New Vette...Lotus input? - Page 2 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #21 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 07:44 AM
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Mega,

It has an IRS with shocks at each corner, the "leaf spring" runs transverse - that is, it does not use leafsprings to dampen each end of a solid rear axle, like an old truck would - its actaully pretty trick! and i don't even like vettes!

Others,

Actaully the drive train is split - ala, alfa romeo gtv6/milano. the engine is up front, but it has a transaxle in the rear. a very good design! stuffing a hugh lump of an engine behind the seats would be bad bad....

Really - i don't like vetts! honest!
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post #22 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 07:48 AM
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The leaf springs are transversely mounted on the Vette so they are hard to see unless you look under the car. Basically, there is one spring in the front and one in the back. They are light and compact and allow for a super simple mechanism for changing ride height; there is a simple bolt between the end of each leaf and the lower A arm. The cars come at full ride height but you can adjust the ride down about an inch just by adjusting this bolt.

It's a simple setup that works very well.

Pete

Last edited by sleepless; 12-30-2004 at 09:30 AM.
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post #23 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 08:02 AM
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Mega,

To clearly answer your question, it does have composite transverse leaf springs, front and rear. As Evl aludes, it is not used at all for suspension location. The springs last a long time without fatigue related stength loss. It also reduces unsprung weight. There is some adjustability for ride height (possibly for corner weight too). The primary disadvantage almost no aftermarket support for multiple choices of spring stiffness.

Let the rest of the world laugh the use of "leaf springs", they work well in this application. The rest of the world thinks DOHC are new and high tech.... the tech has been around for about 80 years or more.

They laugh at the use of at a push rod/OHV engine, yet the volumetric efficiency of the engine is as good as the DOHC engines, and is lighter and smaller to boot. Look at the fuel efficiency of the 2004 Z06 versus a 360 Modena, you will see the Corvette kicks the Ferrari's behind.

The Corvette is not about using "hot" technologies for the sake of saying they have them. They use the technology that gets the job done (meets the performance specs) for the least money and best reliability. The KISS principle, if you will. They have added a ton of luxury items that add too much weight and complications to continue to meet their market demands, but on the engine and suspension side they have resisted the stuf that doesn't add performance.

Greg

Edit: wow I am a terribly slow typist and am taking care of my baby while typing. several people answered while I was typing!

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post #24 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 08:27 AM Thread Starter
 
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My thanks to ALL!
I thought that it must run a soild axle like FORD do with the new Mustang. Although i hear that the VERY FAST version of the Stang WILL have IRS!

As for the Vette, i feel that i should say sorry for all lip i given them over the years......thought leaf springs....old truck...soild axle....crap Euro handling...............Sorry GM (

I see a lot of Lotus input there so i expect it good, than the size is good as well. 911 ish not too big, shape good but hate the head lamps!
Cheers
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post #25 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 09:23 AM
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I agree mega - i think they got the "proportions" right on the new vette, but the styling is still a bit off - anyways - the new vette is a real ass kicker! wish GM would let someone like lotus loose on the feedback dept. though - haven't driven the new vette, but the C5 was a dead ride. plenty fast and handled great, but felt dead.
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post #26 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 10:01 AM
 
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<<<<<<but on the engine and suspension side they have resisted the stuf that doesn't add performance>>>>>

then how come the racing vettes use a coilover suspension. oh yeah...because the stock one is a piece of crap
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post #27 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by cuenant
<<<<<<but on the engine and suspension side they have resisted the stuf that doesn't add performance>>>>>

then how come the racing vettes use a coilover suspension. oh yeah...because the stock one is a piece of crap
SCCA T1 class use T1 leaf springs.

In classes that allow more freedom of mods, yes, they use coilovers because they are infinitely more adjustable. In these classes, pretty much all cars use multiway adjustable coilovers for the same reason.

By your logic, the Porsches and BMWs also have crap suspensions from the factory since the racers go for coilovers.

No, they simply don't have ultra expensive fully adjustable suspensions because 99% of the drivers don't need such suspensions.

Pete
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post #28 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by cuenant
<<<<<<but on the engine and suspension side they have resisted the stuf that doesn't add performance>>>>>

then how come the racing vettes use a coilover suspension. oh yeah...because the stock one is a piece of crap
How much do you know about suspensions and race tuning a car. In professional racing it is not unusal to have one or more different sets of springs to the suspension to the track conditions for that weekend. It is more difficult to change out the leaf spring quickly and very few shops have the capability to produce them. This is not a problem for a street car that will have one set of spring rates (compromise) for it's whole life. Race cars do not have this limitation.

Greg

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post #29 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
 
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Please understand i didn't start this post to start an "Automotive firefight". If fact i am deeply embarrass to say the lest, i thought you a load of fat, soft Yanks...in fact you seem bright, well informed people.............never judge a people by their leader (Bush).

Yes, you might raise a case about the leaf spring, but remember 911! Yes after all theses years the Motor is still in the WRONG place!

Cheers
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post #30 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 01:26 PM
 
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Here's more information about the C6 Z06 from a Motor Trend article that's coming soon.

http://www.graciano.com/mt/
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post #31 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 04:20 PM
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And the attached pic shows the front leaf spring.
Attached Images
 

Pete
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post #32 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 04:29 PM
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the article also talks about a plexiglass rear window to save weight, but it failed GM's UV test and scratch resistant properties. I guess this rules out getting a plexiglass windshield for our cars.

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post #33 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 04:42 PM
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"the article also talks about a plexiglass rear window to save weight, but it failed GM's UV test and scratch resistant properties. "

Now THATS funny!
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post #34 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by shay2nak
the article also talks about a plexiglass rear window to save weight, but it failed GM's UV test and scratch resistant properties. I guess this rules out getting a plexiglass windshield for our cars.
I ordered the plexiglass rear window in addition to the side windows from eliseparts.com and they told me the rear window in our cars is glued in so it is difficult to replace. Also, the side windows apparently take several hours each to replace so I ended up not ordering them (it's pretty cool that Geary at eliseparts.com warned me about these issues ).

Pete
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post #35 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-30-2004, 05:40 PM
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Corvettes have had 4 wheel independent suspension for over 40 years.

The LS1/LS2 is an excellent design. People (especially European writers) like to slag this engine as a huge monstrosity, but in fact it is lighter and more compact than almost all DOHC 4.0L engines. It does not suffer from worse fuel consumption - compared to the Porsche 911S (997) it gets 1 MPG better mileage. And compare it to the F355/F360 V8 - far better mileage. So who cares if the displacement is larger, if the engine is lighter and more compact, and doesn't use more fuel?





DLY
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post #36 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-31-2004, 04:59 AM Thread Starter
 
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Please allow to eat a load of Humble pie!
Not many of you know this but i am an engineer, i loved engineering since i was a youg boy.

I read the posts and can say this, this not good engineering.....IT IS GREAT ENGINEERING! I can never remember a time a team of America's put so much effort, so much attension to detail in to car!

It all makes sense, whats more you can see that GM has gone all out to do the job.

Many, many years ago Autocar (British car mag) went to Lotus for the day. Handling was explained and i enjoyed the read However Lotus said this, "The best handling/Balance for a car was Front engine/rear drive". In fact the said that the engine should be as far back in the engine bay as possable.......Front/mid engined as they put it. (Elan mark one)

Porsche proved it with the 944/944 Turbo/968 that front engine with the gearbox over the rear end. Just the Vette and the New Aston Martins!

If you love Great Engineering, you must love this Vette!
Shame it not RHD, i would have thought the Aussie market would have made them do that?

Cheers
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post #37 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-31-2004, 07:31 AM
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That MT article certainly improved my evaluation of the C6 Z06. Balsa sandwiched between carbon fiber for the floors? Awesome! CF front fenders, aluminum chassis, magnesium engine cradle, power to weight ratio only beaten by Saleen S7, Porsche CGT, Enzo and better than Ford GT which stickers for twice the Z06? Fantastico!

What sways my to the Elise is the limited production of this Lotus, arguably one of the best handling sports car on the market, if not equal to or better than the best. Looks, handling, exclusivity, how it feels to be sitting in the Elise environment, and yes, price, do it for me. I figure I could get an enclosed trailer (tracking it) and other goodies for the Elise for the price difference as well.

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post #38 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-31-2004, 08:48 AM
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As an owner of a 2004 C5 Z06, I agree that from a performance point of view the C5 and even more so the C6 Z06's are engineered very well.

However, they do cut corners in ways that make the car a bit "less" than the other cars that it is compared to. Under heavy track use the C5 Z06 has reliability issues relating to excessive heat and small brakes; fortunately it looks like they've addressed these in the C6 Z06.

However, they still don't appear to have fixed the missing fun factor from having a car that feels nimble and gives lots of feedback which all the other super cars, including the Elise, provide. The Vettes tend to be very numb cars to drive.

While my Z06 is very fast and there a is certain thrill that one gets from its sheer ability to go fast under any situation, I'm replacing it with the slower Elise because if you're not racing, fun is more valuable to me than sheer speed.

Pete
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post #39 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-31-2004, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
 
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I read a few posts else where and i hear that the Mag-dampers are killed in hard track use, thus the C6 z06 does not use them. I suspect that you will find that this NEW Alloy/Mag Tub helps feed back no end.

A lot less weight, a load more feel back i suspect.we will see, just a shame GM didn't do a RHD version for Down under.

Cheers
Mega
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post #40 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-31-2004, 10:15 AM
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Just got my Feb Car and Driver which also has an article on the new Z06. They are predicting a lower base price of 60-65K, compared to 75K in the MT article linked above...
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