Exotic Car Owner's Code of Conduct - Page 7 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #121 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-11-2013, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by addertooth View Post
When asked how much does it cost I usually spin a yarn. Most people who ask are middle income working class folks. The yarn goes something like this:
When these cars came out a they were a bit high, beyond what I would spend for a toy. But once the warranty expires many of the original owners unload the car when they realize an oil change is going to cost them 200 bucks, and they wonder how much it will cost them to fix something if it breaks. Typically the original owners become motivated sellers, and you can pick a used one (out of warranty) cheap. At the time of purchase I could have got a new toyota camry for about the same price, but eventually decided a used Lotus would be more fun.
I like this reply a lot and may go with it or some variation thereof.

Of course my Esprit gets this quetion a lot. Im sure they are bummed out when they find out its NOT Italian but thats usually followed up by the cost factor. I always try to say that prices are all over the place since the best cars are way more than run of the mill jalopies. But uiltimately, I point out that it wasnt that expensive or a bum like me wouldnt have one. Two year old Toyota Sienna money. I want people to understand that I bought the car because I love it, not because it makes me look cool - Like those Lambo guys

Page 65, Section LD - what ya wanna know?
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post #122 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 12:57 PM
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I don't think its a polite question to ask and on top of that it just takes away from the car.

its like when a magician tells you how he performed a trick, it just becomes meh and loses its allure.
Takes away from the car? To tell the truth that it's not all that expensive and really very attainable for the majority of the population? I think that increases the allure rather than pretend it is something that it is not.

It's like a whore acting like an upper class lady of society... who you trying to fool? (BTW, hated Pretty Woman, stupidest movie, barely salvaged by the Lotus)

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If someone asks me this as the first (and likely only) question, it bothers me. They aren't seeing a fun car, they are seeing an expensive 'thing'.

Maybe it makes me sound a bit like a d1ck, but when rude people ask me the price question, I usually say something like...

"It's sort of rude to ask people that question. It's like someone asking you how big your wifes boobs are. You might give an answer. You might lie. But either way, you will probably feel uncomfortable that someone asked you a question like that."
If you feel that way, why even react? Just walk away and be better off. It will work better for everyone that you don't continue the interaction and make two mad people instead of just one.

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according to this "ultimate car page" i scored a 7 and am not an exotic.

Exotic Cars The Defining Characteristics - Ultimatecarpage.com forums
You were generous.

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Originally Posted by squidward View Post
Nice! Good job on your response.. This has happened to me countless times. Just like you ... I just kinda have to just be nice about it. But if they were laying across the car like that, I wouldn't not hesitate to "educate" them on how to behave with other people's cars. How they respond would dictate my next move. If they are the "oh---sorry" type, I'd continue being nice. If they responded negatively, I wouldn't care much about them anyway.
I am not a snob but I don't like people touching my stuff. It's just not done. I don't go around grabbing other people's wallet or phone or private parts either. Sorry or not, I don't know anyone who would be okay with it. At least ask... sheesh.

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post #123 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 03:40 PM
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Posting here as not to further derail the other thread.

In regards to the price question being considered rude/taboo/offensive/whatever:

What is considered offensive or rude can only be only defined by what you choose (one way or another) to be offended by and is really a result of your own projection of the situation.

It all stems from a point of personal insecurity - ie. If I tell them how much I paid for the car, or how much I make, what will they think of me? What that threshold is, is different for different people.

Some people like myself have no problem discussing personal income, what i have paid for things etc. Simply because I am not emotionally effected either way by what the other person will think about me (or what i perceive they would think) by giving them an honest answer.

There are a lot of people out there who are just curious. Sure you can look it up on the internet later, but if they are asking why not give them an honest answer?

Even if they are coming from the point of intentionally being rude towards you, what does it hurt to be polite and honest? If you take the defensive stance, you're only going to give the reaction that they are fishing for.

After all of that, if you are still personally uncomfortable answering their questions truthfully, then tell them that you are uncomfortable answering.

tl;dr: any perceived rudeness or offensiveness is a direct result of your own insecurities.

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post #124 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 05:24 PM
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Now why you gotta go tell the truth?

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Originally Posted by jman66 View Post
Posting here as not to further derail the other thread.

In regards to the price question being considered rude/taboo/offensive/whatever:

What is considered offensive or rude can only be only defined by what you choose (one way or another) to be offended by and is really a result of your own projection of the situation.

It all stems from a point of personal insecurity - ie. If I tell them how much I paid for the car, or how much I make, what will they think of me? What that threshold is, is different for different people.

Some people like myself have no problem discussing personal income, what i have paid for things etc. Simply because I am not emotionally effected either way by what the other person will think about me (or what i perceive they would think) by giving them an honest answer.

There are a lot of people out there who are just curious. Sure you can look it up on the internet later, but if they are asking why not give them an honest answer?

Even if they are coming from the point of intentionally being rude towards you, what does it hurt to be polite and honest? If you take the defensive stance, you're only going to give the reaction that they are fishing for.

After all of that, if you are still personally uncomfortable answering their questions truthfully, then tell them that you are uncomfortable answering.

tl;dr: any perceived rudeness or offensiveness is a direct result of your own insecurities.

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post #125 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 06:36 PM
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Well the good news is that we have determined that Lotus isn't an exotic. This means we don't have a code of conduct and can frankly do anything we want!

Like we have repeated again and again, it isn't so much as asking how much is offensive (granted my parents always told me that asking strangers & friends what they paid for stuff was impolite - guess they taught me wrong!), as it is just boring seeing that nobody asks anything else. I can't help but think the car has to have another interesting feature, no?

Honestly I love talking about the car, and when there is a real enthusiast I have no problem telling them what I paid. Heck, I love talking to strangers when they have genuine questions, I also let strangers sit in the car, and get an up close experience because it is fun to watch their excitement. I guess it is tiring rehashing the same answer when it is someone who clearly has no idea what the car is and cost is the only question that ever clicks inside their skull (99% of my encounters).

I know, Notorious, that you think it is because the general public knows everything about the car and wants to just know the market value... I call BS because most people don't know what a Lotus is, let alone have no interest in cars (look at all the Toyota appliances out there, drivers too busy texting to safely drive, etc...). I'm sure they are all Lotus experts!

So Notorious & jman66: what is your yearly income?

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post #126 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 06:47 PM
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Well the good news is that we have determined that Lotus isn't an exotic. This means we don't have a code of conduct and can frankly do anything we want!

Like we have repeated again and again, it isn't so much as asking how much is offensive (granted my parents always told me that asking strangers & friends what they paid for stuff was impolite - guess they taught me wrong!), as it is just boring seeing that nobody asks anything else. I can't help but think the car has to have another interesting feature, no?

Honestly I love talking about the car, and when there is a real enthusiast I have no problem telling them what I paid. Heck, I love talking to strangers when they have genuine questions, I also let strangers sit in the car, and get an up close experience because it is fun to watch their excitement. I guess it is tiring rehashing the same answer when it is someone who clearly has no idea what the car is and cost is the only question that ever clicks inside their skull (99% of my encounters).

I know, Notorious, that you think it is because the general public knows everything about the car and wants to just know the market value... I call BS because most people don't know what a Lotus is, let alone have no interest in cars (look at all the Toyota appliances out there, drivers too busy texting to safely drive, etc...). I'm sure they are all Lotus experts!

So Notorious & jman66: what is your yearly income?
About US$1,000 per pound.

What is your wife's breast size?

I will concede that telling someone in person one on one versus spreading it on the internet is a bit different, but there is also a thread somewhere about your income range and age and there is no lack of response there.

Why get all worked up around other's ignorance or lack of creativity when it comes to asking interesting questions about a Lotus? If that is what they want to know that is what they want to know. Doesn't make any difference to you, does it? Some people are interested in speed, some are interested in power, and some just know costs... because like you said, not everyone is an enthusiast who can talk in terms of performance figures, but everyone knows money.

Do you get as offended when you get asked how much did you pay for your Rolex or how much was that 65" 3D LED TV in your living room? How about when you can't wait to tell everyone at your office party or random gathering about the great deal you got on your Camry through Cars.com? How about talking about that fancy dinner at the new steakhouse? Do you also do the duck and weave about how much you paid for that steak or fancy cocktail?

BTW, Lotus is not exotic... not in the current guise. Back in the day, when the Esprit had the S8 variant, yeah, it was exotic.

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post #127 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 07:15 PM
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About US$1,000 per pound.

What is your wife's breast size?

I will concede that telling someone in person one on one versus spreading it on the internet is a bit different, but there is also a thread somewhere about your income range and age and there is no lack of response there.

Why get all worked up around other's ignorance or lack of creativity when it comes to asking interesting questions about a Lotus? If that is what they want to know that is what they want to know. Doesn't make any difference to you, does it? Some people are interested in speed, some are interested in power, and some just know costs... because like you said, not everyone is an enthusiast who can talk in terms of performance figures, but everyone knows money.

Do you get as offended when you get asked how much did you pay for your Rolex or how much was that 65" 3D LED TV in your living room? How about when you can't wait to tell everyone at your office party or random gathering about the great deal you got on your Camry through Cars.com? How about talking about that fancy dinner at the new steakhouse? Do you also do the duck and weave about how much you paid for that steak or fancy cocktail?

BTW, Lotus is not exotic... not in the current guise. Back in the day, when the Esprit had the S8 variant, yeah, it was exotic.
How much do you weigh? - just messing with you. Don't need to answer that! I think so many people participated on the income thread was that it was anonymous, well the poll was if I remember correctly?

As for breast size, I don't have a wife so can't give you an answer...

I wouldn't say I get all worked up by it, but what I'm trying to say is that I can't wrap my head around why that is the ONLY question I get asked by strangers. However you have a good point that everyone can relate to money...

I suspect in my case it might be age related too... I'm 25, and probably look younger, but hard for me to say...

As for bragging about stuff I bought, I never bring up price, unless I got a great deal, but even then it is more like "hey I got this widget for half off!" sort of thing. To be honest none of my friends or coworkers ask what I paid for any of my stuff and frankly I don't feel the need to tell them. Only my friends who are car enthusiasts asked what I paid for the Exige, and they always start with, "If you don't mind me asking..." or something along those lines.

Well since my car (only ~1000 in the US...) isn't exotic this is all a moot point, because frankly there is no code of conduct for me to abide by!

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post #128 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 07:33 PM
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Okay, no wife... what's your breast size?

Anyway, the poll was anonymous but a lot of people did chime in with actual posts.

I agree that looking young and driving a cool car gets you a lot more wiseass remarks than you would otherwise because people just assume dumb things. I get that all the time because my friend convinced me that I should drive cars which are strictly age inappropriate because if I wait until I am older to drive the same cars, then it would just be midlife crisis.

I agree with you with your points and I don't like bragging either about anything but if someone wants to ask and it's done sincerely, I will respond in all sincerity as well. If someone is trying to be a smart ass or douche, then I will answer but turn it back on them to play on their own insecurity, which is plenty evident by their asking in the first place.

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post #129 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 07:59 PM
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Okay, no wife... what's your breast size?

Anyway, the poll was anonymous but a lot of people did chime in with actual posts.

I agree that looking young and driving a cool car gets you a lot more wiseass remarks than you would otherwise because people just assume dumb things. I get that all the time because my friend convinced me that I should drive cars which are strictly age inappropriate because if I wait until I am older to drive the same cars, then it would just be midlife crisis.

I agree with you with your points and I don't like bragging either about anything but if someone wants to ask and it's done sincerely, I will respond in all sincerity as well. If someone is trying to be a smart ass or douche, then I will answer but turn it back on them to play on their own insecurity, which is plenty evident by their asking in the first place.
Haha sounds like we are actually on the same page! As far as age is concerned, I figure might as well enjoy this car when I'm young and can take full advantage of it!

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post #130 of 177 (permalink) Old 06-24-2013, 08:17 PM
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Haha sounds like we are actually on the same page! As far as age is concerned, I figure might as well enjoy this car when I'm young and can take full advantage of it!
I don't doubt that most of us feel exactly the same way about rude people and rude behaviors... it's just how we choose to be affected and react. Some are greatly affected and react accordingly, some are greatly affected and don't react, some aren't affected and don't react, and some aren't affected but choose to react anyway just to make a point... but the bottom line is what it is.

I just don't care about it as much because of my background and experiences. I actually don't care about too much because the little things really don't matter in the big picture. When you see enough people dying young or suddenly or people getting impacted everyday in every major way... and how the world keeps moving on without a hiccup... you realize, what does all this really matter? Just brush it off and move on.

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post #131 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 08:43 AM
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I had the opportunity today on my lunch break to share the enthusiasm that is Lotus.

I got to meet my Boss's co-worker who is thinking about getting a lotus.

As soon as I pulled in he was already waiting with his phone taking a video.

As soon as I stepped out of the car, he was very excited to see one in person up close for the first time.

We talked about the car for a bit and about himself and the many cars he has owned and driven and after saying he had owned many fast and powerful cars and recently a miata, I took a chance and let him drive the car on a nice curvy road that was right out of the parking lot.

He really enjoyed it, and told me his wife very much enjoys cars as well.

After discussing realistic pros and cons and a few tips on ownership and advice, He took a few more pictures and I gave him my email address.

Hopefully soon, There will be another Lotus owner in my area.

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post #132 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 11:37 AM
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Regarding people asking about the price, I see it in two ways:

Obnoxious people with no manners, or kids (literally, middle school - high school) ask me, I ask them 'why do you want to know' or 'I rather not discuss'.

However, people who are genuinely excited, I tell them how much it was new, how much I paid for it, because they get even more excited when they realize its an attainable dream.

I let everyone sit in my car unless they come across as rude (someone came up to me once and said 'yo, let me sit in your car' and that was the first time I said 'why?'). But sometimes I feel like people abuse it, like this one person I know will try to sit in my car and tries to drive it away (WTF?), just because I let everyone sit in it and take picture doesn't mean you can drive it even if the keys are inside.
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post #133 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 12:15 PM
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When they are genuinely interested in the car, the question of price is never the first. If it happens to be the first question out of their mouth, they likely are just sizing you up.. At which point I ask them back, "what do *you* think?" It puts the attention on them instead of me and makes for a more meaningful interaction.
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post #134 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 03:45 PM
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This middle school kid asked me how much I paid for it, I was thinking of something between WTF and why does it even matter, you are in middle school (lol)???

He then asked me if I drifted with it before.
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post #135 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-06-2013, 04:17 PM
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I usually just say that it has $35K in upgrades and it usually stops there.

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post #136 of 177 (permalink) Old 08-09-2013, 01:19 PM
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Get the "how much did it cost" a lot with the Elise, but get a different version with the 1973 Opel GT we own.



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"How much is that worth?", Last time this happened I said that the guy who restored it put $35K into restoring it. Which is true. (We bought it restored and for less that 1/2 that amount) Of course I did not tell them that bit. I let them chew on that as they slobbered on my car!
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post #137 of 177 (permalink) Old 11-06-2013, 02:20 PM
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Love the GT. I have 4 in my yard right now and my project this weekend is to get the 73 running again so I can drive it to work. I've loved a few cars, but the lotus is the first car I've ever loved so much that I want to drive it less.

The GTs are great because when people would ask the how much question and I could just laugh. Now that I have the Evora, my answer when I'm in the GT will be "in perfect condition, (which mine is far from) less than what I think it costs to replace the clutch in my other car."

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post #138 of 177 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 06:03 PM
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The meaning of Elise is "My God is a vow". This is really is the core of the concept. The more I learned about Lotus and the evolution of what has become the Elise/Exige machines, truly exemplify the strive for perfection; the "vow". Frank Loyd Wright (the architect) knew that function before design = true beauty. Like an engineer in an interview at Lotus said. "The car is like a beautiful woman with a nice personality". Now you don't see that every day! My point is: We are so privileged to have these cars in our lives. It's our obligation to exalt them if you will, and treat them (within our own reasonable ability's) with the same reverence and respect as the folks who brought them to us. We are the gatekeepers and the "shaman" of these marvelous creations to "the great unwashed and unknowing" one's we will meet along our way in these "machines of a higher plane". IMHO, if you don't feel this way about your Lotus, sell it to someone who does and go drive a Mustang, Miata, Corvette, Camero, Subaru or Scion. These are all nice cars but certainly not in the league of commanding this kind of respect or do diligence. It's a commitment. Like it or not. By the way, In Florida most insurance company's consider the Elise an exotic car and won't touch it. (But we're a no-fault state and don't really deserve to have cars and roads or drive anything in the first place!) The fact that everyone is not constantly in an accident is really the biggest accident here in cracker-ville. I know, I digressed. Big time...

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post #139 of 177 (permalink) Old 03-28-2014, 11:20 PM
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Cars are made to be driven.

People shouldn't have to feel like that to own this car. It is what you want it. That isn't to say I don't recognize the effort and ingenuity that goes into these machines but first and foremost they are machines but if you want to worship it like some plastic jesus by all means knock yourself out... Me?

Honestly I couldn't care less about being a gatekeeper or whatever you want to call it lol
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post #140 of 177 (permalink) Old 03-29-2014, 11:48 AM
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AAA here will insure the Elise as a regular car. They wouldn't touch my Noble.

I had to go with the Collector/Exotic car insurance company to get coverage for the Noble. Guess what? They didn't have the Elise in their listing. Not to say they wouldn't take my money for insuring an Elise. I am sure they would have figured it out.

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