige S
OEM dual oil cooler set-up

Outside temp 50 degrees; All periods at 3,000 to 3,500 RPM
Oil temps were measured in the pan.

Observations:
(A) Lower ambient temp (12 F lower today vs. my previous test) led to 6 F lower oil temps on open-inlet oil coolers
(B) Covering BOTH oil cooler inlets appears to raise oil pan temps by 9 F. Not much of an improvement. I suspect air from center grill is reaching oil coolers
(C) There is no oil temp difference between having one oil-cooler inlet covered and no inlets covered. Perhaps shows how effective the oil coolers are.

NOTE: the gaps in the graph are where I had to pull over to add/remove the oil cooler inlet covers.

THOUGHTS: this test was conducted on the highway. I suspect track conditions might exaggerate the results, making oil cooler inlet covers a bot more valuable on the track.

Still, seems like to keep oil temps at 200 F, the Mishimoto with 200F thermostat is going to be necessary, but I am waiting to see what my track temperatures are next weekend.
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Last edited by JGalt; 04-23-2017 at 07:04 AM. Reason: correct grammar.
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post #99 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 08:10 AM
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Has anyone tried removing one of the oil coolers? Would this be advisable for street use. I have had this configuration on my Exige for the past several months. Thinking of installing oil temp gauge, if I do I'll report back. Rusty
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post #100 of 458 (permalink) Old 04-23-2017, 08:37 AM
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Yes. Turbophil plugged mine. If I went to track, I'd have to reconnect. For street, that is what he recommended.

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