The Lotus Cars Community banner

1 - 20 of 317 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,161 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Can everyone agree that there should be a single thread to post spoilers and comments on the recent race?

With that being said, Congrats to Roman for finishing another race and even beating Kimi! It's good to see both Lotus cars in the top 10!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,024 Posts
I'm in Mexico on vacation and couldn't watch the race but I saw on Twitter that there was some controversy about Vettle's win. Something about Vettle and Webber. What happened?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
277 Posts
****SPOILER ALERT****


After the last set of pit stops, Weber(1st) and Vettel(2nd) were supposed to stay in position. Vettel passed Weber during this time and pissed off Webber and his team. Basically, Webber was winning and then Vettel passed him after the team told them both to slow down and conserve because they were both ahead by so much. It's not the first time Vettel has done this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,024 Posts
****SPOILER ALERT****


After the last set of pit stops, Weber(1st) and Vettel(2nd) were supposed to stay in position. Vettel passed Weber during this time and pissed off Webber and his team. Basically, Webber was winning and then Vettel passed him after the team told them both to slow down and conserve because they were both ahead by so much. It's not the first time Vettel has done this.
I'll have to watch the race when I get back home to fully understand the issue but in that this is the second race of the season (IE: Webber was not in contention for the championship), how can they ask Vettle to "let" Webber have the win if Vettle is in a position to pass him and take the win himself?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,027 Posts
So this is where we have come. We legalized team orders to take the fakery out, and we gave them tires so fragile they can't race. Today we had the most confused bunch of people on a podium in racing history. Vettel instinctively staying more than a fist throw away from his teammate. Webber controlling his breathing while remembering he is a man of class but must respond in some way.
I'm at home trying to remember what happened on the track that determined the order of finish. And wondering what Nico Rosberg is doing somewhere off camera.

I can't help but think this: A race should ultimately be determined on the track. It is becoming glorified iRacing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,249 Posts
I wouldn't exactly call this "iRacing".

I think the point of contention is that the "race" was over in the team's mind. Team Redbull made the call that a 1, 2 finish was good enough for them and ordered their drivers to turn the fuel mappings down and cruise to the current 1, 2 order after allowing them to "race" for the bulk of the race. Weber obliged, and Vettel pretended to, then basically pulled a fast one on Weber to which Weber responded by fighting back.

Ultimately, it ended still with a 1,2 finish, but this very easily could have ended with both cars out via crash. Why? Because some punk kid, couldn't follow/respect team orders. To add further insult, think back to the last couple of years and how many times Weber was "ordered" to stand down. Being the classy guy that he is, more importantly, respecting his team's decision, he always did.
 

·
Illegal Alien
Joined
·
4,716 Posts
Then in 3/4th place you have Mercedes Team orders to hold place being followed but Rosberg is pissed and Hamilton feels undesering of his podium stand. 2nd place team psoition always feels cheated, regardless of team orders.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
269 Posts
Classic moment of the race: Hamilton pulling into the McLaren pit for his first tire change. Doh! Old habits die hard. :D
 

·
6.94915254 lbs/hp
Joined
·
1,731 Posts
I'm happy that Vettel passed Webber! Since when should racing drivers not try to win? That is their job, and if they aren't trying to win the ENTIRE time, I wouldn't want them on my team!
 

·
Illegal Alien
Joined
·
4,716 Posts
I'm happy that Vettel passed Webber! Since when should racing drivers not try to win? That is their job, and if they aren't trying to win the ENTIRE time, I wouldn't want them on my team!
Unfortunately teams get money based on final Constructors position, a stupid pass when you are holding position 1/2 that takes out one car costs at least 18 points. Drivers are hired to be aggressive but also to be smart.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,249 Posts
Unfortunately teams get money based on final Constructors position, a stupid pass when you are holding position 1/2 that takes out one car costs at least 18 points. Drivers are hired to be aggressive but also to be smart.
Exactly! People forget, these guys are playing with annual corporate money/budgets anywhere in the area of 25 million for entry level teams to close to 200 million for someone like Ferrari and Redbull. Oh and every time you win a constructor's championship or come close to getting one, it almost ensures gobbs of new money for the following year, because everybody wants to be on the bandwagon.

The reality is F1 has gotten to be very competitive/fun to watch in the last few years with the addition of DRS, KERS, and one tire supplier. Anyone that says it's not fun to watch or that these guys aren't "allowed to" or have the cars capable of "racing", clearly weren't F1 fans as little as 4-5+ years ago, when the races had no passing and were basically 2 hours of cars parading around and the only passing happened in the pits.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,150 Posts
Who here has watched the race AND thought what Vettel did what was right? Anyone? I'm sorry, but Webber had Vettel BEAT. Vettel could not catch him, was in fact losing time. The team called the drivers with about ten laps to go and told them to tune down their computers and bring it home 1-2. Webber did it. Vettel attacked, passed Webber, and basically stole the victory.

Vettel says he didn't realize he had done wrong until he got back to pit road and there was no celebration. He also admitted he "f**ked up" later.

It wasn't as if they were furiously racing and the team told them to cool it; the race was over, and in Webber's favor. Now, that being said, Hamilton was "awarded" 3rd by his team, who told Rosberg to settle for 4th. The big difference here is Rosberg was faster and would definitely have passed Hamilton. Hamilton obviously felt like a smuck during the press conference and hoped he could return the favor. Vettel the douchebag issued no such statement.

EDIT: and now, looking down, I see others made the same point. oops
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,027 Posts
Point worth making again. Vettel forever lost fans. He's sorta like the bad guy in wrestling now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,150 Posts
I know Schumacher did stuff like this too, and that is largely forgotten now looking back, but what Vettel did will likely result in a significant loss of marketability. It could cost him millions in sponsorship and product sales now and for the next few years. It will certainly be the most expensive win of his career. He will regret this one for a while.
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
3,138 Posts
I wouldn't be surprised if it cost Vettel a whole lot more down the road. You think Webber hosed him in Brazil? That ain't nothing. I was a huge Vettel fan, now not so much.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
953 Posts
The situation at Mercedes was pretty much the same however they did as the team boss asked. Not sure why Hamilton should feel bad. As Ross Brawn said, Lewis can also go faster but, has been asked to drive to a certain lap time. It all seems rather simple. It's not like it used to be with we want our number one to win so pull over on the straight and let him by. This is the teams figuring out the tires and fuel and wanting to maximize their overall results and not lose their positions because their tires go off, run out of fuel and take each other out. If it were a matter of just favoring one over the other than that would be unfortunate. This wasn't the situation.

Who here has watched the race AND thought what Vettel did what was right? Anyone? I'm sorry, but Webber had Vettel BEAT. Vettel could not catch him, was in fact losing time. The team called the drivers with about ten laps to go and told them to tune down their computers and bring it home 1-2. Webber did it. Vettel attacked, passed Webber, and basically stole the victory.

Vettel says he didn't realize he had done wrong until he got back to pit road and there was no celebration. He also admitted he "f**ked up" later.

It wasn't as if they were furiously racing and the team told them to cool it; the race was over, and in Webber's favor. Now, that being said, Hamilton was "awarded" 3rd by his team, who told Rosberg to settle for 4th. The big difference here is Rosberg was faster and would definitely have passed Hamilton. Hamilton obviously felt like a smuck during the press conference and hoped he could return the favor. Vettel the douchebag issued no such statement.

EDIT: and now, looking down, I see others made the same point. oops
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,150 Posts
It all could have been nipped in the bud by have the pit radio in right after he passed Webber and said "Seb, what in the $%@ are you doing!?"

Seriously.
His team radio'd Vettel and said Seb, you're being silly. Back off and bring it home. Those statements were repeated in various forms as Vettel attacked Webber, and they were broadcasted for all to hear. Vettel ignored all requests from his engineers/manager.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,150 Posts
The situation at Mercedes was pretty much the same however they did as the team boss asked. Not sure why Hamilton should feel bad. As Ross Brawn said, Lewis can also go faster but, has been asked to drive to a certain lap time. It all seems rather simple. It's not like it used to be with we want our number one to win so pull over on the straight and let him by. This is the teams figuring out the tires and fuel and wanting to maximize their overall results and not lose their positions because their tires go off, run out of fuel and take each other out. If it were a matter of just favoring one over the other than that would be unfortunate. This wasn't the situation.
Hamilton said he felt bad because Nico was faster and certainly would have/should have passed him. It is a bit different because Vettel would never have caught Webber without Webber turning the wick down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
953 Posts
According to Ross Brawn, Hamilton was driving a pace they asked of him and could go faster as well. They said for fuel preservation.

Hamilton said he felt bad because Nico was faster and certainly would have/should have passed him. It is a bit different because Vettel would never have caught Webber without Webber turning the wick down.
 
1 - 20 of 317 Posts
Top