SOS Wheel Lug and Hub Stripped!! - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 06:16 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
dviolet8981's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 51
SOS Wheel Lug and Hub Stripped!!

Hey all,

Went to put the driver side rear wheel back on the car and 3/4 lugs went into their respective holes just fine but the 4th ended up stripping itself and I think the hub itself as well (may or may not have put a little frustrated energy into it...&#x1f612
Here are some decent pictures, can any of you confirm what I’m thinking and if so where I might be able to get a new wheel hub?

And yes, I learned my lesson about not just bucking up and getting wheel studs. Will be #1 on the list once I get this issue sorted out.
Attached Images
       
dviolet8981 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 06:31 PM
Registered User
 
InfernoLotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 698
Garage
I'm not sure all will agree with me and I will probably get heat for saying this but I would get a tap to clean out the hub threads before investing in a new hub, or at least to tide you over until the new one arrives. You may be able to use your existing hub if you get the stud kit because they are inserted from the back side. Good luck!

2005 Chrome Orange Elise, BWR supercharger, TR Motorsport F1 rims and R888s, Nitron NTR40 Single Adjustables with Eibach springs,Sector 111 308BBL brakes, BWR Silent Touch exhaust, CF side scoops, front splitter, and engine cover.
Central Florida
InfernoLotus is online now  
post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 02:15 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
dviolet8981's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by InfernoLotus View Post
I'm not sure all will agree with me and I will probably get heat for saying this but I would get a tap to clean out the hub threads before investing in a new hub, or at least to tide you over until the new one arrives. You may be able to use your existing hub if you get the stud kit because they are inserted from the back side. Good luck!
How do you get access to go in from the back side of the hub with the studs?
dviolet8981 is offline  
 
post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 03:42 AM
Registered User
 
PeteB37's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 227
You could always helicoil it:


PeteB37 is offline  
post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 05:29 AM
Registered User
 
kfennell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by InfernoLotus View Post
I'm not sure all will agree with me and I will probably get heat for saying this but I would get a tap to clean out the hub threads before investing in a new hub, or at least to tide you over until the new one arrives. You may be able to use your existing hub if you get the stud kit because they are inserted from the back side. Good luck!
That is not correct, elige hub studs are threaded and insert the same as the OEM hardware.

You can probably tap that hole and see what it looks like. If it isn't great get a new hub from MWR their QRP hub is great. About $160 and pretty easy to change, except since that is the rear you will need to remove the toe link, and upper hub mount probably to get it out and you need a 32? mm socket to get the nut off.

2007 Exige S with almost every track mod...
kfennell is online now  
post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 05:33 AM
Registered User
 
Jetblast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Central Iowa
Posts: 118
Garage
Studs on these types of hubs screw in from the front and are not pressed in from the rear like most non-wheel bolt hubs. Normally I'd say that running a tap through the hole would repair the threads and make it better, but it's hard to see how much damage there is and how many threads are still viable to hold a load.

The engineering rule of thumb for thread engagement (at a minimum): thread engagement in a steel member should be equal to or greater than one full diameter of the bolt and be of comparable strength (i.e. if the screw is ¼” diameter, the thread engagement needs to be a minimum of ¼”). When designing bolted joints, when possible, I typically spec engagement depth to be 1.5 times the bolt diameter. With a wheel hub you are limited by the thickness of the hub which is only 0.50” at the threaded portion on the Lotus, the wheel bolt/stud is 0.4375” which leaves you painfully little room for thread damage.

Repairing the threads with an insert like a Heli-coil is an option, I would only consider this if you replaced the wheel bolts with studs, but I'd still be a little hesitant due to the thickness of the hub; a Heli-coil needs one full diameter of engagement but since it is bigger in diameter you would need a thicker hub to attain that.

If it were mine, I’d replace the hub and purchase a quality set of wheel studs and nuts.

2005 Ardent Red Elise, Gut Sport wing & splitter, custom diffuser, Sector111: DSBrace, gPan3, subStuffy2, Larini Sport muffler, decat pipe, Schroth Racing 5 pts, wheel studs, Team Dynamics 1.2 with Hoosier A6s, Koldflash 200 ECU flash, BOE rear clam hinge, BC Racing single adjustables, Hawk pads, SS Brake Lines, HID lights, custom tail and high mount brake light...and much more...
Jetblast is online now  
post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 12:29 PM
Registered User
 
InfernoLotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 698
Garage
I now agree with all above comments. My mistake, I thought the studs came in from the back. Now that I look at the kits available I see that I was wrong.

2005 Chrome Orange Elise, BWR supercharger, TR Motorsport F1 rims and R888s, Nitron NTR40 Single Adjustables with Eibach springs,Sector 111 308BBL brakes, BWR Silent Touch exhaust, CF side scoops, front splitter, and engine cover.
Central Florida
InfernoLotus is online now  
post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 12:59 PM
Addict
 
LostPawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 1,192
Garage
If it were me, I'd replace the hub. Think there might have been one listed recently in the for sale section. A couple vendors sell these and they are not expensive or hard to replace. There is a good bit of disassembly required as kfennell pointed out but not complicated. Depending on your level of frustration that caused this I'm not sure studs would have saved you, how hard did you wrench on that?
LostPawn is online now  
post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 02:33 PM
glb
Registered User
 
glb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chester, NJ
Posts: 11,187
Quote:
Originally Posted by dviolet8981 View Post
Hey all,

Went to put the driver side rear wheel back on the car and 3/4 lugs went into their respective holes just fine but the 4th ended up stripping itself and I think the hub itself as well (may or may not have put a little frustrated energy into it...&#x1f612
Here are some decent pictures, can any of you confirm what I’m thinking and if so where I might be able to get a new wheel hub?

And yes, I learned my lesson about not just bucking up and getting wheel studs. Will be #1 on the list once I get this issue sorted out.
Who'd put the wheels on last?

Do/did you use a TQ wrench?

Bolts don't normally "strip themselves" and we can generally feel wrong threading quickly and easily.

05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

Driving Tips-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...art-1-a-49665/
Moss Emergency Line-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...cy-line-36631/
Bleeding Brakes- https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...-brakes-241138
glb is offline  
post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-27-2019, 07:07 PM
The Enforcer
 
oldmansan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Los Alamitos, CA
Posts: 6,239
Regardless of who is to blame for the damage, the damage looks pretty bad. Kind of hard to tell in the pictures, but what little I can see looks fugly. I think to be safe, you should replace the hub and go with studs.

I bought my studs/nuts from Blackwatch Racing and they're ARP forged. They have less-expensive standard studs/nuts as well.

San

#8 Metric Allen Key, Plastic Carpet Buttons
oldmansan is online now  
post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 03:10 AM
Registered User
 
Jetblast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Central Iowa
Posts: 118
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmansan View Post
I bought my studs/nuts from Blackwatch Racing and they're ARP forged. They have less-expensive standard studs/nuts as well.

San
Originally I replaced my wheel bolts with standard non-forged studs (because hey, it's a street car, not a race car), but when I broke two studs on the same wheel during my next autocross event I spent the extra money and went with a set of forged studs. I think the 4x100 lug spacing is just a little too small for the leverage put on them by this car in some situations. Just my experience.

2005 Ardent Red Elise, Gut Sport wing & splitter, custom diffuser, Sector111: DSBrace, gPan3, subStuffy2, Larini Sport muffler, decat pipe, Schroth Racing 5 pts, wheel studs, Team Dynamics 1.2 with Hoosier A6s, Koldflash 200 ECU flash, BOE rear clam hinge, BC Racing single adjustables, Hawk pads, SS Brake Lines, HID lights, custom tail and high mount brake light...and much more...
Jetblast is online now  
post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 04:57 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: massachusetts
Posts: 2,083
doesn't the wheel bearing come with the hub attached?

pretty straightforward
exigegus is offline  
post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 06:16 AM
Addict
 
LostPawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 1,192
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by exigegus View Post
doesn't the wheel bearing come with the hub attached?

pretty straightforward
You can buy them already assembled and it's cheap enough to not want to mess with having to press the bearing out and a new one in.
LostPawn is online now  
post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 09:36 AM
glb
Registered User
 
glb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chester, NJ
Posts: 11,187
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmansan View Post
Regardless of who is to blame for the damage, the damage looks pretty bad. Kind of hard to tell in the pictures, but what little I can see looks fugly. I think to be safe, you should replace the hub and go with studs.

I bought my studs/nuts from Blackwatch Racing and they're ARP forged. They have less-expensive standard studs/nuts as well.

San
San,

I try to get people to figure out how they ended up in trouble. This seems necessary with some newer (possibly younger) members.

One guy drove into a "puddle" so deep, his cabin flooded. I asked if he looked for alternative courses. He did not answer.

Another had a battery fail prematurely. I guessed it wasn't a smart charger; just constant.

So, I asked. No answer.

When ppl search these threads in future, these are points the readers should know.

You and I know that when begin threading a fastener in, it feels much different if it's cross threaded.

I don't know for sure, but it may have been 40 years since I broke a bolt and X-threaded anything. I even use a 1/4" drive air ratchet on the Elise belly pan fasteners and have yet to break any part of the assemblies.

FEEL is extremely important. I seem to remember the tech guru for BMW CCA tell
those complaining about downshifting and getting 2nd gear while trying for 4th: They feel awfully different!!

signed,

The Spirit of Relentless Truth

George Metesky

05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

Driving Tips-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...art-1-a-49665/
Moss Emergency Line-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...cy-line-36631/
Bleeding Brakes- https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...-brakes-241138
glb is offline  
post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 02:15 PM
The Enforcer
 
oldmansan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Los Alamitos, CA
Posts: 6,239
Quote:
Originally Posted by glb View Post
San,

I try to get people to figure out how they ended up in trouble. This seems necessary with some newer (possibly younger) members.

One guy drove into a "puddle" so deep, his cabin flooded. I asked if he looked for alternative courses. He did not answer.

Another had a battery fail prematurely. I guessed it wasn't a smart charger; just constant.

So, I asked. No answer.

When ppl search these threads in future, these are points the readers should know.

You and I know that when begin threading a fastener in, it feels much different if it's cross threaded.

I don't know for sure, but it may have been 40 years since I broke a bolt and X-threaded anything. I even use a 1/4" drive air ratchet on the Elise belly pan fasteners and have yet to break any part of the assemblies.

FEEL is extremely important. I seem to remember the tech guru for BMW CCA tell
those complaining about downshifting and getting 2nd gear while trying for 4th: They feel awfully different!!

signed,

The Spirit of Relentless Truth

George Metesky
The OP probably already feels bad enough about the damage. Perhaps you're not getting answers to questions you pose because members feel you're being condescending, or maybe just because they aren't obligated to.

I said "Regardless of who's to blame for the damage" as the OP didn't imply it was someone else, and it wasn't important, as the damge is done. I was just giving my advice of what I would do, and where he could find studs/nuts. @Jetblast gave some good advice concerning "normal" studs breaking. I'm glad I opted for the forged ARP studs/nuts and that was valuable input.

I'm not sure how anything you posted here is going to help someone in the future. I'm sure you meant well, but I really didn't see any advice given. The Mad Bomber bit doesn't make any sense to me, but perhaps I'm missing something.

Sorry for the hijack OP.

San

#8 Metric Allen Key, Plastic Carpet Buttons
oldmansan is online now  
post #16 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-28-2019, 05:47 PM
glb
Registered User
 
glb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chester, NJ
Posts: 11,187
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmansan View Post
The OP probably already feels bad enough about the damage. Perhaps you're not getting answers to questions you pose because members feel you're being condescending, or maybe just because they aren't obligated to.

I said "Regardless of who's to blame for the damage" as the OP didn't imply it was someone else, and it wasn't important, as the damge is done. I was just giving my advice of what I would do, and where he could find studs/nuts. @Jetblast gave some good advice concerning "normal" studs breaking. I'm glad I opted for the forged ARP studs/nuts and that was valuable input.

I'm not sure how anything you posted here is going to help someone in the future. I'm sure you meant well, but I really didn't see any advice given. The Mad Bomber bit doesn't make any sense to me, but perhaps I'm missing something.

Sorry for the hijack OP.

San
Did you know who George was?

Anyone who reads this will see

1. that Tq wrenches are good tools.

2. That you can feel when mis-threading a fastener.

3. We have to use smart chargers, not the cheap constant-on crap.

There are not bad....

g

05 elise (BOE Rev300 supercharged, SSRs, shift tower mods, Multivex; HID hi/low beams); 05 Corolla XRS. Past '72 Elan Sprint (I restored), Lotus 7 w/X-flow, TT Supra, Bugeye Sprite, BMW 2002 & 2002tii, '65 GTO.

Driving Tips-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...art-1-a-49665/
Moss Emergency Line-https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...cy-line-36631/
Bleeding Brakes- https://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f10...-brakes-241138

Last edited by glb; 07-14-2019 at 03:41 PM.
glb is offline  
post #17 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-14-2019, 06:05 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
dviolet8981's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 51
All,

Thank you everyone for the post and responses. Sorry it took me so long to respond back on this post but I'm always running around doing something. That and I had a big long post typed out on the mobile version and for some reason LT wouldn't let me post and it kept saving to drafts. ANYWAYS:

Going to to buy a new rear hub from MWR and be done with it in the AM along with a new shift cable. That bad boy snapped when I was trying to fine tune the LETSLA I just installed a couple weeks ago, but that's a whole other issue I wasn't entirely responsible for.
dviolet8981 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community > Lotus Discussions > Lotus Elise

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome