New Evora 400 Leaves Me Stranded *Again* - Page 2 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-05-2019, 08:00 AM
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Lotus can wear you down while you wait for them to acknowledge and deliver a solution to a problem they should be responsible for.

Address that spurious bill, get the charges reversed and require that your dealer deliver a functioning car. It's not the client's job to tell a vendor what's broke and what ain't. Considering the haphazard treatment you have already received I'd say you've nothing to lose. They don't trust that you had a problem in routine use (we couldn't find nuthin') yet you're supposed to agree to and accept their charges on face value when they deliver zilch?

Even with a responsible and cooperative dealer there can be hick-ups and issues resulting from seeming indifference to problems that should be resolved with repair and apology by the responsible parties. I find it's the small things (in this case perhaps a battery, in others maybe a poor fit or another minor issue) that seem to be the most frustrating to resolve. Frankly, Lotus isn't alone in this behavior but they occupy a special niche and it would serve them well just now to go the extra mile.

I'm very grateful to have a good dealer and tech (I make frequent note of this here because it's important) but it still can be frustrating to get answers from Lotus and it puts the dealer and the customer in an awkward situation. I want to maintain good relations with my servicing dealer (and they have done so with me) so I try to understand that they are working with a sometimes unresponsive entity. But we really shouldn't have to be concerned about our relationships when dealing with a manufacturing defect that Lotus should take responsibility for. Especially so now that they are supposed to have the shekels to finance some big boy pants.

I wouldn't and couldn't own this exciting and unique car without a sympathetic dealer. It shouldn't be necessary, but unfortunately when dealing with Lotus some patience can be required. The best investment they can make in this country isn't delivering the 430 or the promise of future great stuff. Taking exceptional and personal care of the business that exists right now is the foundation of any growth. It's not complicated.

Lew
'17 Evora 400 MT
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-05-2019, 11:57 AM
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Sorry folks. I did realize the fact that it was a bit rude to question the OPs knowledge of cars. I believe that reliability ratings are directly related to the owner's knowledge of a car. What is a five minute fix for one customer could be a dealer visit for another. Those events can negatively impact the brand and it will. Lotus has tried so hard to shed it's history of reliability concerns and they have built a great car to do just that with the Evora. We cannot have a few customers undermine that effort. What many don't understand is that information reported here will be indexed by search engines and can negatively impact a future customer's Lotus purchase decision. There is no verification of actual ownership in this group. So pretty much anyone can say they own a Lotus and they have problem X with it.

Larger companies have dedicated brand reputation monitoring teams that try to reduce the impact of factually questionable online information on their brand. Not sure about Lotus. So it is in our best interest as Lotus owners to trust members but verify issues reported.

Note for Lotus: If a car sits for over a year before selling, make sure the dealer is replacing battery with a new one. How hard is that when compared to dealing with reports like this? I hope Geely is listening. Oh yeah, and btw, please don't build that Lotus SUV.
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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-05-2019, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octonion View Post

Note for Lotus: If a car sits for over a year before selling, make sure the dealer is replacing battery with a new one. How hard is that when compared to dealing with reports like this? I hope Geely is listening. Oh yeah, and btw, please don't build that Lotus SUV.
Pre-delivery Inspection notes from Lotus include battery conditioning information and tell dealers to change out low voltage batteries. Also states that Lotus will not cover dealers claim for replacement battery unless correct trickle charging has been maintained. The dealer most likely killed the battery while storing the car and should replace it at their cost.
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'17 Evora Sport 410 GP (No. 1 of 9) LMS alloy pan, BOE headers, SSC harness bar
'12 Evora S GP (No. 1 of 14) BOE Prototype S 430 **SOLD**
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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-06-2019, 07:24 AM
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... or at the cost of anyone other than the purchaser!!!
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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-07-2019, 04:33 PM
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Seems odd to me that a trickle charger (low current) can keep a bad battery charged over a period of two weeks, but a supposedly good alternator with what should be a much higher charging current will let the battery die after what I'm guessing was about a 2 hr drive.

I would be looking for a loose B+ connection at the alternator... perhaps it is loose while you are driving but making a decent connection while you are idling in a parking lot and checking your voltages.

Just a WAG.
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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-07-2019, 04:53 PM
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Sorry to hear about your bad experience with the car and dealer. Assuming you are first owner? Was it a punched car/warranty started and sold as used? Just curious on either which would negate being the first owner. Did you buy the car from the servicing dealer? Be nice if said dealer was able to respond on here. I’m sure you know the following, but figured I’d mention for others looking or lurking. I always tell owners at delivery if not driven more than a week, connect the charger. I also make sure at delivery to show customers how to flip the boot lid latch to ensure the lights within the boot are off. I've seen many owners over the years say 'it's been on a charger for weeks' and come to find out the latch hasn't been flipped. Driven accross state lines to help more than one owner out for this particular problem. Cost me a lot more than $200 to show someone how to flip a switch. Also when flipped, it allows for the boot lid to rest on the latch and creates a nice opening for the cord to be laid on a microfiber towel. When disconnecting, it is easy to flip the latch back open. Also make sure to remove the key from the ignition even when in the off position.

The 400 has been a serious step forward in quality. We’ve had very few issues with cars. Wish you the best and your concerns are resolved by the installation of a new battery.

Last edited by GatorMS_Sales; 02-08-2019 at 10:06 AM.
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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octonion View Post
Sorry folks. I did realize the fact that it was a bit rude to question the OPs knowledge of cars. I believe that reliability ratings are directly related to the owner's knowledge of a car. What is a five minute fix for one customer could be a dealer visit for another. Those events can negatively impact the brand and it will. Lotus has tried so hard to shed it's history of reliability concerns and they have built a great car to do just that with the Evora. We cannot have a few customers undermine that effort. What many don't understand is that information reported here will be indexed by search engines and can negatively impact a future customer's Lotus purchase decision. There is no verification of actual ownership in this group. So pretty much anyone can say they own a Lotus and they have problem X with it.

Larger companies have dedicated brand reputation monitoring teams that try to reduce the impact of factually questionable online information on their brand. Not sure about Lotus. So it is in our best interest as Lotus owners to trust members but verify issues reported.

Note for Lotus: If a car sits for over a year before selling, make sure the dealer is replacing battery with a new one. How hard is that when compared to dealing with reports like this? I hope Geely is listening. Oh yeah, and btw, please don't build that Lotus SUV.

I wasn't going to say anything but after your first comment in this thread and now this even less helpful bit I have to say a few things directed to you. First, I have a 2005 Elise that I purchased with about 200 miles on it in the spring of 2006. There were no new ones available at the time and it is the newest one I found anywhere. Regardless, the first thing I learned about the car reliability wise is that if I didn't drive it for a week the battery killed itself. My first battery lasted up until my vacation in 2006 when I returned to a completely flattened battery and I had to purchase a new one out of warranty because Lotus wouldn't cover it then either. That was almost 14 years ago. Lotus still has this problem and we all need to voice our experiences and do it loudly enough where they get off their boot lids and fix it. Lotus should have purchased a new battery and the dealer should not have charged him for it. They are both in the wrong based on the fact that this is not a new problem with the Elise, Exige, or the Evora. If he brought the car in for something that they have never heard of and nothing could be found then that is a different story but this isn't the case. No passenger car should be required to be on a trickle charger if not driven for a few days. They should be able to sit for at least a few weeks. If someone is thinking of buying the car and this issue will prevent them from purchasing it then it is something they should know AND Lotus needs to know about the lost sales so they fix it. Discussing and identifying actual quality and design problems is a very good thing.
I still own my Elise and still love it BUT I am no fanboy and will tell people the good and the bad and that is what consumers need to hear. Like the parasitic electrical system, the anemic AC, the fact I am on my 3rd clock spring, the fragile windshields, the sometimes year or longer wait for replacement parts (still waiting on some parts I ordered back in August 2017),... Everyone hears the good stuff from the manufacturers and car mags and our jobs are to help each other and be honest about what is going on. LT stands for Lotus Talk and should also stand for Lotus Truth. Fanboys just feed the greed. They are like trolls. We don't need them here.
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 02:52 PM Thread Starter
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I very much appreciate everyone's response to this thread - even though i may have issues with one reply, i appreciate the deeper explanation subsequently provided. I made an appointment to bring it in for service on the 19th - which is longer than i'd like to wait, but i don't have winter or all season tires yet, so i probably can't drive it until then anyway. If they continue to "find nothing wrong", i will accept buying a new battery. By this Wednesday or Thursday, i should be able to drive to an O'Reilly and have the charging system checked first.

Though it is anecdotal, we all know that these cars sat on the dock for long enough to let the original batteries go flat, but perhaps the non-technical employees at dealerships don't understand the consequences of that? What surprised me more than the electrical problem was the lack of support from the dealership - that i've used for years for service on my Elise. The whole purpose in my buying new from this dealer was to continue and deepen the relationship with them, but since then - my salesman has left the company, the service guy that i used to deal with is gone, and even the receptionist that knew my name is gone! We'll see how they do on the 19th. Will update then!
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post #29 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 03:52 PM
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FWIW, 13.9v charging seems low to me. I typically expect to see ~14.3-14.6v when charging.

My S1 Evora S went through 2 different dealership service centers before the 3rd finally caught the alternator was faulty and not charging the battery properly and voltage was intermittently dropping out @ <9000mi.
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post #30 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 04:32 PM
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I'll ask this here since it relates to Saul's problem.
Has anyone measured the parasitic drain on their Evora? I did a quick measurement on mine (an 2011 S) and it read ~60mA. The Lotus Technical notes said it should be ~30mA. Just wondering what other people are getting for a measurement.
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post #31 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-16-2019, 11:04 AM
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Once a battery depletes, it seldom fully recovers, a new battery is required, and keep it on a "maintainer".
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