Upgrading Radiator System Questions on Components - Page 3 - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community
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post #41 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 06:02 AM
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I also used a Wizard radiator, as it's a single-pass unit and seems to be well made. In my case, I had the dealer install it when changing out the oil cooler lines. Removing the lines made the installation much easier, since the Wizard is thicker than the OEM unit and requires that some of the OEM spacers be removed in order to fit. Also, it did require disconnection of the A/C lines in my case, even with a competent Lotus technician who I trust doing the work.

Overall I'm happy with the Wizard that was installed last year, as I don't feel like I'm riding around with a cooling system time bomb. Ditto going to the RLS oil lines, as those units are made up from Aeroquip hoses and barbed

PM if you want any photos of the installation and I'll email them.

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post #42 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 07:28 AM
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driftwood,
I did use the OEM fans, I Just pulled out the old radiator without removing the condenser or fans, installing the wizard did require the schrod be completely loose but not removed.
I dont recall any spacers that had to be removed...or any spacers at all.

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post #43 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-26-2012, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
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driftwood,
I did use the OEM fans, I Just pulled out the old radiator without removing the condenser or fans, installing the wizard did require the schrod be completely loose but not removed.
I dont recall any spacers that had to be removed...or any spacers at all.
Any difference in temps with the new radiator? Still on stock thermostat?
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post #44 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 01:40 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmr View Post
I also used a Wizard radiator, as it's a single-pass unit and seems to be well made. In my case, I had the dealer install it when changing out the oil cooler lines. Removing the lines made the installation much easier, since the Wizard is thicker than the OEM unit and requires that some of the OEM spacers be removed in order to fit. Also, it did require disconnection of the A/C lines in my case, even with a competent Lotus technician who I trust doing the work.

Overall I'm happy with the Wizard that was installed last year, as I don't feel like I'm riding around with a cooling system time bomb. Ditto going to the RLS oil lines, as those units are made up from Aeroquip hoses and barbed

PM if you want any photos of the installation and I'll email them.
You can post up here! Id be interested in seeing this alternative unit as well. Looks like fitment isnt consistent for peoples installs?
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post #45 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 04:58 AM
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Leave the AC Condenser???

This is why I pulled mine. It was nearly completely clogged and you can not see this without pulling the fans. The fins were mushed like Phil said and corrosion had blocked the rest. Very bad for air flow wouldn't you think????
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post #46 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 05:03 AM
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OEM fans can not be flipped

I could not find a way to reverse the fan blades. The way it is constructed it is just not possibble. The profile of the OEM fan is also thick. I need another solution for a puller fan. I'll take a look at the Sector 111 option but would lov to hear others. I only want to mount one fan off center on the "hot" side of the radiator.
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post #47 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 05:13 AM
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I checked out the Sector 111 solution. It use the same brand fan but I bet they are smaller. I guess I could just remove the one on the left. Is the bracket made by Pro Alloy? I would not expect any fitment problem with the single pass Pro Alloy I ordered from BOE.

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post #48 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 05:17 AM
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Any difference in temps with the new radiator? Still on stock thermostat?
No difference in temp, 187 on highway low 200's in traffic with AC on. Thermostat..... funny you ask, with fresh coolant it failed right away! others
have had the same thing happen. Probably a good idea to change it while the coolant is out for the radiator swap, I used stock toyota unit.

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post #49 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 05:33 AM
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I have a radiator on the way from Phil at BOE and am looking for fan ideas too. I'd like a large single puller center mounted.
Still up in the air about pulling A/C core out. Would need new belt also as no reason to leave the compressor in too. I will be doing thermostat change also. Trying Duralast 15078 because of them all metal design.

Last edited by pistolpete; 05-27-2012 at 07:01 AM.
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post #50 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 01:13 PM Thread Starter
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@Eyelise thanks for sharing - what are the full components of the AC Systems that were involved when you pulled out the core? Im on the fence about this since it is nice to have AC during the hot days or when I have a passenger - particularly, female

From this thread's result comes along my decision to definitely proceed with a quality single pass rad, puller fans (maybe just one), radium coolant tank & possibly upgrade/replace the thermostat & hoses. Along with this; compound the install for oil cooler relocation and maybe remove AC...

Was even looking at the heater bypass mod some have done with success with a kit a member developed in the past. A whole cocktail of mods!
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post #51 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-27-2012, 08:03 PM
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As requested, attached are a few photos of my installation at Lotus of Atlanta. Sorry about the poor quality, as the Service Manager shot them at my request, but did so with his Smart Phone camera.

Note the difference in the thickness between the OEM and the Wizard. We had to remove the cad plated brackets shown on the OEM, as they were not needed for the Wizard. The technician modified them for use as gussets to mount the front of the radiator to the front of the car, as otherwise the screws would have been mounted to the fiberglass directly. Fender washers would have probably been okay as well, but these were handy and worked fine.

As noted before, this work was done when the oil cooler hoses were being replaced with RLS oil cooler hoses, so this helped with the thicker radiator installation. The housing for the oil coolers had to be lifted up to slide the thicker Wizard radiator in place. Also, the tech had to disconnect the A/C lines to do this as well.

OEM vs. Wizard:
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Wizard shown vs. OEM with bracket:
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OEM installed - note thickness:
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Wizard installed - note less space at top of radiator. This is what made installation of Wizard tricky.
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Note stiffeners at front of radiator on top of housing that were made from OEM brackets:
Name:  Wizard with modified stiffeners shown.jpg
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post #52 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-28-2012, 04:02 PM Thread Starter
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^ Do you think there would be space for a puller fan up top? Did you remove the AC Condenser as well with your install & retain the OEM fans?
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post #53 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pistolpete View Post
I have a radiator on the way from Phil at BOE and am looking for fan ideas too. I'd like a large single puller center mounted.
Still up in the air about pulling A/C core out. Would need new belt also as no reason to leave the compressor in too. I will be doing thermostat change also. Trying Duralast 15078 because of them all metal design.
Center mount fan would be obstructed by the clam. It would bve best on the left side where the engine water enters the radiator. I pulled the compressor and did not need a new belt. The tensioner has more than enough travel to compensate.

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post #54 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 11:07 AM
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^ Do you think there would be space for a puller fan up top? Did you remove the AC Condenser as well with your install & retain the OEM fans?
He did not remove the condenser and has the OEM fans in place a pushers. I'll likely order the sector111 solution as it should mount up top no problem. There is not room up top for the OEM fans. They seem too big to me and the fins can not be reversed. Since I need new fans, I thinking I'll go ahead and order the sector111 solution. I just want to figure out if it can be installed without removing the radiator shroud. That looks to be a big PITA.

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post #55 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 01:29 PM Thread Starter
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He did not remove the condenser and has the OEM fans in place a pushers. I'll likely order the sector111 solution as it should mount up top no problem. There is not room up top for the OEM fans. They seem too big to me and the fins can not be reversed. Since I need new fans, I thinking I'll go ahead and order the sector111 solution. I just want to figure out if it can be installed without removing the radiator shroud. That looks to be a big PITA.
Thanks! Yes, that shroud looks like it would be a PITA to fit the fans around. You may need to trim some parts of the shroud & still get away with it mounted in place. Which particular radiator did you replace with?
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post #56 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 02:16 PM
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Thanks! Yes, that shroud looks like it would be a PITA to fit the fans around. You may need to trim some parts of the shroud & still get away with it mounted in place. Which particular radiator did you replace with?
I went with the Pro Alloy 45mm which is basically the same as the triple pass but no baffles. I believe the Pro Ally mount will fit on top without trimming or removing the shroud.

I have a question into Pro Alloy in the UK to make sure. I also want to know what size Spal fan they went with. There are 12" or 15" pullers (or suckers) on the Pro Alloy website. I just want the mount and one fan. The fans are like $100.

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PPE Testpipe, BOE Silent Touch
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post #57 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Do you think there would be space for a puller fan up top? Did you remove the AC Condenser as well with your install & retain the OEM fans?
Probably not enough room unless two fans are used (one on each side of the center) that are very thin.

Did not remove the AC Condenser and kept the OEM fans. Temps seem to be lower, but I'll find out this summer.

I would be wary of using a triple-pass radiator due to pressure drop issues as has been posted by others. Water pump probably is not rated for this and may cavitate.

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post #58 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-29-2012, 03:44 PM
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I just looked at some of the data I logged last July on the track. My coolant temps ranged for the most part in the upper 180s (187-189) with peak temps around 197 for short periods not uncommon. No temps in the 200s. I don't expect to reach Phil's 158 max but I bet I'll see temps in the low 170s . It is amazing that he achieved a 30 degree drop. Someday maybe I'll convert to an electric pump too.

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post #59 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-30-2012, 01:30 PM
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I just received my new radiator and I'm going to play around with sizing of fans. I'd like to see if the larger fans will fit up top. There is a simple fitting kit available in the UK. I'm just not sure if it is meant for pusher fans or pullers. I couldn't tell by the website.

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PPE Testpipe, BOE Silent Touch
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post #60 of 233 (permalink) Old 05-30-2012, 01:38 PM
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Just a FYI- fewer fan the better for a track car... fans, associated hardware, and motors block more flow than they create at speed. The fans are there for stop n go traffic and the pit area.

I have a single 8" fan dead in the center of my radiator and the car will NOT over heat with it... NOW, that is for a track car. No A/C and a big arse radiator and no street driving. The clam "back bone" doesn't block enough flow to matter, really.

So with that, two 8 or 10 inch fans would be fine for a street car. My suggestion is to run a single puller for a track car with no AC at 8 or 10 inches and call it good...

Hope that helps,

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