Elise vs. Mini Cooper S - Page 2 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #21 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 10:04 AM
Registered User
 
MickOpalak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 5,599
I've driven the Mini, S2000, Elise 111S and my daily driver is a highly modded '99 Miata. All of the cars handle well, in their own respect.

I don't care for the Mini because 1) it's WWD and 2) it's driving position. Feels to me like I'm sitting on bar stool compared to a sports car's position. But if I were forced to get something in the econo/sporty/hatchback class, the Mini S would be it.

The S2000 handles great, but you can tell that it weighs 2900 lbs.

The 111S was great, as to be expected. I expect even greater things out of my Fed Elise with LSS.

2007 Exige S - Krypton Green - VF Stage 2 - RLS Intercooler - Volk TE37s - B&M Shifter - 2bular header & exhaust - Sector111 motorsport engine mounts - stripes - harnesses - Pagid pads - Green air filter
MickOpalak is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #22 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 10:19 AM
Registered User
 
MotorCade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: California
Posts: 2,344
I've driven the Elise 111s and the S2000 on test drives, I own a 93 miata, and my girlfriend recently purchased an 04 Cooper S. My favorites were the Elise, obviously, and the S2000. I was going to purchase an S2000 until I found out about the Elise. The miata is a great handling car, but lacks power in a big way. The Cooper S is a joy to drive. The gearbox is smooth, the seats are comfortable (though it does feel quite different than a sportscar) and the handling is precise. It's the only FWD car that has really allowed me to enjoy driving it. It has better acceleration than my miata, and usable (though tight) passenger seats (or storage space). It's a great car, and is definitely the best bang for the buck in the econobox market, unless maybe you just want straight line speed, in which case get a neon SRT-4 or something. But the MINI is better all around, and it is reasonably quick.

It really is an almost perfect car for daily driver duties. And I can fit it AND the elise in my one car garage, nose to tail.

The s2000 is a better sportscar, but the mini is a better everyday car.

Cade
MotorCade is offline  
post #23 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 11:44 AM
Registered User
 
The Stig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: who's asking?
Posts: 4,253
The "new" mini (to me) is one of the most OVER rated cars out there! Especially if you've ever driven the original Minis. Which were absolutely fabulous! I think the new one is too heavy and too big.

Neil

WTF people?
The Stig is offline  
 
post #24 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 12:08 PM
Registered User
 
NMRJock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 3,577
Quote:
Originally posted by Little Bastard
The "new" mini (to me) is one of the most OVER rated cars out there! Especially if you've ever driven the original Minis. Which were absolutely fabulous! I think the new one is too heavy and too big.

Neil
I've always wanted an original. Unfortunately the hype the new ones brought drove the prices up just as I would have been in position to hunt one down.

Paul Parkanzky
Magnetic Blue with Biscuit Touring, LSS, Starshield
NMRJock is offline  
post #25 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 12:14 PM
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 21
I had 2 of the classic original Mini Cooper S's back in 1965-67 period, and they WERE absolutely awesome cars. I'd love to get my hands on another one, but as has been said, the price on 'em has gotten ridiculous. The "new" MINI doesn't compare to the classics. In fact, I'd compare the classic Mini Coopers of the 1960s more to the Elise... raw performance and handling in a small package, with no creature comforts to speak of.

I love my current MINI, but I'd trade it in a heartbeat for a well restored classic MINI. I think the Elise will bring back some of that same feeling the original Minis had... "catch me if you can" kind of driving in the twisty mountains.
BeerBrewer is offline  
post #26 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:26 PM
Registered User
 
The Stig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: who's asking?
Posts: 4,253
Quote:
Originally posted by BeerBrewer
I had 2 of the classic original Mini Cooper S's back in 1965-67 period, and they WERE absolutely awesome cars. I'd love to get my hands on another one, but as has been said, the price on 'em has gotten ridiculous. The "new" MINI doesn't compare to the classics. In fact, I'd compare the classic Mini Coopers of the 1960s more to the Elise... raw performance and handling in a small package, with no creature comforts to speak of.

I love my current MINI, but I'd trade it in a heartbeat for a well restored classic MINI. I think the Elise will bring back some of that same feeling the original Minis had... "catch me if you can" kind of driving in the twisty mountains.
I want this one...
It's just something about the car...I can't explain it.
Attached Images
 

WTF people?
The Stig is offline  
post #27 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:31 PM
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally posted by Little Bastard
I want this one...
It's just something about the car...I can't explain it.
That is one sweet looking Mini. I want it , too!
BeerBrewer is offline  
post #28 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:32 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,269
I would like to see the 'JC Works' version
go up against the Elise. HP is upped to 200, from 163, and the upgraded improvements do away with all the dead-spots attributed to the 'S'. P.S. - It is a bit pricey at $7,000 installed.
Ridgemanron is offline  
post #29 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:37 PM
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally posted by Ridgemanron
I would like to see the 'JC Works' version
go up against the Elise. HP is upped to 200, from 163, and the upgraded improvements do away with all the dead-spots attributed to the 'S'. P.S. - It is a bit pricey at $7,000 installed.
You can do the same mods aftermarket for roughly $2K. The JCWorks package is a total ripoff... the only thing going for it is that the car maintains its warranty. I've got mine at the 200-205 HP level now, and it makes all the difference in the world. Of course the MINI S weighs in around 2800 lb, so I can only imagine how the Elise will perform at over 800 lb. lighter and only 10 or so less HP.
BeerBrewer is offline  
post #30 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:41 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,269
Quote:
Originally posted by BeerBrewer
You can do the same mods aftermarket for roughly $2K. The JCWorks package is a total ripoff... the only thing going for it is that the car maintains its warranty. I've got mine at the 200-205 HP level now, and it makes all the difference in the world. Of course the MINI S weighs in around 2800 lb, so I can only imagine how the Elise will perform at over 800 lb. lighter and only 10 or so less HP.
The warranty is the thing, though. Will definately affect re-sale value if you do an after-market one.....not to mention you will probably blow your engine while the Works version goes on..and ..on..and on.
Ridgemanron is offline  
post #31 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:42 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,744
My dad bought a New Mini back in 84. It was a very cool little car. But that was then and this is now. To be fair to the new car it is much larger, far more sophisticated, power everything a truly modern car but yet still fun to drive. I think they did a good job. It would be interesting to see performance numbers and specs for the old compared to the new.
Derek is offline  
post #32 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:43 PM
Registered User
 
John Stimson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Posts: 1,480
Quote:
Originally posted by Joetz
Heh. I would buy a car BECAUSE it gets a bad review in consumer reports.
It actually got a very good review in CR, but it got a terrible reliability rating based on the first two years of customer data. The rating isn't surprising given all the complaints I've seen about cracked windshields, squeaks, rattles, leaks, transmission problems, power dropouts, etc...from the first couple of years. There are service bulletins on a number of those issues so I hope that the newer cars (2003+) don't have as many problems...

I've test driven the Elise and MINI Cooper, autocrossed an S2000, and my baseline is a 2001 Miata. I was very impressed with the MINI. The handling is much more responsive than other compact FWD cars. I was running snow tires on my Miata that day, and I'd say that the handling response was just about the same.

On my Elise test drive, I could tell that I was driving a light car with manual steering just because of the feedback I was getting, and there was very little lean. However, there was a bit of lag between steering and turning. I think that there may have been some problems with the car like alignment or tires (it had been all over the US getting beaten on by prospective customers), since the brakes seemed spongy and ineffective. I know that they're non-assisted, but I would expect that to feel extra-firm but responsive to forceful braking...

The S2000 doesn't make its weight apparent. Part of that may be because the S2000 isn't really as heavy as the brochure specs indicate. It just feels to me like a faster Miata with a firmer suspension.

I hope to get a more accurate impression of the Elise when the demo car arrives at SVAG...

2005 S2000 #42as
John Stimson is offline  
post #33 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 01:45 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,269
Quote:
Originally posted by Derek
My dad bought a New Mini back in 84. It was a very cool little car. But that was then and this is now. To be fair to the new car it is much larger, far more sophisticated, power everything a truly modern car but yet still fun to drive. I think they did a good job. It would be interesting to see performance numbers and specs for the old compared to the new.
The convertible ,coming out this fall, looks good. The 'S'
will follow the base Cooper a few months later.
Ridgemanron is offline  
post #34 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:08 PM
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally posted by Ridgemanron
The warranty is the thing, though. Will definately affect re-sale value if you do an after-market one.....not to mention you will probably blow your engine while the Works version goes on..and ..on..and on.
Actually, the engine and supercharger are more than able to handle the mods... MINI's JCW kit uses the same engine but changes out to a polished head and different fins in the supercharger while reducing the pulley. The head truly makes no difference, and the stock supercharger is more than able to handle the reduction pulley. (That comes straight from Eaton, who makes the supercharger.)

So I figured that for a four or five thousand dollar savings, I could easily afford to lose my warranty on the engine and supercharger. AND the likelihood of a totally blown engine is between slim and none anyway, so I've got all the benefits and five grand savings. I've been running the aftermarket mods for 7K miles now, with absolutely no negative impact.

All that said, I still want the Elise! I'll probably keep the MINI as a daily driver.

Quittin' time here... headin' home for a brew!

Cheers!
BeerBrewer is offline  
post #35 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:15 PM
Registered User
 
The Stig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: who's asking?
Posts: 4,253
Quote:
Originally posted by Ridgemanron
I would like to see the 'JC Works' version
go up against the Elise. HP is upped to 200, from 163, and the upgraded improvements do away with all the dead-spots attributed to the 'S'. P.S. - It is a bit pricey at $7,000 installed.
Mini Works vs. Elise. Maybe off the line. But I think the Elise would doninate the Mini on a track especially a tight one. I don't think we are comparing apples to apples. I would think Mini Works vs. Forcus RS would be a good one!

Neil
Attached Images
 

WTF people?
The Stig is offline  
post #36 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:20 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,269
Quote:
Originally posted by Little Bastard
Mini Works vs. Elise. Maybe off the line. But I think the Elise would doninate the Mini on a track especially a tight one. I don't think we are comparing apples to apples. I would think Mini Works vs. Forcus RS would be a good one!

Neil
My money would be on the Elise, against the JCW Mini, even 'off the line'. The Elise would also win on winding roads.
Ridgemanron is offline  
post #37 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:28 PM
Registered User
 
The Stig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: who's asking?
Posts: 4,253
Quote:
Originally posted by Ridgemanron
My money would be on the Elise, against the JCW Mini, even 'off the line'. The Elise would also win on winding roads.
I just looked up the performance specs on the JCW. The 0-62 mph = 6.2 sec. I guess it's the Elise all the way!!!

Plus the mini is front wheel drive. Understeer

WTF people?
The Stig is offline  
post #38 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:31 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,744
Quote:
Originally posted by Little Bastard
Mini Works vs. Elise. Maybe off the line. But I think the Elise would doninate the Mini on a track especially a tight one. I don't think we are comparing apples to apples. I would think Mini Works vs. Forcus RS would be a good one!

Neil
Not even off the line. The JCW Mini does 0-60 in 6.7 seconds. However the regular Cooper S did post impressive slalom numbers:

Cooper S 69.5 Mph
Miata LS 62.7 Mph
Honda S2000 65.9 Mph
Corvette Z06 67.6 Mph
BMW M3 SMG II 68.8 Mph

From the July 03 R&T.
Derek is offline  
post #39 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 02:49 PM
Registered User
 
The Stig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: who's asking?
Posts: 4,253
Quote:
Originally posted by Derek
Not even off the line. The JCW Mini does 0-60 in 6.7 seconds. However the regular Cooper S did post impressive slalom numbers:

Cooper S 69.5 Mph
Miata LS 62.7 Mph
Honda S2000 65.9 Mph
Corvette Z06 67.6 Mph
BMW M3 SMG II 68.8 Mph

From the July 03 R&T.
It beat the Z06 and the M3 = that is pretty impressive! I wonder what the Elise will pull down?

Neil

WTF people?
The Stig is offline  
post #40 of 77 (permalink) Old 03-23-2004, 03:38 PM
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally posted by Derek
My dad bought a New Mini back in 84. It was a very cool little car. But that was then and this is now. To be fair to the new car it is much larger, far more sophisticated, power everything a truly modern car but yet still fun to drive. I think they did a good job. It would be interesting to see performance numbers and specs for the old compared to the new.
They did a great job! You might know that the new MINI was designed by Frank Stephenson while under the direction of BMW Group.

Stephenson did such a good job that he moved on to become the design chief at Ferrari & Maserati. Not a bad gig.

BMW got to keep Chris Bangle. Ugghh.

I like the Cooper S a lot too, but if I'm going to go the hot-hatch route, I'm going to wait until 2007. By then, BMW will have a RWD M2 that will have a normally aspirated 4 cylinder that revs to 9k rpm and produces 250bhp.

I don't think the hatchback version is slated for the U.S. though.

That car should combine the best of the MINI Cooper S, and the S2000. If BMW can keep flame-surfacing to a minimum and fine-tune the I-Drive system, I'd certainly be all over the M2.

Last edited by Hans Stuck; 03-23-2004 at 03:43 PM.
Hans Stuck is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community > Lotus Discussions > Lotus Elise

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome