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post #121 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-07-2011, 08:06 AM
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Here's my repost: I've used these for work and driving, cut down the loud noises but you can still hear conversation and music - really effective and inexpensive:



SureFire EarPro EP-3 Sonic Defenders® Earplugs
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post #122 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-07-2011, 08:13 AM
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Sorry, ain't sitting in traffic with those in...
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post #123 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-07-2011, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashworboys View Post
I am eager to get the 3500 rpm drone eliminated -
I really wish this wasn't the case, but from my experience, it's basically impossible to quiet the drone of a loud exhaust with sound deadening. My hunch is there is just too much sound energy there and too many transmission paths into the cockpit. I tried quite a few things to run a louder exhaust, including lots of heavy sound barrier lining areas of the cockpit, and a shield to deflect noise rearward at the source.

Unfortunately, I found those basically made no difference, and I think the exhaust I was running was quieter than Stage II.

If we're talking about ear plugs, others on the forum recommended these and I've found them to be GREAT. Just barely, but you can still listen to the radio through these since they let some high frequencies through, unlike foam ear plugs. They're also inconspicuous if you get the clear ones and can be worn inside of a helmet:

Etymotic Research, Inc. - ETY-Plugs ER20 High Fidelity Earplugs

If any of you exhaust designers out there are tuning in... seems like there's a market for an exhaust that sounds better than stock, is just as quiet, and is lighter weight!

Lotus Sport Elise #24
71 TR6
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post #124 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-07-2011, 12:23 PM
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The biggest thing I did to quiet my Elise down was went to R888's and a non droning 2balur GT3 muffler.

I can hear the radio and talk in the car now, and I never have the top on
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post #125 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 11:13 AM
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I got 40 sq ft of damplifier but used less than half so far. I got more since we had already planned on doing my boss'es undertray and I have other things planned...

2 "sheets" of luxury liner pro ( 18 sq ft). Those are mostly gone. You definitively need more than one to do everything I did. I wasted a bit since I was a bit dyslexic on cutting two pieces (cut the mirror image...)

Also, make sure you have a roller and the right glue if you decide to glue the LL. Second Skin sells those, too.

The damplifier is adhesive backed, so that always gets stuck on. It needs to have a good bond to work (use a wooden or rubber roller). It can be removed (once ) by peeling it off. I glued the Luxury liner to the damplifier with spray contact adhesive. From psoup's experience, that's not strictly necessary, but, as a friend remarked a while back, I'm an "anal little prick"

It also helps stiffen up the floor. I was surprised how much sturdier the floorpan felt after gluing the LL to the damplifier. I don't think you can remove the LL from the damplifier once glued since it's glued foam side down. But the whole sandwich should be removable (and will be trash once removed...)
Zuspiel, for once again thank you for your instructions!
2 more questions:

1) Did you remove the plastic surface of the firewall and placed the damplifier and luxury liner pro inside, then re-place the surface, or just placed them above the firewall surface without removing anything?

2) You wrote: "The damplifier is adhesive backed, so that always gets stuck on. It needs to have a good bond to work (use a wooden or rubber roller)". Not sure i understood this part. How do you use the wooden or rubber roller? Doesnt the damplifier just stack into the surface?

Thanks in advance!
J.C.
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post #126 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 01:06 PM Thread Starter
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John, the damplifier is basically butyl rubber with aluminum on one side. The butyl rubber side is basically a sticky tar like substance. You want the roller, because it is more effective the better the contact with the underlying surface you have, and there is a tendency for air to get trapped which prevents contact. Start on one edge, and then slide your finger back and forth from side to side as you apply it, then use the roller to make try and get as much contact as possible.

You want to remove the plastic trim first, then place the damplifier and LLP directly on the fiberglass, the LLP was glued in place over the damplifier. If I had a free edge with just foam, I cut some of the vinyl from the foam and faced the edge with the vinyl (see pic #3). Then I put gaffers tape on all joints and seams to hold them together nice and tight.

I am in the process of doing this, it takes a lot of time to get it all fit in just right, started yesterday, spent about 4 hours, probably about 4 more to go. Basically I tried to cover every square inch with LLP.
See pics, I'll post more when I get it all done. The little squares right on the firewall are the damplifier, the mat is the LLP.
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2009 Saffron Yellow Elise Purist Edition - Unpurified (oem cupholder, leather tunnel cover, and black door panels), Difflow 5 element railer JR, Janspeed Stage II Exhaust, ongoing sound proofing project, kahtec blinking 3rd brake light.
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post #127 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 01:08 PM Thread Starter
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Oh, one thing I forgot to mention, which I don't have a pic of yet, but the holes cut for the wiring, basically I placed patches of LLP over each of these holes that overlapped the edge of the cutout by about 1.5-2 inches, then glued and taped in place.

2009 Saffron Yellow Elise Purist Edition - Unpurified (oem cupholder, leather tunnel cover, and black door panels), Difflow 5 element railer JR, Janspeed Stage II Exhaust, ongoing sound proofing project, kahtec blinking 3rd brake light.
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post #128 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 01:22 PM
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^^^^^ Exactly what he said...

Psoup, BTW, you might want to be careful with the pieces that stick out (as in the third pic). There doesn't seem to be a whole lot of room in certain places. I had to extensively swear at my plastic cover to get it back in place...
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post #129 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 01:49 PM
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there is another way to accomplish hearing protection. i went to an audiologist to have a pair of solid silicone earplugs made. the audiologist actually injected an impression material into my outer ear and ear canal. the custom earplugs were made from those impressions. because they are made to fit MY ears, they are extremely comfortable. i can wear them for 8+ hours without any discomfort. they are very easy to put in and take out. i actually started wearing them all the time when i drive, not just under my helmet on track days when i'm making the most noise. they only cost me $90. i picked blaze orange so i can easily see them if i drop them, which would be difficult because the have a cord. they have translucent and numerous skins tones to pick from. the manufacturer is:

Starkey - Earplugs for Work - Industrial Hearing Protection from Starkey.

i have no affiliation with this company other than i like the earplugs i purchased.

Jason

06' Fed Elise

My frame, rear subframe, steering rack, A-arms, front crash structure, suspension uprights, and fuel tank are stock.
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post #130 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 02:15 PM
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What tires are you guys running? The yoko's, either version, are the loudest tires I have ever owned. Tires have come a long way since those were designed. R888 have been the best for OMG grip, but the RE-11s have been amazing. Both are incredibly quiet and the r888 have ultimate grip for summer while the RE-11s seem to be all around amazing for spring to fall driving. I did car audio for years and was about to give in and matt the car, then I had to change tires. I completely dropped that idea after driving the tires I listed above.

Warning, the R888's grip so hard you can hurt ur neck if you run 21 psi front and 24 psi rear, cold pressure.
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post #131 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-09-2011, 05:19 PM
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I stripped the interior this weekend and tackled the sound reduction project.
I put some Damplifier on:
1) The aluminum floorpan under the seats (there was already some damping mat'l but the additional stuff does make a difference)
2) On the aluminum gas tank cover, behind the seats below the "shelf"
3) I put a small piece (2" square) on the diffuser, which is obviously a gigantic resonator for the exhaust system. I will see how this holds up to the heat before plastering the whole resonator.

I put sound absorbing mat'l Luxury Liner Pro
1) under the seats, on top of the Damplifier.
2) in the middle of the firewall, between the yellow foam pad and the firewall. Because I retained the yellow foam pad, I couldn't add too much LLP otherwise I wouldn't be able to get the plastic cover back on.
While I was in there, I replaced the crappy rear Blaupunkt speakers.

I tried Damplifier on the fiberglass trunk and door skin, but it didn't change the resonance. Fiberglass does resonate, but not at the frequencies that metal does. So I removed the Damplifier from the fiberglass.

So far, It's not "quiet" but it is definitely less ear strain and I can talk to my passenger without getting hoarse. And I can hear the stereo. I had the soft top on. Total weight added is 11 lbs.
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post #132 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by psoup View Post
John, the damplifier is basically butyl rubber with aluminum on one side. The butyl rubber side is basically a sticky tar like substance. You want the roller, because it is more effective the better the contact with the underlying surface you have, and there is a tendency for air to get trapped which prevents contact. Start on one edge, and then slide your finger back and forth from side to side as you apply it, then use the roller to make try and get as much contact as possible.

You want to remove the plastic trim first, then place the damplifier and LLP directly on the fiberglass, the LLP was glued in place over the damplifier. If I had a free edge with just foam, I cut some of the vinyl from the foam and faced the edge with the vinyl (see pic #3). Then I put gaffers tape on all joints and seams to hold them together nice and tight.

I am in the process of doing this, it takes a lot of time to get it all fit in just right, started yesterday, spent about 4 hours, probably about 4 more to go. Basically I tried to cover every square inch with LLP.
See pics, I'll post more when I get it all done. The little squares right on the firewall are the damplifier, the mat is the LLP.
Thanks once again, you guys rule!!

So, to completely understand, you remove the plastic panel behind the seats covering the firewall, you place the damplifier (not the PRO one, just the simple Damplifier, right?) and the LLP on the fiberglass and after you are done, you re-put the plastic panel back in its place, covering the damplifier and LLP????

So, the Damplifier / LLP wont be visible after you are done, right?

And one more question: How do you remove this plastic panel covering the firewall, so as to apply the Damplifier/LLP??

Thanks!and sorry for the totally amateurish questions
J.C.

P.S. And please DO continue to post as many photos of the proccess as possible...!! I am a complete newbie and they are an extremely big big big big big big help!!!
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post #133 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 02:30 AM Thread Starter
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Removing the black plastic trim do the following.

1) Move driver side seat to forward most position.
2) Remove passenger seat by removing 4 bolts securing to floor (6mm hex), it's easiest with a hex socket with an extention for the two back and front one nearest the center console and L-shaped key for the front one near the door. Also undo the bold holding the seatbelt to the passenger seat (17 mm IIRC) - I would recommend replacing the bolt and sleave onto the seat to keep track of it. CAUTION: When you put the seat back in, hand thread the bolts to the floor, several people have stripped the soft aluminum by cross threading and this is a PITA if you do it. Also remember to install the seatbelt onto the seat before puting the seat back, otherwise you may have to remove the seat again to install it.
3) Carefully pry back the cover for the passenger side seat belt (The black triangle piece behind the passengers shoulder) and then unbolt (17 mm IIRC).
4) Unscrew the 4 screws along right under the window. CAUTION: these are actually plastic retainer screw/clip thingies...The plastic is soft, and you can easily core out the + part of it. Make sure you have a good perfectly fitting screw driver and that you apply adeqate foreward pressure. If you strip one (like me) you can order them from lotus garage, just don't reinstall the stripped one.
5) Remove the cupholder tray thingy...There is a screw in the base, when you unscrew that, pull the top piece off, and you will see 2 more screws to remove the bottom piece. You will then need to unplug the spade connectors from the Cig Lighter.
6)Starting on the passenger side, gently pull the trim piece loose, you have to kinda un-tuck it from the edges to get it off, it's pretty easy. Now pull it back far enough to disconnect the speaker spade connectors, the pull right off. Now firmly rock back and forth the interior light connector pulling back, and it should come off...I removed my interior light, which was a mistake because I broke one of the plastic tabs holding it in place...Again can be purchased from lotus garage if you break it....
7) now just pull the peice out...Installation will be about the reverse...

The Damplifier is installed directly onto the firewall (little black squares in pictures above) and the LLP is glued right on top of it (grey black mat stuff in pics above). Once you put the trim piece back on you won't see anything...I also covered the back side of the trim piece with overkill foam (See picture).

Just go slow, measure carefully...Use butcher paper to make cutouts to figure size and shapes (cut about 1 cm big), then test fit the LLP, trim to adjust size and then glue in place.
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2009 Saffron Yellow Elise Purist Edition - Unpurified (oem cupholder, leather tunnel cover, and black door panels), Difflow 5 element railer JR, Janspeed Stage II Exhaust, ongoing sound proofing project, kahtec blinking 3rd brake light.

Last edited by psoup; 01-10-2011 at 02:39 AM.
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post #134 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 04:52 AM
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Words are not enough to express my gratitude...!! YOU RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!


So, will it make a huge difference putting Damplifier + LLP inside the firewall??

To lower the noise level as much as possible, what else do you think I should do?
My Elise has foot carpets and underneath black foot mats that must be for sound deadening (looking like damplifier). Do you think I should leave those alone, or should I also add damplifier below that??

What about the engine bay? Can anything significant be done there?

Thank you!!!! J.C.

Last edited by johnchrist; 01-10-2011 at 05:00 AM.
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post #135 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 06:03 AM
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The stuff under my floor mats was gray and not black. And it was hard as a rock. If yours is more like damplifier, I'd wouldn't bother putting another layer on top.

Engine bay: If you have the cup airbox, I'd look above. Other than that, the only thing I can think of is *maybe* try something on the wheel well liners (forward part of them). I'm not convinced it will help, but it's something I'll try at some point of time.
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post #136 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 06:50 AM
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zuspiel,

just checked! the stuff under my floor mats is like yours, gray and not black, and hard as a rock. So do you propose I put a layer of damplifier below that?
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post #137 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 06:52 AM
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I did, but I'm not an "oz-pincher"...
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post #138 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 06:54 AM
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Oh, just re-read it: I put mine on top. If I were ambitious, I probably would have tried to remove the gray stuff...
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post #139 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 09:00 AM
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Anyone try to put some damplifier under the dash? Mine rattles/vibrates some, but I'm not sure if its making much noise, other than the rattles

If brute force doesn't work, you're not using enough.
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post #140 of 314 (permalink) Old 01-10-2011, 10:09 AM Thread Starter
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Anyone try to put some damplifier under the dash? Mine rattles/vibrates some, but I'm not sure if its making much noise, other than the rattles
Don't use Damplifier which is for resonance suppression of metal panels. You want to use a foam liner like overkill foam or DYNALINER, this will provide sound isolation and knock out rattle and vibration, plus it's much lighter. I recommend using a self adhesive one, the overkill is a great product but the adhesive is a pita to work with. See picture 8 posts or so above, like how I treated the firewall trim piece is what you should do for the dash.

2009 Saffron Yellow Elise Purist Edition - Unpurified (oem cupholder, leather tunnel cover, and black door panels), Difflow 5 element railer JR, Janspeed Stage II Exhaust, ongoing sound proofing project, kahtec blinking 3rd brake light.
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