Tesla Increases Prices On Already-Ordered Roadsters - Page 3 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #41 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-22-2009, 12:20 PM
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Patents do take a while, but you can search the pending applications, which is what i did.

USPTO applications search only shows you the published applications which is on average two years behind the list of applications which are actually filed/pending.

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post #42 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-22-2009, 12:30 PM
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thats true, however since the cars in production already they're likely to have already submitted their patents a while ago, and the other four are in 2007.

but there might be some we don't know about yet.

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post #43 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-22-2009, 07:22 PM
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USPTO applications search only shows you the published applications which is on average two years behind the list of applications which are actually filed/pending.
its 18 months before they get published and as of right now they are 30 months out before they are granted. ANy patent submission can however be fasttracked if they pay alot more and then it gets published in 6 months and (possibly) granted in 18.
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post #44 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-24-2009, 06:46 AM
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Looks like Tesla has about 15 patents in the works. Check the "Tesla Patents" thread over on the TMC site.
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post #45 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-24-2009, 09:06 AM
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Some of those patents are awful, no wonder people whine about the patent system.

"The method of claim 10, further comprising flashing the illuminated indicator to a red color if the first electrical vehicle fault is detected."

A red light flahes on a fault.

they're attempting to patent the equivalent of a fuel gauge.

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post #46 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 04:42 AM
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Some of those patents are awful, no wonder people whine about the patent system.

"The method of claim 10, further comprising flashing the illuminated indicator to a red color if the first electrical vehicle fault is detected."

A red light flahes on a fault.

they're attempting to patent the equivalent of a fuel gauge.


yeah I know.. they patented a warning light... woooh!
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post #47 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 04:51 AM
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Harley tried to patent the sound of ther engine

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post #48 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 03:38 PM
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Tesla to Angry Customers: It’s All About Us | The Truth About Cars

Clean Tech - GigaOM - Salon.com

Judging by the comments, their public perception isn't what it used to be. At least for Elon and Tesla it hasn't seemed to hit any major media yet, just a bunch of car and green blogs. Surprised nothing ever made it to the front page of Digg or Fark where a lot of the public would of seen what is going on.

The CEO of the company even walked out on his own wife and 5 kids. Yet he expects undying loyalty from the early adopters and their (now even more) money? The guy wouldn't know integrity if it reached out and pimp slapped him.

Good Lord. Has someone informed their PR department yet that "You are doing it wrong"?
This is the general tone of comments from the last article. Not even any of the die hard fan boys are attempting to come to their rescue.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"I guess charging the car in under 36 hours is now an option" (a $3000.00 one!)

Elon Musk's ego actually has the balls to speak about how he is sure you are OK with him shafting you. "If we allow ourselves to lose money on the cars we are shipping today, we place those loans at risk. Mass market electric cars have been my goal from the beginning of Tesla. I don’t want and I don’t think the vast majority of Tesla customers want us to do anything to jeopardize that objective.” - now give us more money b!thces!!!!

"Tesla’s whole point when it was first starting out was that it was going to show the carmaking industry how we Silicon Valley people do it. Guess Musk really showed them, huh. Overbudget by $75,000 per car and they didn’t even know it! Until an investor did an audit. Unbelievable.

Nonetheless, as Bunkie and Rob say, there’s not much a prospective buyer can do at this point but pay the extra money. Or see their toymaker (oh, sorry) carmaker go under."

"The only thing Tesla can produce well is a press release. How many millions have they spent to transplant company A’s electric motor, company B’s control module, into company C’s chassis? It took them this long to realize that it cost them 40% more to produce than they were selling it for?

And their solution is to try to cheat their existing customers out of $6000, which won’t come close to the extra $40,000 they are losing per car?

Tesla’s death is near."

"Musk’s net worth has typically been reported as north of $300 million. If he cared about the success of the company AND integrity, he would pitch in the price increase himself for the contracts already on the books and only have price increases for new customers.

Integrity, remember that word?"

"Tesla and Customers in the same sentence…I’m still laughing!!!!!"

"Remember, John Horner, it’s not the money, it’s the margin. Tesla only saves about $2.7 million by doing this. But Tesla changes its margin from a loss to a profit on each car. That’s got to be the motivation for this.

You are right that Elon Musk does not have any integrity. He has stabbed people in the back many times at Zip2, PayPal, Space X, Solar City and now Tesla.

But Musk has also been very successful. One of his strengths is that he tells it like it is and does the dirty work that most will shy away from. As HeBeGB says, a lot of other CEOs have trouble with that."

"
“it’s not the money, it’s the margin.”

Only if you believe Musk’s spin of the day.

His successes has been at separating people from their money. By that measure, most drug lords and mob bosses are successful too."

"I find the defense of Musk in this case completely shocking (Tesla employees or investors posting, perhaps?).

What he is saying is not that the company will fold if they don’t jack up prices… but that he would have to get more investment. IE, he would either have to pony up the cash himself, or hit up his existing investors and/or find new ones. That is, he would have to dilute his existing investors.

As a consumer of his product, I don’t give a crap about his wealthy investors being diluted. It is not my problem. They can put on their big-boy pants and plunk down a little more (unless, of course, they think it is a poor investment and that the company is a sinkhole.)

Have we become so beaten-down as consumers that this point no longer resonates?"

"Elon is the cave man visionary that saw the supermarket, brilliant!

The farm however, was a foreign concept to him, DOH!"

"CKB, you are right about the money… for some it’s a drop in the bucket. I think the tipping point is defined beyond the price and has to do with feelings of risk, annoyance, and distrust.

One of the reasons consumers spend a premium for luxury goods is the treatment they receive for being a customer. People who ruitinely spend >$100k on cars aren’t used to having their time wasted or being jerked around over $6k."

"My hope, though, is that the government does not step in. Then the market does not decide, government regulators do. I fear that Elon Musk will get his money from the Department of Energy and we’ll all be paying for Tesla’s cars.

Worked for Elon Musk’s Space X. It’s funded by NASA."

"Customers should not have bought a Tesla unless they have money to burn.

For the merely well off there is the Elise.

Anyway, as a customer if Tesla goes under before you get your car you are an unsecured creditor to the tune of $50K, and if it goes under afterward you have no parts or re-sale value.

However, things like:

“The body supplier was also switched out from a little company that was charging us nutty money and had a max production of three per week to Sotira, who supplies high paint quality body panels to Lotus, Aston Martin and others.”

make me wonder what kind of idiots are running the company. Really, despite your claims to the contrary you’re really making an electric Lotus Elise, you didn’t think that starting with the Lotus body panel supplier would be a good idea?"

"They’re going to get sued out of existence.

If you read between the lines, what Tesla is saying is that they completely made up the cost of the car, without having actually priced the materials or parts. They DESERVE to fail."

"So, its sugar-time on Department of Energy grants and bail-out-palooza for Tesla, and Elon also has the COTS/ISS Re-Supply contract from NASA.

It seems the government loves funding Elon-toys that cost more than thought, are years late, and don’t quite live up to what was advertised.

How do you get in on this kind of racket? I’m in the wrong line of work, obviously."

"Ya, building cars is hard.

Criticizing is easy.

They hired seasoned pros from Detroit to show ‘em how to make ‘em after they ran into trouble.

Yes, yes, yes, go ahead and laugh. it’s still true."

"no_slushbox,
Whether you like him or not, Clarkson made a good point when reviewing the Tesla. He pointed out that while roadster was faster in a straight line than an Elise, and costs pennies to “fill up”, it also happens to cost (x) times more (from my Canadian perspective, it’s 2x more than a base model Elise). That difference in price pays for a LOT of gas, many years worth. And you can walk out and buy an Elise off the lot right now, and get rock-solid Toyota reliability and world class handling without the smell of Musk. And the Elise is not exactly a fuel drinker in the first place, is it?

Based on logic and reason (and an analysis of management), the Tesla should not have gotten beyond the prototype stage. But symbolic value is a powerful rose-tinted lens through which the most polished turd can seem very appealing to a greenwashed market, despite all odds."

"Musk did this also because he knows customers now get a tax break. They are just swallowing the federal tax break for themselves."

Last edited by SweetDaddyD; 01-25-2009 at 04:00 PM.
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post #49 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 03:56 PM
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you do have to wonder whats behind the body supplier thing though.

Black Exige S / Elan M100. Don't run a smaller pulley without an upgraded fuel pump! http://www.goth.am ecu stuff.. New reflash box coming soon!
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post #50 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 04:15 PM
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I think this sums up tesla for me at the moment.
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post #53 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 07:19 PM
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post #54 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 07:21 PM
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PC Magazine Discussions - Tesla Shafts Customers By Raising Pre-Order Price

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post #55 of 55 (permalink) Old 01-25-2009, 08:11 PM
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now that it is a good year later.... the fisker vs. telsa thing has taken some interesting turns... none of them towards tesla.

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