Starting the Rebuild Process - 06 Elise - Page 7 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #121 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-03-2018, 09:21 PM
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Wow good, or wow bad??
Wow good. I feel lazy and old beyond my years. My ambition tomorrow is maybe to wash my truck and pick up around the house? Very impressive and I know you feel a lot better about your work area as well, right?

I am not a fan of loud colors, but that color is fantastic. Not obnoxiously bright, but flashy and beautiful in a sort of subtle way IMHO. It really transforms the car. It's so mesmerizing you almost forget what car you're looking at.

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post #122 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-04-2018, 04:24 AM Thread Starter
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Wow good. I feel lazy and old beyond my years. My ambition tomorrow is maybe to wash my truck and pick up around the house? Very impressive and I know you feel a lot better about your work area as well, right?

I am not a fan of loud colors, but that color is fantastic. Not obnoxiously bright, but flashy and beautiful in a sort of subtle way IMHO. It really transforms the car. It's so mesmerizing you almost forget what car you're looking at.

San
Thanks San,

The summer is short in New England and I'm a bit hell bent on getting this car on the road before missing out further.
The Volcano orange in the shade is actually a rather dark burnt orange, similar to the lotus burnt orange, but when the sun hits it, it just explodes with gold. I think we've actually nailed the static color of volcano, but we need to load it with more highly reflective pearl. We're already using literally the best pearl available in the world as far as we know which is Xyrelic.

I'm also going to be making all of the other trim and wheels satin black, along with carbon fiber touches, to create some contrast.

The car is going to the painter this weekend, all I need to do is address those 2 small areas, then it's just a matter of reinsalling the trim, grills, and interior.
Keeping fingers crossed that I'll be driving it fully done next week
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post #123 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-05-2018, 05:12 PM Thread Starter
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Got finsihed with those 2 problem fiberglass areas. This was really the first time that I had to reschape a complex curve rather than just fix something that was cracked, but I just kept at it and I have videos of the entire process actually, which hopefully we can turn into sticky material for fiberglass repair here on the board, because if you own one of these cars it should be pre-requisite, because based on how thin and flimsy all of the panels on these cars are, you're bound to crack one at some point, and fiberglass repair is no harder than paper-mache.

Reshaping something is a bit tougher, so the process in this video would be more than anyone needs.

The almost finished product for that point that was sticking out at the end of the front clam (where it meets the door)



and Primered



Mounted in Place:



The rear fender, I actually just shaved down to match the body line of the rocker panel, and you can't even notice it's thinner there:




Just had to take her out for a drive when I was done mounting and aligning the body panels:
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post #124 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 05:33 AM Thread Starter
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Well, the heavy lifting is over, dropped it off at the painter's for AutoFlex.
I told him I don't want to see updates or pictures, NOTHIN until I see it in person.

He's likely spraying it today, and I'll be picking it up in another day or two to let the paint cure a bit:





Painter teased me with this vid:
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post #125 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 07:16 AM
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I love this project, and the paint color!

Given that you had everything disassembled, would it have been easier to paint the parts if you had delivered them to him and painted them before reassembly? What am I missing here?
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post #126 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 07:38 AM Thread Starter
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I love this project, and the paint color!

Given that you had everything disassembled, would it have been easier to paint the parts if you had delivered them to him and painted them before reassembly? What am I missing here?
In a non metalic paint job, yes definately, but when you shoot pearl the pearl mixes around in the pot and you can get slightly different concentrations at each moment, same with candy.

This is a pearl + Candy affair so as those componets are moving around in the pot, the concentrations are going to change ever so slightly over time, so when they spray they car they put all the panels in place so that if theres slight variation, panels next to each other are the most similar.

If they mix up a batch, spray some of the panels, then a week later mix up a new batch and spray the panel next to it, they may not match perfectly. So in this case puting it all together and spraying it all in one shot is the best.
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post #127 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 07:55 AM
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Excited to see pics after paint! Awesome project!

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post #128 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 05:56 AM Thread Starter
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Sorry guys, volcano orange isn't happening.... I was up all night last night texting back and forth with the painter.
Through a series of incredibly hard to swallow **** ups the car somehow became black again, see below:





Basically he finished prepping and masking the car yesterday, then autflex takes about 10 coats of base coat to build up enough thickness to be peelable, then you start puting your color down. So he starts spraying the pearls, and they're not mixing correctly with the Autoflex, so they're coming out blotchy.
So he says that he should have shot some samples in autoflex, turned out he shot the samples in regular paint and never actually tried these very fine pearls in autoflex, and he never considered that they'd be an issue.
He tries to put the candy over the pearl, to see if the blotchiness would be hidden, it's not, in fact some how magically in an incredible stroke of terrible luck he starts seeing red lines in the candy.

Well it turns out that the sharpie I used to mark up the panels when I was finish prepping it. That red sharpie he says he took off with solvent before starting painting so there was no more red, and through all 10 coats of basecoat it never showed, never showed in the pearl, but once the candy went on it showed back up somehow. Not only that but the orange didn't look right at all... it looked very pale/bright and tangerine colored. Not burnt at all, extremely tacky.

I was incredibly shocked, and mostly in shock.... for lack of a better description for how months of work could go wrong so quickly.
This exchange btw happened all at midnight or later, so I was staying up trying to come up with a plan, and basically he said if we didn't clear over the black base coat it would be extremely difficult to peel so he just cleared over the black base coat, and here we are now.

Now I was in shock, but I wasn't mad until he sent me a text basically saying it wasn't anyones fault but he feels bad so he'll give me $250 off the price.
Now I know this is going to end really bad, because he's not even aware of how much he ****ed up.

I sent him my feedback this morning and basically said if thats the way the car's going to be delivered, I'm not even going to spend another minute puting the rest of the trim back on because this is all getting peeled off immediately, and I'm not going to be the one spending tens of hours trying to get this **** off.

So I guess I'm looking for some advice on how to proceed, especially if he's a hard ass and demands money and doesn't want to give the car up.
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post #129 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 06:24 AM
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what color did the painter agree to paint the car when you took it to him? who made the decision to paint it black?

If the car isn't the color that was agreed it would be painted when you got it back from the painter - and you didn't make the decision for it to be painted black - then I would argue that you don't owe any money since the service for which you were going to pay for hasn't been provided. As you said, the painter made the mistake and even admitted to it - then I would feel that is $$ out of their pocket, not yours.

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post #130 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 06:45 AM Thread Starter
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what color did the painter agree to paint the car when you took it to him? who made the decision to paint it black?

If the car isn't the color that was agreed it would be painted when you got it back from the painter - and you didn't make the decision for it to be painted black - then I would argue that you don't owe any money since the service for which you were going to pay for hasn't been provided. As you said, the painter made the mistake and even admitted to it - then I would feel that is $$ out of their pocket, not yours.
Here's where he may have pulled a fast one on me. He said I can't peel it the way it is (when it was just black basecoat), like it would be hard as hell to peel. We really need to put clear on it to make it peelable.
This was one of the only phone conversations we had, and he said the car needs to be out of the shop by 6am the next day when his boss gets in.

So the plan was to clear it so if we decided to peel it, it would be more manegable.

Today I just called Dipyourcar.com to see what they would say. Told them about the fact that the pearls weren't mixing right, and they said they've never had a problem with pearls mixing (but that's also what you'd expect them to say so that was no surprise, and they weren't aware of the type of pearl we were using). But what surprised me is that they said we could have just as easily peeled it when it was just base coat (with no clear) and it would have left our options open, we could have sprayed any color right over it, and maybe saved it.
Now that we cleared it, we can't put anything over it, and if we have trouble with removing it, the dip disolver won't work on it any longer because that clear is obviously very chemically resistant.
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post #131 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 06:46 AM
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At this point in the summer, my peanut gallery comment is that "black looks good, just drive it." the paint will wear anyway and you'll get to change it then. for now, why not 'make lemonade' out of these lemons? driving the car is more fun than looking at it anyway.

also, a tricky question about trying to go the other way and play hardball: does a paint shop have a mechanics lein for their work? if so, then the painful route of litigation may be necessary to get out of paying for bad work. I'm just guessing, though.

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post #132 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 06:51 AM
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Can you post pics of the orange paint on the car/the issues to which he was referring?

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post #133 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 08:48 AM
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I am so sorry to hear this. I completely empathize. I am so tired of paying other people to work on my car. Plus I am tired of shops not responding or saying they do not have the time. The last few months have been diy projects and cleaning up other people’s mess. Hopefully things work out for you.
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post #134 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 10:40 AM Thread Starter
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Can you post pics of the orange paint on the car/the issues to which he was referring?
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I am so sorry to hear this. I completely empathize. I am so tired of paying other people to work on my car. Plus I am tired of shops not responding or saying they do not have the time. The last few months have been diy projects and cleaning up other people’s mess. Hopefully things work out for you.
Thanks guys, I'll be honest I have a pretty high appetite for pain and displeasure, called hard work to get things done myself when everything else fails, but I'm mourning this one a bit.
Called my buddy who owns an autobody shop, he said because this guy is someone doing work on the side getting money out of him will be basically impossible, which I figured anyway, even if he had his own shop.

Here's the photos of the car when the pearl went down, you can see it's a bit blotchy:







He sent me this photo highlighting the largest problem area:


And then when he put the candy down,
Like I said the color wasn't right, and he sent a video showing the red sharpie coming through the candy:


Vid of the sharpie showing



When the car was in black base coat it looked best and I confirmed with the manufacturer that I could technically put matte top coat over the gloss, but no guarantees it'll go back to how it looked.

Given that from these photos the black looks as good or better than factory paint... I don't think I'll touch it.
Also he finally agreed to wipe out the second half of payment. So I got a black autoflex job for 1k or the cost of the materials only. Picking up the car tonight, and you could tell he sent me some photos of the car to help make me feel a bit better:




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post #135 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 11:32 AM
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Sorry that you had to deal with the last minute color change! Are you going to keep it black or try again with a different painter?

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post #136 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 11:38 AM Thread Starter
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Sorry that you had to deal with the last minute color change! Are you going to keep it black or try again with a different painter?
The summer is over in about 2 months here in New England, so for now I'm going to do nothing and drive it the rest of the summer. Then come winter, figure it out
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post #137 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 11:46 AM
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well, glad to hear it sounds like you two worked out something that you can hopefully be at peace with... she is a beautiful car in the black

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post #138 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 07:29 PM Thread Starter
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They were good pics, but this autoflex looks like a maaco paint job, and he sprayed EVERYTHING. So this crap is going to need to be pulled from everywhere.
If this turns out to be a nightmare to pull off I'm going to shoot myself in the face
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post #139 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-12-2018, 06:44 PM Thread Starter
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So I went to go start peeling it and the worst case scenario happened. This is exactly why you get it professionally installed, which is what I supposedly did, yet....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mg7X...?v=Mg7XEl3r-3k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85Rm...?v=85RmeDSnwrY

So I had a bit of a meltdown honestly. And after a couple days I decided to see what a shop would charge to remove it. Only $3,000-$5,000. Thats when the thought of a lawsuit really came to mind, and I let the guy know that I was looking at big bills and luckily before I could make the threat, he offered to remove it.

So now I need to pull the car apart again, and we'll be removing it in a week or two. I would wait until winter to remove it because it looks good from 10 feet but I don't want him to dissapear.

I need to step away from it for a while for sure... I'm getting the sense the car is actually cursed, so I'm not kidding I might have it blessed. I really wish that was a joke, but I don't want to get rid of it.
I'm thinking the orange I'm going after is so particular and difficult I'm worried that the chances are very high that if anyone else does it, they'll miss the mark, and if you miss the mark a bit on this color it would look terrible.

That being said I can't imagine what else I'd paint it.
I did look at the Viper Stryker Orange as well which does have a Paint code we could get a hold of, but at 15K from the factory, even though most of that is labor, I'm sure the materials are at least several thousand alone. Not the type of paint you want to screw up and have to do twice.

Stryker orange:



The other color was carndy burnt orange from suzuki. thi one is pretty cheap at least:



Those are the only other orange options I found, open to ideas on other colors
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post #140 of 214 (permalink) Old 07-12-2018, 07:38 PM
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Sorry to hear about your troubles. Was looking forward to seeing it all in person at some point. What do you think of the Lotus "Signature Orange"...you can see the gallery here:

Exige S Club Racer | LCI Limited

Video here:


And are you painting this time around? Or still autoflex?

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