Evora Power Packages are HERE! - Page 2 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #21 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-08-2017, 09:34 PM
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I bought my exhaust from Shinoo at Sector111. InoKinetic now.

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post #22 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-09-2017, 07:55 PM Thread Starter
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I'm in the same boat with my '14 S. Live in CA, can't exactly bring it by your shop. I've already got a Larini Valved Exhaust with 3rd cat delete, and am interested in what a tune could provide (in addition to perhaps the BOE intake). I'm still under warranty until 2/18. I'd like something that doesn't place so much strain on the components that will have early failures, and a tune that won't create issues when I've got to smog it (in 2020). Finally, prices?

Thanks!
With the S or NA, you're not going to be backing up to an scenario where reliability is sacrificed. They thresholds for component reliability are simply greater than what the OE S blower can get to.

We've been racing these cars with 350whp on 91 octane for a quite a while now on a stock rotating group and there has been zero reliability issues.

A basic tune is a stage 1 deal. Stage 2 exists because the tuned headers make that big of a difference but the tune is significantly different with our tuned headers vs the untuned headers available on the market.

I really doubt the tune will create smog check issues if the supporting emissions equipment remains intact. Most smog checks are looking for readiness and run the sniffer. All the readiness checks remain OEM if instructed as such and the sniffer will be happy with a good cat. I've not seen our catalyst fail a sniffer test.

Hope that helps,

Phil


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

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post #23 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-10-2017, 03:08 AM
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I just had a question about the headers. Could they be installed without tuning? I wanna do the power package but at this time I can't have any real down time to send the ECU in for the reflash. I was thinking install the headers next time I get the car on a lift then when I can, do the reflash and install the intake together. I have a 2011na 6sp with sport exhaust. Was thinking of the headers with cat.

Also, is it possible to pick up a second ECU and have that flashed or you can't swap ECUs like that with these cars?

Right now I'm having cold start issues so I have to see what that is first so I don't open up a can of worms.
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post #24 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-10-2017, 07:40 PM
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With the S or NA, you're not going to be backing up to an scenario where reliability is sacrificed. They thresholds for component reliability are simply greater than what the OE S blower can get to.

We've been racing these cars with 350whp on 91 octane for a quite a while now on a stock rotating group and there has been zero reliability issues.

A basic tune is a stage 1 deal. Stage 2 exists because the tuned headers make that big of a difference but the tune is significantly different with our tuned headers vs the untuned headers available on the market.

I really doubt the tune will create smog check issues if the supporting emissions equipment remains intact. Most smog checks are looking for readiness and run the sniffer. All the readiness checks remain OEM if instructed as such and the sniffer will be happy with a good cat. I've not seen our catalyst fail a sniffer test.

Hope that helps,

Phil
Your missing some of the points about CA smog. The CAI will immediately fail you as it has no CARB/EO#. Any cat removal will immediately fail you as well. We get semi-lucky with the cats as they are not likely to remove the plates to inspect. However, if they see headers they are more likely to inspect and fail you.

For CA cars it's better to have a drop in filter, muffler and tune. It may not give us as much power, but it's a sure thing at smog. Potentially, we could get away with a secondary cat delete as they aren't likely to look. Headers generally alter the heat shields and make themselves visible. Smog stations are getting really good at looking for mods these days.

What's the wiggle room like for putting such a package together? Estimates on hp/tq would also be nice.
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post #25 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-10-2017, 07:42 PM
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I bought my exhaust from Shinoo at Sector111. InoKinetic now.
Thank you sir.
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post #26 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 09:13 AM Thread Starter
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I just had a question about the headers. Could they be installed without tuning? I wanna do the power package but at this time I can't have any real down time to send the ECU in for the reflash. I was thinking install the headers next time I get the car on a lift then when I can, do the reflash and install the intake together. I have a 2011na 6sp with sport exhaust. Was thinking of the headers with cat.

Also, is it possible to pick up a second ECU and have that flashed or you can't swap ECUs like that with these cars?

Right now I'm having cold start issues so I have to see what that is first so I don't open up a can of worms.
Yes, the headers do a very nice job without tuning. You can just bolt them on and you'll have power. The tuning just makes them better. The biggest change is from the headers themselves. The cat with our headers costs literally no HP in our testing.

for the 2011 NA Evora, we can do an email tune. You just need to buy the cable at check out and send me an email to accompany the order. I prefer to have the ECU for now, but if it's really pressing, we can do the email thing with software on the 2011.


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Originally Posted by RR_Evora View Post
Your missing some of the points about CA smog. The CAI will immediately fail you as it has no CARB/EO#. Any cat removal will immediately fail you as well. We get semi-lucky with the cats as they are not likely to remove the plates to inspect. However, if they see headers they are more likely to inspect and fail you.

For CA cars it's better to have a drop in filter, muffler and tune. It may not give us as much power, but it's a sure thing at smog. Potentially, we could get away with a secondary cat delete as they aren't likely to look. Headers generally alter the heat shields and make themselves visible. Smog stations are getting really good at looking for mods these days.

What's the wiggle room like for putting such a package together? Estimates on hp/tq would also be nice.
I'm not missing it, I just "suspect" that there are many many CA cars running around with aftermarket tunes and parts that go through smog just fine.

The headers are essentially impossible to see on the evora. the cat is present and passes sniffer from what I'm told.

You don't have to run the CAI, but it hides under the engine cover, so why not? or jsut swap it back and forth and modify the stock airbox so that it's easy to remove/swap for the visual.

From an environmental standpoint, the emissions output at cruise and idle, which is where they care is not modified, so you can sleep well at night

I cannot perfectly comment on how every little change will impact the output. What I can say is that when the package is paired together it works very well. When you deviate from that path, output will drop. It's hard to say how much. It won't go back to stock though. that's for sure. As much as the brain would like it to work this way, each component doesn't just add X, Y, or Z power independent of another factor. It's a big airpump and works as a system.

To that end, I'd imagine the cams will fly though an inspection too. I don't advocate or endorse cheating your state smog inspection. All parts are off-road use only. That said, I'd guess they would pass....

I'd gather that there will -never- be CARB aftermarket parts for the current generation of Lotus cars. Never is a long time, but it is my guess...

-Phil


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

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post #27 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 10:28 AM
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How do these mods work on a non intercooled supercharged car, ie like an exige v6?
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post #28 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 10:35 AM
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Hey Phil - in another thread I was discussing some pretty significant lumpiness to the idle of my '11 S while in sport mode. There is also a very odd/noticeable behavior on off throttle in-gear deceleration as you drop under about 1800rpm in sport mode (there's a big lump and a very heavy increase in engine drag it seems). Someone suggested that the BOE tunes address this - do you know more about these two behaviors? They seem to be common enough, there's several "me toos" to the behavior. My thought was that they were the result of mechanical states rather than tuning, but I'd be interested to hear your thoughts.
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post #29 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
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How do these mods work on a non intercooled supercharged car, ie like an exige v6?
I've yet to get my hands on the Exige v6... in general, the mods work the same since it's the motor and setup is the same. that said, I've only remotely tuned and therefore seen 1 Exige V6 cal ID and it was on the other side of the planet. Would love to get one in the shop... rare bird in the US.

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Originally Posted by esseye View Post
Hey Phil - in another thread I was discussing some pretty significant lumpiness to the idle of my '11 S while in sport mode. There is also a very odd/noticeable behavior on off throttle in-gear deceleration as you drop under about 1800rpm in sport mode (there's a big lump and a very heavy increase in engine drag it seems). Someone suggested that the BOE tunes address this - do you know more about these two behaviors? They seem to be common enough, there's several "me toos" to the behavior. My thought was that they were the result of mechanical states rather than tuning, but I'd be interested to hear your thoughts.
Those are not issues in any of the Evora's we've done. The entire cam, spark, and fuel maps are new on our tunes. We can change the throttle curves too, make it so you have the sport throttle map at all times, etc... In full disclosure, I cannot say that I specifically addressed the issues you're describing, but I didn't really pay attention to all the problems with the Evora mapping, but rather mapped it how I like it...

Make sense?

Phil


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

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post #30 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 11:08 AM
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Those are not issues in any of the Evora's we've done. The entire cam, spark, and fuel maps are new on our tunes. We can change the throttle curves too, make it so you have the sport throttle map at all times, etc... In full disclosure, I cannot say that I specifically addressed the issues you're describing, but I didn't really pay attention to all the problems with the Evora mapping, but rather mapped it how I like it...

Make sense?

Phil
It does - just wasn't sure if you were aware of them in stock form, or aware of anything in the stock maps that would lead to similar behavior. The lumpy idle in sport mode especially makes me think something more like a vac issue or intake leak. The odd deceleration scenario I can't really think of what it would even be. Maybe cam timing changing as it drops past certain rpms or such, but I don't know in stock form where any of those points are. Always possible that the ECU is somehow responsible for these, but in any other car I'd suspect they're more mechanical related.
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post #31 of 44 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 01:19 PM
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I've yet to get my hands on the Exige v6... in general, the mods work the same since it's the motor and setup is the same. that said, I've only remotely tuned and therefore seen 1 Exige V6 cal ID and it was on the other side of the planet. Would love to get one in the shop... rare bird in the US.

Phil
Agreed the setups are extremly similar and what works for one should work for the other.
What do the mods acheive with a supercharged evora, and what are they.

My impression from the research I have done . Your headers are better than others, and there is a marked gain on NA cars. However supercharger setups respond differetly. While some aftermarket compoanies spin the supercharger faster that only brings single run results on street as the current setup is already at its thermal limit. Therefore letting the pump (engine ) work easier aud build up less heat are the ways to making track sustainable improvements(without going whole hog and breaking the bank).

From what I hear, and have seen comparing the two on a lift, the exige has better airflow/cooling/heat dissapation than the evora and slightly different engine bay packaging of the motor. As its a track only car certain liberties can be taken, we're more interested in cooling at speed on track than running ac in traffic. Also its run on 100 unleaded all the time. Maybe its as simple as a slower waterpump, and different thermostat with headers?

I wonder what lotus did to get the 380 hp of the latest car, they seem to say exhaust manifolds.

My goal is not neceesarily more power, but better sustained power, and keeping the power to redline, along with some gear changes because frankly 5th and by extention 4th are too tall for the track. Functionaly whether you shift from 4th to 5th at 6500 or 7200 terminal velocity at the end of the straight is the same, which indicates to me that in a track enviroment there is a lot to gain without having to do a huge change or altering reliability.

So far the only anecdotal evidense I have seen are the folks in the Uk who have done headers and claim 15 or so hp gain with stock tune over the stock setup same dyno, but who really knows.
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post #32 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-08-2017, 09:55 AM
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Any updates on IPS support? I've been waiting on the headers for the reflash. That being asked, are you able to tune transmission behavior as well, and how are the headers performing on the S cars? Are they making a significant difference as they are on the NA cars?
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post #33 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-08-2017, 12:37 PM
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I keep looking at this as I was getting ready to order the CAI. I have the car in the air and apart maybe now is the time to do the headers as well. Wish my tune would work with this but live and learn so they say.
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post #34 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-12-2017, 03:06 AM
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Quote:
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I just had a question about the headers. Could they be installed without tuning? I wanna do the power package but at this time I can't have any real down time to send the ECU in for the reflash. I was thinking install the headers next time I get the car on a lift then when I can, do the reflash and install the intake together. I have a 2011na 6sp with sport exhaust. Was thinking of the headers with cat.

Also, is it possible to pick up a second ECU and have that flashed or you can't swap ECUs like that with these cars?

Right now I'm having cold start issues so I have to see what that is first so I don't open up a can of worms.
Yes, the headers do a very nice job without tuning. You can just bolt them on and you'll have power. The tuning just makes them better. The biggest change is from the headers themselves. The cat with our headers costs literally no HP in our testing.

for the 2011 NA Evora, we can do an email tune. You just need to buy the cable at check out and send me an email to accompany the order. I prefer to have the ECU for now, but if it's really pressing, we can do the email thing with software on the 2011.


-Phil
So, the cold start issue seems to be ongoing, had pins cleaned no change. I was told swapping the harness doesn't always fix this and they believe it's a ghost imagine in the ECU causing it. The car is going back to the dealer for more testing.

An idea tossed around is to do the BOE tune to see if that fixes the cold start issue. What do you think?

Incase I'm asking for help with something: 2011 Evora N/A C/R 6sp with BOE TVS 1900 S/C kit
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post #35 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-19-2017, 10:42 AM
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Cams

Do you need valve gap adjustment (shims etc) in order to install your cams?
Thanks Andreas
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post #36 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-19-2017, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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Do you need valve gap adjustment (shims etc) in order to install your cams?
Thanks Andreas
No sir.


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

____________________________________________

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post #37 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-20-2017, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
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Any updates on IPS support? I've been waiting on the headers for the reflash. That being asked, are you able to tune transmission behavior as well, and how are the headers performing on the S cars? Are they making a significant difference as they are on the NA cars?
Sorry, didn't read through the whole thing there...

IPS, just haven't had many to work with. I'd love to get more in the shop. The answer is I'm 99% sure we're good to go with the IPS cars, but I need mule to triple check some things. our car and the others we've had the pleasure to improve are manuals...

Have not even started to crack the transmission behavior, so no with no ETA.

We've used the headers on S cars and have great gains with them over 2bular and obviously stock on the dyno... So yes, they make great gains on both S and NA cars to be sure.

Thanks,

Phil


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

____________________________________________

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post #38 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-20-2017, 12:46 PM Thread Starter
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So, the cold start issue seems to be ongoing, had pins cleaned no change. I was told swapping the harness doesn't always fix this and they believe it's a ghost imagine in the ECU causing it. The car is going back to the dealer for more testing.

An idea tossed around is to do the BOE tune to see if that fixes the cold start issue. What do you think?
Lotus struggles with cold start at the programming level. You're not likely getting any tweaks from Lotus corporate on the cold start. We've done some work with cold start, but it's really hard to tweak because you really only get one crack at it...


Phil: NASA 2012 and 2014 TT1 Central Champion, 2005 GG Elige, Rev400, 485+whp REV X

2011 Pearl White Evora, BOE Skunk Works 6 SPD 435WHP || 2014 Black Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP|| 2011 White Evora Skunk Works IPS 390WHP || 2006 CO Elise, Rev400, Steet Car

____________________________________________

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BOE ClamHinge | BOE TVS SuperCharging, The Most Powerful Track-Worthy Forced Induction | EFI Engine Management | BOE The Essential Fuel Starve Solution| BOE Lotus Tow Package| BOE New-Tech Lotus Race Engines | The Right Oil Filter for Your Lotus | Custom Lotus ECU Tuning


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post #39 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-20-2017, 01:41 PM
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Sorry, didn't read through the whole thing there...

IPS, just haven't had many to work with. I'd love to get more in the shop. The answer is I'm 99% sure we're good to go with the IPS cars, but I need mule to triple check some things. our car and the others we've had the pleasure to improve are manuals...

Have not even started to crack the transmission behavior, so no with no ETA.

We've used the headers on S cars and have great gains with them over 2bular and obviously stock on the dyno... So yes, they make great gains on both S and NA cars to be sure.

Thanks,

Phil
Would you be interested in holding onto my car for a month or two to develop if I ship it out there?
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post #40 of 44 (permalink) Old 09-21-2017, 11:59 AM
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Went ahead and bought the CAI (Received it today), the rest may have to wait a bit.
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