Engine Sound and Movement - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-05-2017, 04:18 PM Thread Starter
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Engine Sound and Movement

Hi Everyone, been a while since I have been here, but looking for some help. My Elise has developed a vibration when accelerating, I have ruled out lots of things, but now looking at the motor mounts as a potential issue. I have stock mounts on the sides and Innovative Mounts 60A (with about 100k miles). If I recall correctly, when I first installed them there was next to no movement "north to south".

Secondly, I put a gopro to see how much the movement was and then noticed a horrible metallic sound coming from the engine at idle.

Anyone have any thoughts on the 2 issues? See the video here->

Thanks for any guidance

Bradley
06 Solar Yellow Elise BOE Rev400, Silent Touch exhaust w/dcat, CL Brake Pads, DBA 5000 rotors, Nitrons SA, Adjustable Front Bar, BOE Tow Bar, SS Lines w/RBF600, Innovative mounts, ACT XTSS, 4.3:1 LSD Trans, Rear Brake Mod. 150,000+ Miles so far. East Tenn Region SCCA
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-07-2017, 12:01 AM
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Personally speaking, for innovative mounts "north and south" of the motor, your engine moves quite a bit in my opinion. I think you could some how have destroyed a motor mount or one choose to melt on you.

Interested to see what you find. Sorry i couldn't listen to it, family is sleeping.

2005 Lotus Elise Graphite Grey - Salvaged title started the SSM build!!!
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-07-2017, 09:45 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks, I ordered both north/south mounts and removed the rear. It is not broke, but you can see that there has been a lot of movement. Also, removed the serpentine belt and the noise went away... so it is not valve train, a little worried it is the supercharger, but replacing the idler and tensioner pulleys sense it has so many miles on it.

Bradley
06 Solar Yellow Elise BOE Rev400, Silent Touch exhaust w/dcat, CL Brake Pads, DBA 5000 rotors, Nitrons SA, Adjustable Front Bar, BOE Tow Bar, SS Lines w/RBF600, Innovative mounts, ACT XTSS, 4.3:1 LSD Trans, Rear Brake Mod. 150,000+ Miles so far. East Tenn Region SCCA
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-07-2017, 09:36 PM
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I would wonder if it is the front mount actually with how the motor was pitching forward so much.

I just pulled the Serpentine belt off of my 30K motor, and it looks TOAST. So I am trashing it and getting a new one. I would bet that changing pulley's will help alot as well. Specially if they have seen a lot of high rpm use. Keep us updated on how this goes.

And nice AutoX setup...I am going the other F.I route (turbo). I am assuming you are SSM?
I am hoping to have my motor built in the next couple of weeks and start working on hosing, fuel lines, and electrical over the next month or so.

2005 Lotus Elise Graphite Grey - Salvaged title started the SSM build!!!
Maverick ML8 - Other daily
2005 VW Passat Station Wagon TDI (harder to find than the lotus?)
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-08-2017, 04:16 AM
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@EliseAutoXr - I would speculate that you have loose or missing bolts, probably related to the front engine mount. Loss of engine mount fasteners has been reported by others in the past, so itís not unheard of.

Glen

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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-23-2017, 04:50 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all for your thoughts. I replace motor mounts, idler pulley, tensioner, belt. That fixed the loud noise and the motor movement... but vibration still present. I looked it all over for loose or missing bolts, could not find anything. Back to the drawing board .

I was running SSM quite a bit, but the last few years I have been transistioning to track day/night events. I still do an autocross ocassionally, but run in our local open street tire class.

Bradley
06 Solar Yellow Elise BOE Rev400, Silent Touch exhaust w/dcat, CL Brake Pads, DBA 5000 rotors, Nitrons SA, Adjustable Front Bar, BOE Tow Bar, SS Lines w/RBF600, Innovative mounts, ACT XTSS, 4.3:1 LSD Trans, Rear Brake Mod. 150,000+ Miles so far. East Tenn Region SCCA
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-24-2017, 02:02 AM
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Vibration through the steering wheel is present when innovative mounts are used in the front mount location.
It is never recommended to use anything but stock mounts for the sides.
The best solution is a compromise, which is to replace the rear mount only
with 85A. Leave the rest stock....

-Robert
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-24-2017, 02:44 AM
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@EliseAutoXr - I was able to reduce the vibration transmitted by my front and rear Innovative mounts by playing with their position. My goal was to equalize the loads on the front and rear mounts and ensure that neither mount was preloaded to the end of its compliance range.

I tried several different techniques. One was to move the mounts to approximately the center of the play available in the mounting bolts - this didnít really change much. Next, I loosened the front and rear mounting bolts, ran the engine for about 20 seconds at idle up to a few thousand rpm, then shut the engine off and tightened the engine mount fasteners. This worked pretty well - vibration was much reduced over the original setting. Finally, I supported the engine with a few wooden blocks at what I guessed was a neutral position, then loosened and re-tightened the engine mount fasteners. This result was about the same as the second technique.

So if you think vibration is excessive, try playing with the engine mounts a little bit more. My mounts are 60A, and the only noticeable increase in vibration is at a low idle ... my eyeballs get rattled around

Glen
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-24-2017, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepe View Post
Vibration through the steering wheel is present when innovative mounts are used in the front mount location.
It is never recommended to use anything but stock mounts for the sides.
The best solution is a compromise, which is to replace the rear mount only
with 85A. Leave the rest stock....

-Robert
I don't know if I completely agree with this statement. When I was running the innovative mount front/rear I felt more vibration through the chassis, but not necessarily through the steering wheel. The wheel itself was still solid and steady, but just vibrated with the rest of the car. The only time I felt a real vibration through the steering wheel is when one of my wheels were out of balance or if I had dropped a belt in a tire.

If it is chassis vibration, stock mounts with Glen's suggestion for setting them in place is my suggestion. If it is a steering wheel vibration have you had your wheels rebalanced?
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-24-2017, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giantmcm View Post
I don't know if I completely agree with this statement. When I was running the innovative mount front/rear I felt more vibration through the chassis, but not necessarily through the steering wheel. The wheel itself was still solid and steady, but just vibrated with the rest of the car. The only time I felt a real vibration through the steering wheel is when one of my wheels were out of balance or if I had dropped a belt in a tire.

If it is chassis vibration, stock mounts with Glen's suggestion for setting them in place is my suggestion. If it is a steering wheel vibration have you had your wheels rebalanced?
Slight vibration through the wheel is not the same as a a little shaking.
My wheels were Hunter road-force balanced. The wheel is "solid" as you say
but a slight humm,, I guess, is present.
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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-24-2017, 05:20 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the thoughts. I'm used to the normal engine vibration through the mounts. This vibration is different (and new), only happens during acceleration... and just make matters worse it is intermittent. I'm getting to the point where maybe it would be easiest to just ignore it until something breaks or it is obvious (just don't want it to happen at 130MPH on the track). My gut tells me it is related to the new axles, but the manufacture tells me it is not.

Bradley
06 Solar Yellow Elise BOE Rev400, Silent Touch exhaust w/dcat, CL Brake Pads, DBA 5000 rotors, Nitrons SA, Adjustable Front Bar, BOE Tow Bar, SS Lines w/RBF600, Innovative mounts, ACT XTSS, 4.3:1 LSD Trans, Rear Brake Mod. 150,000+ Miles so far. East Tenn Region SCCA
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