Dual oil cooler, answer to overcooling - Page 8 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #141 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 04:51 AM Thread Starter
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No, not on the street

It is the only setup tested that will get over 200 on the street with the stock thermostat

[edit] the colors were confusing, i was letting the software define them, changed it

Last edited by exigegus; 05-01-2017 at 05:04 AM.
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post #142 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 05:30 AM Thread Starter
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So in the process of changing the colors and line weight of this graph, I discovered that I has somehow made a mess of transferring my data into the combination graph. Clicked on a data point and said, that's not right. Dunno what I did, but I have fixed it.

sorry about that, not a spreadsheet pro.............
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post #143 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 05:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exigegus View Post
No, not on the street

It is the only setup tested that will get over 200 on the street with the stock thermostat

[edit] the colors were confusing, i was letting the software define them, changed it
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Originally Posted by machine.gun.kelly View Post
So, do I see this correctly? The single rear 13row oil cooler yields the same oil temperatures as 2 covered OEM oil coolers... Is that correct?
I'm mostly interested in a track setup, so is my observation correct for track use?

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post #144 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 06:01 AM Thread Starter
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I don't think we have detailed information for that
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post #145 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 07:28 AM
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OK...so what conclusions can be drawn right now...and/or can any trends be formulated?

Whoever said that island life is great was never committed to Alcatraz...
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post #146 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 07:45 AM Thread Starter
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Since I am not racing, or particularly interested in that, nothing WRT track duty outside what posters have noted. JGalt has pmed me more info about subsequent track day temps that he may wish to share

For the street I have already posted my opinions
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post #147 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by exigegus View Post
JGalt has pmed me more info about subsequent track day temps that he may wish to share
What I noticed over this past weekend on my '07 Exige S, stock dual-cooler set-up:

Dry track, 80 F ambient, BOTH oil cooler inlets covered: 205-207 F oil temp in pan

Dry track, 60 F ambient, BOTH oil cooler inlets covered: 185 to low 190's oil temp in pan

Wet track (standing water spots), 50 F ambient, BOTH oil cooler inlets covered: 165-170 oil temp in pan.

My THOUGHTS:
1) covering the inlets is sufficient for summer (like) days where engine can be fully rev'ed to generate plenty of heat (meaning dry track).
2) colder days, like summer morning track sessions OR in rain, where for the latter you gotta stay a bit lower on the rev's, oil temps are less ideal
3) clearly there are disagreements on this thread and across the internet as to what oil operating temperature is best AND for what reason; my goal is to always be at or ABOVE 200 F without being above 240, both on the track and on the street WITH the smallest investment and least changes to OEM set-up. That's my personal preference.

Right now I'm headed towards testing the Mishimoto with 200 F thermostat and using the OEM dual oil coolers.

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post #148 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by machine.gun.kelly View Post
OK...so what conclusions can be drawn right now...and/or can any trends be formulated?
The data collected has been focused on oil warm up time. It appears that a sandwich plate with a higher temp and properly working thermostat (200 degree Mishimoto in this case) results in oil getting up to temperature about 7 to 10 minutes sooner but has limited influence on raising the ceiling of the oil operating temperature. To raise the ceiling of the operating temperature, the data seems to indicate that re-engineering of the oil cooling system is in order (example: Laminova, single rear oil cooler, etc.). Changing the sandwich plate will prevent premature oil cooling, and blocking off the air inlets or covering oil coolers provides some benefit by raising the ceiling about 7 to 10 degrees.

As an Exige owner that has run both the OEM coolers and a single rear cooler during track days, my typical track oil temp with the OEM dual coolers was 190 to 200 range (max 205) and in the 225 to 235 range (max 240) with the existing single rear oil set up. There has negligible change to warm up time either on street or track.

My conclusion is that changing to a 200 degree sandwich plate and re-engineering the oil cooling system is the ultimate solution. That would shorten warm up time, prevent premature oil cooling, and raise the ceiling of the oil operating temperature.

Otherwise, at least change the sandwich for faster oil warm up and to prevent premature cooling....street ot track.
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post #149 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 09:16 AM Thread Starter
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Good summaries guys

One note, we have not tested a 200 degree thermostat yet, mine is the lower temp one.

It looks to me the if Lotusmotion changed to a 'functional' thermostat, he would have a pretty good system, higher oil temps and quicker warm up. JGalt is going to try the 200 degree, and I have that thermostat, I just want to get some hot weather driving under my belt. I should be due an oil change by August so maybe then. If the oil temp follows what I am seeing, 10-20 degrees above thermostat value, you are looking at 210-220 degree oil in street driving.
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post #150 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-01-2017, 11:45 AM
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FWIW- Having some intake cams made up to resolve the wiping issue...

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post #151 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-02-2017, 07:50 AM
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So i hate throw a wrench into all of this...but I am curious to know what the oil temps are on hotter days...90-100 degs. Also from an AutoX view point. I believe that in our case, it can be worse in many ways as we are running the car HARD for 30 seconds of on/off/on/off throttle position but then our cars sit on the hot pavement for 10 mins before running again. I know that with a 190 deg water thermostat in the car, I have seen my temps upwards of 215 - 220 deg temps without me taking the time to cool the rad with water. I have no oil temp measurements as I never thought about it at the time, until this thread. I have dual oil coolers, and so I am wondering if I should just stick with the dual oil coolers and just go with the mishimoto plate. I feel like it would be the best of all worlds. However the raising the Oil PSI does make me think that reducing down to a single oil cooler would be a wise decision as well.

Man guys...making me think about spending more money, not really helping my cause here.

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post #152 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-02-2017, 09:57 AM Thread Starter
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Patience my friend, as soon as it gets hot, we will have hot weather measurements

I am not sure where I stand on this whole oil temp thing. The race guys are pretty adamant about much hotter oil than is common.

Oil thermostats seem to come in 160, 180, 200, so it is hard to see that anyone in that business is interested in oil much hotter than that. i think I may have seen one at 220, but not very common.

From the viscosity curves I have seen, and from evidence of idle oil pressure, it looks like once you hit 160 or so, you are 90 percent of the way there viscosity wise.

With the Mishimoto you can be pretty certain you are there, once you hit say, 182 coolant temp[to pick an arbitrary number]

I am interested to see the numbers for the 200 degree thermostat. If JGalt doesn't beat me to it I may have those numbers by the end of the summer.

If your car is a bit hot natured, I think keeping the 2 oil coolers is a good idea. With a proper thermostat I think you will see a rapid rise to operating and then a pretty stable level after that. Changing the oil thermostat is cheap [low as 15 bucks] and quick[well, after you get the aero tray off]

Again, my focus has been getting up to operating faster, not final temp, which is kind of a to each his own deal. If you look at the graphs, the mishimoto thermostat is faster in that respect than any other setup measured thus far. Even with one rear mounted cooler, the warmup ramp is similar to the dual front coolers
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post #153 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-02-2017, 09:01 PM
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With the knowledge that my car is an AutoX car, and on really hot days it bakes in the sun/pavement i decided to go the mishimoto route. I am also going charged motor (turbo) and so i know my oil will see a different level of temp/work duty, and i want to help it/my motor as much as possible.

But got a great deal on my oil adapter plate, here is the link for anyone else interested: http://www.ebay.com/itm/282399684219
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post #154 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 10:32 AM
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It looks like this one is set at 185 F. I thought the idea was to have the sandwich plate at 200F. Are you sure that is the one you want? Lonnie
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post #155 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 10:41 AM Thread Starter
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thermostat inserts are 15 bucks or so, few minutes to swap out.
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post #156 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:25 PM
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It looks like this one is set at 185 F. I thought the idea was to have the sandwich plate at 200F. Are you sure that is the one you want? Lonnie

From what I have found, they all come with 185F "stock." Then if you want to go hotter or cooler then you have to purchase a 2nd thermostat and change it out. So a 200 F is about $13 on ebay and there is a 160 F one as well for about the same cost.

185 is the starting base thermostat that comes with the unit.

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post #157 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-04-2017, 04:53 AM Thread Starter
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I have a couple more sets of the proper adapters. The place I bought them from was commercial only, so I figured I would keep a few so I could get them to people who need them. PM me if you want a pair.
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post #158 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-05-2017, 10:51 AM
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Thanks Giantmcm for your info. Lonnie
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post #159 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-05-2017, 12:29 PM
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Thanks Giantmcm for your info. Lonnie
Welcome,

Exigegus deserves all the credit...he did the footwork for us. I appreciate it Exigegus.

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post #160 of 455 (permalink) Old 05-07-2017, 09:14 AM
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After reading this thread I didn't realize that the stock thermostat is in a open position. And when temps rise it closes off. Is this correct? And that some oil is always going to the oil coolers?


Here is a link to someone removing the thermostat and blocking the cooler line. Wondering if just removing the thermostat would be enough for street? If this is correct.

http://www.utterpower.com/the-lotus-...omment-page-1/



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