Buying a 430 in the states - Page 6 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #101 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-28-2018, 08:49 PM
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I replied to a post, raising concerns about parts availability on early Evoras. I gave suggestions that if an owner is open minded there are options.

Parts & part numbers may differ but re-read my post. I stated that later parts could be used to keep an early Evora running. i.e. compatible.

To keep low volume cars running requires dirty fingernails & thinking beyond marketeering claims on % different between model iterations.

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post #102 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-29-2018, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Julian73 View Post
You may want to review the parts lists before staying with that claim. many many many parts are a new number not just a revision letter update.
Agreed. Aren’t 2/3 of the parts new on the 400?
I honestly think that figure was an embellishment by Lotus in order to curtail people's assumption that the 400 is a refreshed evora, rather than a full redesign. It's way easier to change a part number than it is to remove design a part, especially when all of the parts work well in an all but identical car.
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post #103 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-29-2018, 01:18 PM
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I honestly think that figure was an embellishment by Lotus in order to curtail people's assumption that the 400 is a refreshed evora, rather than a full redesign. It's way easier to change a part number than it is to remove design a part, especially when all of the parts work well in an all but identical car.
Highly unlikely in my inbedment in manufacturing. Part numbers Cost Money, to create, to maintain, to stagnate inventory. The numbering system has a letter at the end this is used if a part is updated by revision. a company does not like to create a totally new number unless required.
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post #104 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-29-2018, 02:21 PM
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Let's count the major systems that we know were changed for the Evora 400 starting with the easy stuff:

Supercharger, which means new associated hardware and software
Intercoolers, radiators, etc.
Shifting mechanism.
Major body parts including rear wing, diffuser, front bumper and all associated parts and grill covers in multiple locations
Seats (for better or worse)
The whole dash including most instruments and virtually all the controls and buttons, the radio and just about everything else associated with that sub assembly.
Frame/chassis: essentially all new. How many parts did that take?
Wheels
Brakes (so probably/possibly master and/or slave cylinders)
Harness(es)
Rear lights/brake lights
Limited slip diff on MT cars
Suspension components to include shocks and springs
Door cards
Armrest (gone )


So while the 400 is recognizably an Evora and uses the same motor and has the same look, it's different in many important details. I contend the Evora was re-engineered for this iteration while willfully and of necessity retaining a great deal of the original concept and overall design philosophy. Certainly it takes one of us to see the difference so there's that. BTW that's why I balk when people who own an S1 say how ugly the 400 is. I can see a preference for the car without the additional cooling scoops the new car demands as a practical matter but I won't be trading my ugly 400 for an S1 of any vintage except at gunpoint. Under the skin there's enough going on to effectively have upgraded almost every mechanical and electrical system in the car.
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post #105 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-29-2018, 08:20 PM
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@lotusquacious You are largely correct, but the only real part of the chassis that changed was the center tub to facilitate easier entry/exit for all those that whined about the wider than average sills in the first gen. The actual sub-frames for front and rear and other suspension components remain essentially identical. Even the coil-overs are still bilstien, but use different rebound and compression rates to deal with the different weight distribution driven by a new engine.

The biggest driver of most of the new part numbers were the obvious exterior panel changes as well as essentially an entirely new interior. Then there's the silly stuff like upgraded brake rotors (actually new), new calipers that aren't really new (they just are no longer produce with "Lotus" and instead use off the shelf "AP" products), wheels, mesh inserts, etc. When you take all of the preceding, it adds up to a lot of new part numbers, but the core car is essentially the same.
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post #106 of 405 (permalink) Old 05-31-2018, 06:31 PM
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listing with new part numbers not just a Rev change: plus new transaxle cooling system, totally new water cooling from flow path to radiators, new engine oil cooling, undertrays pans, diffuser, rear clam, body shell sides, nose bumper, rear bumper, doors, tail gate, door glass, glass seals, wheel liners, mirrors, complete interior down to sun visors, all major and most minor wiring harnesses, tire pressure ecu, lighting ecu, ECM programs (same box), alarm ecu, airbags, airbag ecu (ROW got old US spec one and US got new, heater, AC condenser and piping runs, heater piping runs (single run rather than back and forth) using engine cooling water for feed, front and rear chassis subframes, roll/seat belt hoops, spring mounts, springs, dampers, ... and the list goes on. `

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post #107 of 405 (permalink) Old 07-03-2018, 09:43 AM
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June has come and gone with no public announcement. Anyone heard anything new?

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post #108 of 405 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 02:03 PM
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I haven't heard anything new and just took the time to read this entire thread... Interesting...

To weigh in I'd probably pay $160K for one. Comparing it to a GT3 is not valid imo, they are unobtainium (I have a 991.1 GT3 in the garage and a new RS on order). I've purchased 25 new Porsches over the years and I'm still a nobody (to Porsche); unless you purchased a 918 they are very difficult to purchase unless you pay a dealer markup). I think (have not driven one) that the 430 is the "RS" version of the Evora. I think it looks great and I suspect it will have a much more "manual" feel than the modern Porsches. I miss that. The reason I say "probably" is in typical Lotus fashion they released a very cool car that 1/3rd of the world car market cannot buy. By spring of 2019 who knows what else will be out that that's the new cool toy. By then the 430 may be old news... Finally I'm concerned about the US car being watered down, no carbon bumpers, less HP, no carbon seats, etc. If it's a 400 in a 430 body then I'm out. My first "exotic" was an Esprit S1. I still have an Esprit, it would be cool to have a GT430 sitting next to it. Motorsport Green please...

Regarding the 570 I just don't like the appearance of the McLaren. If I'm into that I'd just reach a bit further and get a 488.
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post #109 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-07-2018, 09:00 PM
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$160k for an Evora 430 when the 400 barely sells at $85k is hilarious.
No different than a typical optioned GT3 costing twice a base 911

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post #110 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-13-2018, 09:34 AM
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No different than a typical optioned GT3 costing twice a base 911
And since when has it made any sense to compare Porsche pricing to Lotus pricing?
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post #111 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-13-2018, 01:04 PM
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Head of operations (Ryan, sorry I don't recall his last name) mentioned on Friday night at LOG this weekend that they are close to announcing a press launch event for the 430. If I herd correctly, they need to finalize a venue contract before saying any about the date/location.

He talked alot about "world" cars where North America gets all the same vehicles...
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post #112 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-13-2018, 06:51 PM
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I was told this car has the 430's tune and is here to get testing accomplished. The GT trim is supposed to be made available at a much more attractive price than we'd previously speculated. I heard a figure that, if it comes to pass, would make the 430 price competitive with a base Carrera S, never mind a GT3. If that actually comes to pass it will turn a lot of heads possibly including mine.

Anyway, this is the mule:
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post #113 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-13-2018, 07:12 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the update.

Had a chance to sit in and hear a new Vanquish last week. Start at $150K will be $200K done proper. Are Lotus ready to position in this segment?

And am I? The Aston will be a real consideration for many. I do hold out that Lotus can do what they do, offer very competitive, or better, performance for less.

Anyone can make something complicated. It takes genius to make it simple. Einstein.
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post #114 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 04:25 AM
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lotusquacious - if your information proves to be correct, that would be a boon for all of us who want a 430 but were worried they would be priced sky high.

Did your source say whether the car was going to have the same componentry as the UK-spec 430s? Or are they going to use cheaper dampers, etc?
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post #115 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 04:33 AM
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Thanks for the update.

Had a chance to sit in and hear a new Vanquish last week. Start at $150K will be $200K done proper. Are Lotus ready to position in this segment?
If you can find a new Vanquish at that price, you should buy two. They start at over $300K at our local dealer. The new Vantage may be more in that general price range.

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post #116 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 01:10 PM Thread Starter
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If you can find a new Vanquish at that price, you should buy two. They start at over $300K at our local dealer. The new Vantage may be more in that general price range.

My bad. Late last night. Yes the new Vantage

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Anyone can make something complicated. It takes genius to make it simple. Einstein.
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post #117 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 01:41 PM
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My bad. Late last night. Yes the new Vantage

Attachment 1211974

Attachment 1211976
As in - it will Vanquish your savings
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post #118 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 02:58 PM Thread Starter
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The Vanquish was a really awesome car (the new DBS replaces it) but there are some mighty big competitors in the $350K+ arena.

Anyone can make something complicated. It takes genius to make it simple. Einstein.
2011 Evora S Racing Heritage Edition (#3 of 4) (Now with alexsharkeyross)
2005 Elise LRG, track prepped ,
1974 Lotus Europa Special 3841R in JPS livery
2007 Toyota Tundra (about 10 cup holders), traded for 2015 Tundra TRD PRO
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post #119 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 04:21 PM
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lotusquacious - if your information proves to be correct, that would be a boon for all of us who want a 430 but were worried they would be priced sky high.

Did your source say whether the car was going to have the same componentry as the UK-spec 430s? Or are they going to use cheaper dampers, etc?
Good question. I didn't ask and he didn't say. I gathered it would be similar to the current 430GT's spec. I regret not asking about the small print that might taketh away the goodies to meet a price but I think we'll get a full fat version if not in the GT spec then in the Sport spec. There's one item in ours that won't be in the Euro spec, which would of course be the seats given we require side impact air bags. After that I don't know what might be changed but I think we're going to see more aggressive marketing in the States. I'll assume (dangerous) that the car we get here will be very like the European versions with any mods focused on meeting Federal standards.

I do hope I'm not spreading false news!

Lew
'17 Evora 400 MT
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post #120 of 405 (permalink) Old 08-14-2018, 05:42 PM
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Hey thank you for replying! I sure hope that you are correct because I really, really, REALLY want a 430 but only if the price is right. I got my new leftover 2017 400 for a huge discount a few months ago but if the 430 really comes in at 911S price, then I may have to jump.
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