Mishimoto Sandwich plate and sensors - Page 5 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #81 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-09-2018, 08:00 AM Thread Starter
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Jason, nice setup. We have the same BWR Unikey. I like mine.

Exigegus, I totally agree. I wasn't insinuating one is "better" than the other. Opinions and preferences vary. I like yours. First one I've seen like that. My goal was to know when temp is high enough. After that, I don't pay a whole lot of attention to it. As such, an out-of-the-way solution is what I was going for.

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post #82 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-09-2018, 03:07 PM
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Thanks for the info. I just ordered one from Vivid Racing. $12.75 shipped. Also, where are you guys connecting these sensors to? I have the Mishimoto Sandwich Plate. Pics will help. I noticed on a previous post that a temperature sensor was connected to the Mishimoto Plate. What about the oil PSI sensor? Also, can I purchase a new oil tank that comes with a bung for the temperature sensor instead of connecting it to the Mish sandwich plate? Thanks.
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post #83 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-09-2018, 04:00 PM
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I noticed on a previous post that a temperature sensor was connected to the Mishimoto Plate. What about the oil PSI sensor? Also, can I purchase a new oil tank that comes with a bung for the temperature sensor instead of connecting it to the Mish sandwich plate? Thanks.
If you get one of the aftermarket oil pans you can install the temp sensor in the pan and the pressure sensor in the Mishimoto plate.

https://www.inokinetic.com/lotus/gpan3

"TIG welded 1/8" NPT fitting.
For use with data acquisition sensors & other accessories."
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post #84 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-09-2018, 04:30 PM
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If you plan to install a pressure sensor, DO NOT install it directly to the plate itself. You need to relocate it with a hydraulic hose or else it will crack off in due time.
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post #85 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-09-2018, 07:03 PM
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Great, any other place I could instal a temperature sensor in case I don't buy the oil pan? I'm trying to gather all the info so I can purchase what I need.

I have:

-Oil pressure and temp gauge with senders , wire hardness and hydraulic hose for remote mount the oil press. Thank you KZ3!
-Mishimoto sandwich plate / 200 degrees thermostat.
-2 fittings for the oil lines attachment to the Mishimoto sandwich plate. Thank you Exigegus!

Anything else needed to accomplish this task?

Thanks a million guys!!
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post #86 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 04:09 AM
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Oil temp data with Oil coolers bypassed

Posting this as a request of the OP.

I was able to log some data on my car with both oil coolers bypassed. Just more information related to the cam wiping issue / oil temperature issue.

2006 Elise -
Oil coolers bypassed (Sandwich plate removed, toyota oil filter union installed)

I began logging immediately from a "cold" start. Ambient temp was 76. Oil and water started off a little cooler as the car was sitting in my insulated barn and the temp was cooler in there.
I started getting on the big cam at minute 10. I drove the car hard, think "canyon carving" - but not at the level of lapping at a track. Max oil temp I registered was 230. If I backed off the big cam for just a few seconds the oil temp would drop to 215 - 220 very quickly. My conclusion - for a street car - this is the way to go as the oil gets hot pretty quickly and stays in a nice range - 200 - 230.
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post #87 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 04:36 AM Thread Starter
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If you plan to install a pressure sensor, DO NOT install it directly to the plate itself. You need to relocate it with a hydraulic hose or else it will crack off in due time.
How, exactly, will it crack off?

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post #88 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 06:16 AM
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If you plan to install a pressure sensor, DO NOT install it directly to the plate itself. You need to relocate it with a hydraulic hose or else it will crack off in due time.
How, exactly, will it crack off?

Through vibrations over time. This is a common occurrence if you Google it. Pressure sensors in general due to the heavier design should be relocated.
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post #89 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 12:50 PM
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Through vibrations over time. This is a common occurrence if you Google it. Pressure sensors in general due to the heavier design should be relocated.


Nessal
Thanks for mentioning this. I must have missed it if you mentioned it earlier in this thread. I just mounted my pressure sensor in the mishimoto plate. What type of hydraulic line and where did you get it? Where did you mount the sensor? Thanks.


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post #90 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
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I'd venture to guess it rarely happens. Possible,sure, anything is. Probable?.......doubtful. I've NEVER seem a remotely mounted oil pressure sensor, nor do I believe anyone on the forum has had one crack or vibrate off. If I'm wrong, whoever had one fail on their Elise, speak up.

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post #91 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 03:57 PM
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I'd venture to guess it rarely happens. Possible,sure, anything is. Probable?.......doubtful. I've NEVER seem a remotely mounted oil pressure sensor, nor do I believe anyone on the forum has had one crack or vibrate off. If I'm wrong, whoever had one fail on their Elise, speak up.
I have not had one crack to point of leaking or falling off, but I have had 2 fail before I got smart and attached remotely

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post #92 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-10-2018, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nessal View Post
Through vibrations over time. This is a common occurrence if you Google it. Pressure sensors in general due to the heavier design should be relocated.


Nessal
Thanks for mentioning this. I must have missed it if you mentioned it earlier in this thread. I just mounted my pressure sensor in the mishimoto plate. What type of hydraulic line and where did you get it? Where did you mount the sensor? Thanks.


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They sell kits all over the internet and they are pretty cheap. I have never installed a oil pressure sender without relocating it. In my previous cars, the kit all came with the relocation hose. On this car, I went to my local hydraulic hose and fitting shop and they custom made one for me for 25 bucks or so. I told them I needed a 24" female and male 1/8 npt hose. I ran it up towards the driver's side and wrapped it together with a large rubber hose since rubber transfers less vibration. That is what kills the sensors and can possibly lead to them cracking. I ran a relocation kit on a previous car for 10 years and never had an issue with the sensor malfunctioning or breaking. Your choice on what you want to do. I personally prefer to do things once.
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post #93 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-13-2018, 09:44 AM
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I did the 180 degree Mish plate with another flow thru Mish plate underneath for the temp/pressure sensor ( I did use the BOE upgraded bolt ).
In this manner the oil temp is measured after any circuit cooling enroute to the oil filter and introduction to the crankshaft.....this is, obviously, not oil pan temp.
I usually hover at 195 in normal (warmer Az weather) and on last weeks 100 degree ambient day 200-205.
This is with the coolers and normal system in stock position.....the radiators/coolers are not very efficient imho the cooling simply comes from the amount of oil and the circuit.

These are good intro temps as the oil will warm 20-30 degrees when working....more on a Az hot day. I kept the 180 degree therm due to our hot ass summers. If I lived in a cooler clime I'd go the 200. Technically I still could.

Inexpensive way to keep things in the right heat zone.....
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post #94 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-16-2018, 06:22 AM
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More data with oil coolers bypassed

One more chart with Oil coolers bypassed on my 2006 Elise. Just street cruising this time. Ambient temp 76. Wanted to verify that oil temps do not continue to creep up with the oil coolers completed bypassed. Started getting on the big cam at minute 10, used sporadically until minute 13, then did several 0-100 runs shifting at 8000 rpm. Then cruised at 65 from minute 15-18. As you can see from the data, the oil temp does rise as you get on the big cam at high rpm, but it quickly returns to match the ~coolant temperature at ~194 steady state. For the street, should be just fine. I will eventually go with the mishimoto sandwich plate and the 200 degree thermostat since I plan to track the car a little from time to time.
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post #95 of 127 (permalink) Old 05-16-2018, 05:57 PM
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Family man....strangely my stock oil cooler set up with the Mish plate 180 also generally runs 190/195 unless a very hot day and then 200/205. Easily hit 210 if goosing it a bit.

I'd try the 180 therm at the track since you will be running hard...you should see 220/230 easily and that is 'entry' oil temp hitting the crank ...that means about 250/260 degrees or more in your top end.....there is no need for hotter I'd think. I also think the 200 in a cooler clime would be more street applicable and not for the track.

I was thinking about trying the 200 degree simply to try it....easy change out.
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post #96 of 127 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 03:11 AM
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I am planning to install the mishimoto plate for temp only. Have other kit (from MonkeyWrench) to run a pressure gauge off the location where the stock pressure sensor is (will use that to run both the pressure gauge and the stock oil light.

1974 Europa Twin Cam (gone but not forgotten)
1971 Europa S2 (owned but two months; flipped to raise funds to fill gap in college tuition)
35 years of restraint (including an Odyssey with 13 cupholders)
2005 Elise (magnetic blue), starshield, chin guards, Penske nonajustable shocks (BWR), Mishimoto sandwich plate, AEM oil temp and pressure gauges, third brake light flasher, Larini Group B silencer, Sector 111 DSBrace
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post #97 of 127 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 03:25 AM
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And not to sound like a marketing arm for MonkeyWrench (I am not), they (and I am sure others) have a replacement drain plug for the stock pan that provides a place to hook up a temp sensor. (You will need a deep socket to pull the plug as modified when changing oil.) That was actually my plan as I was under the impression that the pan is the ideal location. That was last Summer's project that became this Summer's! Now that I have the Mishimoto plate too (and the "fixings" from ExigeGus, for which I thank him), the project got a bit bigger.

There are some videos here of how much the engine vibrates when it is running. I think in the section looking at the aftermarket deck lid supports that attach to the block. It moves so much that one would think that anything with any amount of weight attached to the block is going to generate a lot of stress on the threaded part. So I'll run a line to a remote location.

1974 Europa Twin Cam (gone but not forgotten)
1971 Europa S2 (owned but two months; flipped to raise funds to fill gap in college tuition)
35 years of restraint (including an Odyssey with 13 cupholders)
2005 Elise (magnetic blue), starshield, chin guards, Penske nonajustable shocks (BWR), Mishimoto sandwich plate, AEM oil temp and pressure gauges, third brake light flasher, Larini Group B silencer, Sector 111 DSBrace
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post #98 of 127 (permalink) Old 06-16-2018, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
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I am planning to install the mishimoto plate for temp only. Have other kit (from MonkeyWrench) to run a pressure gauge off the location where the stock pressure sensor is (will use that to run both the pressure gauge and the stock oil light.
Hi, I'm planning on doing the same. Can you post a link of the part from Monkey Wrench? Thanks.
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post #99 of 127 (permalink) Old 06-18-2018, 04:50 AM
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I can confirm tomorrow after I check my receipts at home, but looking at their website, I am pretty sure the part for the oil temp is "MWR oil temperature sensor adapter 121.25mm 1/8 NPT", which costs $15.00. Their SKU is: MWR-901435. I have AEM gauges and the 1/8 NPT sensor for that fit perfectly. I used a little Teflon tape on it. Seems like a simple and elegant solution for those of us who plan to keep the stock pan but want to get the temp from there.

I think your actual question is about the oil pressure. I have a lot more parts to run the stock oil pressure warning light and AEM oil pressure gauge off the stock sensor pick up on the block, due to the need to convert the threads back and forth (the T fitting to connect the feed line to the gauge and stock sensor will be remote from the block). MWR had a complete kit for that, but I think I still had to pick up one additional adaptor elsewhere. I do not think they list the kit on their website, but if you email [email protected], they will help you out. I dealt with Matt at the time who added it to my order as an "additional charge item" at $39. I am sure the male fitting at the end of the braided line furthest from the T is BPT. But the T itself has three female NPT. I expressed concern to Matt that the stock idiot light sensor was BPT and might not fit well in the NPT in the T. He thought it would be ok (and based on a post by Tim Mullen from some years ago, they are indeed very close), but to be careful I separately acquired an adaptor for that (found it on Amazon for just a few dollars). Haven't hooked up any of that yet so jury is still out, but the kit seemed to be of all high quality materials.

I also installed their replacement oil filter union upgrade (SKU: MWR-500121 at $39), which seems much more robust than the stock.

Let us know how it goes.


Kevin

1974 Europa Twin Cam (gone but not forgotten)
1971 Europa S2 (owned but two months; flipped to raise funds to fill gap in college tuition)
35 years of restraint (including an Odyssey with 13 cupholders)
2005 Elise (magnetic blue), starshield, chin guards, Penske nonajustable shocks (BWR), Mishimoto sandwich plate, AEM oil temp and pressure gauges, third brake light flasher, Larini Group B silencer, Sector 111 DSBrace
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post #100 of 127 (permalink) Old 06-18-2018, 04:55 AM
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I would use the BSP to NPT adapter, they are available and prevent leaks. For electric gauges, teflon tape can give you trouble with accuracy.
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