[ChrisH]

There are 7 Elise's for sale on eBay right now, and only one of them has a valid bid. All seem to be asking for about $5K to $7K over MSRP. Is this the real sign that the market is cooling?

And, the one that has the valid bid is the ugliest one, IMHO. Green exterior with red interior? You have to be kidding! Oh, wait, IT IS A CHRISTMAS PRESENT! It must be that time of year.

 

[LOTUS 5]

Did you notice that the one seller, Mulder1143, has his car listed twice? I emailed him and he said one listing was an accident, he meant to put it in Ebay Motors. About $80 to sell it in Ebay Motors and closer to $800 if it sells in Ebay. He also hasn't done the first service yet and has not had the ECU run. I would be interested in seeing what that says when it is run, possibly like buying a demo.
I am still on list at Fox Valley but am getting older so I purchased the Artic Silver Elise that was selling earlier on Ebay, with 79 miles on it. It was #17 at Fox Valley and he got it Sep 1st. I got it Oct 1st. We are really enjoying the ride so far. Good luck to the rest of you.

 

[zvezdah1]

I wonder how many of these cars for sale on ebay are by people trying to make a quick buck and how many are people that find the car is too harsh for them>
Chris

 

[bboersma]

I would think any "speculators" who have non-refundable deposits should be seriously considering dropping off list very soon as large profits flipping don't appear to be happening.

 

[LNZ_YELO]

Personally, I don't think Ebay is a valid indicator for the Elise or for any other car right now. I've run 3 ads recently (2 for an SLK32 and one for a highly modded Audi TT) and none of them received bids anywhere near what we ended up selling for. Hell, none of them even brought bids near what dealers would give us on a trade!

I just don't think there are many serious buyers on Ebay these days.

 

[LOTUS 5]

I forgot to mention that the original owner had waited appx. three years to get his car. He didn't realize how small the footbox would be and wore size 13 shoes. He just couldn't make the car work for him, and decided to let it go. I am pretty sure that deciding to let it go was a hard decision for him, but it did work out for me. Bob.

 

[evomind]

i had just told my wife about the cars on ebay without any bids...then i saw this post.....
i think there are a few factors at work here....
when i first drove this car about 3 months ago, i loved it. the second thing i said to the salesman was "this car isnt for everybody....you'll see a lot of people buying these and selling them in the first 6 months, or a lot of people who are on lists deciding they dont want the car..." well, the salesman thought i was nuts, and so did many people on this board when i suggested that 2 months ago.
well low and behold, look whats happening....6 cars on ebay at once?? a car in such limited quantities, brand new, and there are 6 on ebay?? hmmmmm.
well, i remember when a guy was trying to sell his place in line on ebay and he he got like 1 or 2 bids or something....he posted asking why people werent interested.....this boards general consensus was that it was because he didnt have an "actual" car to sell. now we are seeing "actual" cars for sale not selling for 5k-7k over....
i had my evo on ebay for 3 weeks without a bid....but its a modified USED car...i have people flying in to see it, but they wouldnt bid on a MODIFIED USED car sight unseen. neither would i. i dont think thats the case with the lotus...even though its technically used, its basically brand new with a warranty. so the consumer isnt really dealing with an unknown product here like with my evo.
about 3 weeks ago, i was at my dealer when some guy and his wife were picking up their car. they were middle aged, late 40's to maybe early 50's. the wife was a typical woman for her age bracket, slightly overweight, etc....it was painful to watch her trying to "gumby" her way out of that car.
i told my salesman that guy will be selling next spring...he looked at me in shock...."why??" he asked......because his wife hates it. he'll never drive that car....my salesman said, "hes a doctor, the money is nothing to him..." i said regardless, his wife hates it and he'll never drive it....most people in that situation sell...(my salesman collects cars. he keeps many of them in storage garages, so i realize my point may have been lost on him.)
another factor is time of the year....a lot of people figure they will wait through winter till they buy he car.
i said all along...after the hardcore lotus elise fanatics get their cars, a lot of this supply/demand craze will subside...not end, but wane...
lets face it.....for most of us the lotus is a vey demanding 50k dollar toy.
my only question is will the market pick back up in the spring??
i think it will a bit, then taper off again....we'll see.

sorry for the long post

 

[zvezdah1]

evo,
I think a lot of the cars on ebay are people still hoping they can get over MSRP for it, consequently they've got reserve prices or starting bids higher than they bought the car for which isn't indicative of someone desperately trying to sell it.

I don't think anyone has ever debated this is a niche car. Certainly not for everyone, but in the relatively small numbers coming here, doesn't really have to. As I posted in other thread, if the over MSRP market is dead why are dealers still selling the cars at over MSRP??

My experience of selling vehicles on ebay over the years, you'll usually end up selling a vehicle for less than if your willing to wait a month or two, it's that instant gratification thing.

Who cares if the market picks up next season, we're not talking pork bellies or soybean futures here. If someone wants the car buy it. I'm just as happy when the speculators get cut off at the knees so the cars can go to the people that care at MSRP.


Chris

 

[OneFastLotus]

I sold my mini THROUGH ebay not on ebay.

I placed the damn auction and had 100 people watching my auction and had about 40 emails but noone wanted to bid. They all wanted to make deals on the side.

 

[LNZ_YELO]

I sold my mini THROUGH ebay not on ebay.

I placed the damn auction and had 100 people watching my auction and had about 40 emails but noone wanted to bid. They all wanted to make deals on the side.

Agree with you there. I've sold a number of cars via the exposure of Ebay, but only one (four years ago) actually ON Ebay. My cars always were sold outside of the auction. (Which is why I'm still getting emails asking me if the 32 and the TT are for sale even after the auctions have closed.)

So, if anyone used my closed auctions to see what the cars actually were 'worth' they'd be off by thousands.

Ellen

 

[evomind]

i agree about the bids on ebay...many people bid off ebay.
zvezdah1-
my underlying point is that everyone thinks there is HUGE demand and very little supply....i suggest otherwise....if someone wants the car, they can have one tomorrow....theres 6 on ebay and at least one or two for sale off this board....
im not saying supply is abundant, but theyre there, and on the other side of that, as i predicted.....many people will sell etc, and demand is starting to wane now that most of the elise fanatics have their car....
the dealerships will always get more for a car than anyone else....the guy making 300k a year isnt going on ebay to try negotiate down for his best price, then after saving a few bucks he has to take time off work to travel to get the car, etc etc....he goes to a dealership and buys it and drives away....

 

[Miguel]

I agree with evo, out of 300 cars or so that are in the US there is been between 5-10% of them auctioned if not more.

I told a while back that a lot of people were going to be very afraid on driving them on the highways because it will be intimidating for a lot of people.

This car is not for everyone. it's a driver car and last time you looked around in traffic, how many drivers have you seen around? they look more like passengers totally unaware of their surroundings talking on the phone, reading a report, trimmng their nose hairs, applying make up, making a right turn from the left lane on a two lane road ...

All those peoples will get killed in an instant and the ones that are not so bad as drivers will get killed by those people. In a car like ours it becomes even more apparent how bad most drivers are out there and that is going to scare a bunch of elise waiters that don't know what they are getting into.

 

[zvezdah1]

Good points Miguel,
BTW, when will you be getting first hand experience at the "us vs. them" driving of the elise vs. everything else? Next week I think you said?
Chris

 

[Miguel]

Ha!

Well, I do get my car today, I hope you were not implying anything indirectly by that statement.

Because if you think the roads and highways are dangerous here, you gotta go drive in Spain.

We are way polite drivers over here compared to european drivers. I'm just well adjusted to driving here and when I go back to visit I have to flip the switch to the ultra defensive driving mode.

And if you really want to grow some hair in your chest, then drive a motorcycle in Spain.

For comparison, it's like it was in New York in the 80's but a whole country worth of that type of agressive driving.

 

[rob]

Ha!

Because if you think the roads and highways are dangerous here, you gotta go drive in Spain.

For comparison, it's like it was in New York in the 80's but a whole country worth of that type of agressive driving.

I wrecked a rental car in Spain this way last year - aggressive drivers, uncontrolled and unposted intersections.

I have noticed that New York is as easy to drive in as DC is now. More predictable in some ways.

 

[zvezdah1]

HI Miguel,
I found the exact opposite on a weeks ride on a motorcycle in Italy last year. The driver actually paid attention to the road, very courteous and had no complaints.

That said, I have heard Spain has some of the worst drivers in Europe

Chris
Congrats that your car's finally arriving.

 

[smoseley]

I bought my latest vehicle on ebay

 

[masheen]

I wonder how many of these cars for sale on ebay are by people trying to make a quick buck and how many are people that find the car is too harsh for them>
Chris

so am i.

 

[masheen]

HI Miguel,
I found the exact opposite on a weeks ride on a motorcycle in Italy last year. The driver actually paid attention to the road, very courteous and had no complaints.

That said, I have heard Spain has some of the worst drivers in Europe

Chris
Congrats that your car's finally arriving.

this may be getting off topic, but i find it intereseting:

"bad driver" is ambiguous. and that's why i don't like its use.

bad driver can be used to refer to someone who lacks sufficient ability to control a car, even though he may be trying his best to respect the rules, common sense, share the road, etc.

bad driver is also used to refer to someone who is apparently incosiderate, selfish, rule-breaking, etc, but who nonetheless may possess and excercise great car control, and equally importanty, a great judgment in assessing acceptable risks.

since these two types sometimes appear similar in observation and sometimes (which is too often of course) lead to the similar disastreous consequence, why should we care about the distinction?

in attempt to be brief, let's say because "the spanish kind" of bad driving leads to racing wins, while "the other kind" (trying not to pick on any particular group) doesn't.

no, i am not condoning overly risky driving. i am just tying to highlight the distinction. i am motivated to do so partly because i could argue that the first kind of bad drivers i mentioned is "worse" than the second kind in their potential to create accidents. and also because i consider it an unfair insult to call the second kind with the same term used for the first kind.

i also want to admit that the culture of bad driving, of either kind, spain being one example, will, in gross terms, be equally detrimental to road safety. and thus should not be favoured. however, an individual bad driver of the second kind, or a small percentage of them, in an otherwise "good" driving culture, does not necessarily pose a significant risk.

maybe i should also reveal that many of those who share the road with me would consider me a bad driver of the second kind. i would, of course, argue that they are only insignificantly more endangered with my presence on the road, and thus should not call me bad. or even further, i could suggest that they learn to enjoy driving, since then they would appreciate my enrichment of their driving experiences, but i don't, since that could lead to the culture of bad driving, dangerous no matter what kind of bad it is.

 

[ekological]

Ebay is a strange animal. If you start the auction at a price close to what you would take, you'll get very few bids if any at all. When I first listed the Elise on ebay, I wanted to get close to what I paid for it after taxes since I didn't want to pay tax twice. I got one bid...big whoopie. The second time I listed the car, I started the auction at 20k. People seem to have this bidding war mentality and will not bid on an item priced high with few bids. Very strange. Within 3 days of a 7 day auction, the car was already up to $43,xxx. The auction had more hits, more watchers, more everything. The first time around, I would have accepted $46,500 for the car and would have eaten a few hundred. The second time around, I set the reserve at 48k not knowing that ebay motors charges a $40 listing fee and a flat rate of $40 additional if your car sells. When I listed the car, you can click on fees and it gave the standard percentages...1.5% of whatever over $1000 or something like that. So I thought, "Hmmm...almost $1000 to sell on ebay" and adjusted my reserve accordingly. I figured if someone hit the reserve, then I wouldn't mind paying the assumed high fee. Someone did hit the reserve price and to my surprise, I was only charged $80 in total...:clap:

But the key thing is the bidding war mentality and pricing the item "right" initially. I once had a pair of oakley sunglasses that I never wore...bought it, didn't really like it, too lazy to return. So I put it up on ebay a year later. I think I paid $70 for them and started the auction at $50. No bites. I then started the auction at $1 with a reserve at $50. The second auction ended at something like $63. Go figure....

O...and I didn't sell to make a quick buck. I sold to get a color I liked more and to get the hard top since buying one after the fact is supposedly more than $2000.